View Full Version : Car starting issue
burfadel
21-01-2014, 05:09 PM
Just over half an hour ago I went to start the car. I turned the key, and sounded like it was just about to turn over so I let go. What I mean is how you normally start the car, it was all of a second at most. It didn't start though. So, I turned the key again, the engine was turning over just like any car does before it starts, but it didn't start. It didn't even try to! I moved the gear lever and tried again, but it didn't work.
So I thought crap! (or words to that effect). I left it a minute and tried again, it still didn't start. So, I proceeded to check the fuses, and all of them were okay. I then thought I might as well try one last time before cracking the sh!ts a bit more (as you do!), and it started straight away! I left it to run for probably 10 seconds, turned it off, waited for a few seconds, turned it back on, started straight away! (engine sounds nice and smooth too of course). I did this one last time and it worked again!
So, my question is, why would the car almost start, then not start, but start again after the fuses have been removed for checking and put back in? It's probably worse not having a clue what the issue is, because I don't want it happening when I'm out somewhere.
Ensoniq5
21-01-2014, 06:34 PM
Sounds like a weak battery or loose/dirty terminals. If the battery voltage is below a certain level post-starting the ECU will kill the ignition. After letting it sit for a bit while you checked the fuses the battery may have 'regrouped' as they tend to, allowing it to start the second time. I'd check battery age and terminal condition first.
burfadel
21-01-2014, 09:25 PM
There isn't any hesitation when I turn the key, nor is the starting noise slow. It starts quite quickly usually, often instantly when I flick the key over. I was thinking a bit more about it, when I checked the fuses inside the engine bay, I did wiggle one of the relays a bit. It was the lowermost one in the middle of the fuse box, I'll check the description tomorrow. If this were faulty could that cause the issue? How much are they to replace?
burfadel
22-01-2014, 04:51 AM
Tried it again just then, multiple starts. Each time it started fine! I took it for a short drive around the block (wasn't game to take it too far) and it was running perfectly, so I really don't know what it could have been! On a side note, what does the 'Engine Control' fuse operate, the one that is 20 Amp? Come to think of it the plug bits on that looked a bit different to the other fuses, maybe it was corrosion? It wasn't blown though, but if they weren't perfectly (uncorroded), I'm guessing that could have caused it as a result of an improper connection? Why would those be corroded slightly and not the other fuses? I should point out that it's the original fuse, so I will probably just replace it. It's quite literally the only thing I can think that could have caused it.
RonRabbit99
22-01-2014, 05:10 AM
I'd still clean battery terminals as suggested above.
On a side note, what does the 'Engine Control' fuse operate, the one that is 20 Amp?
Would that be the Engine Control Unit? (ECU)
burfadel
22-01-2014, 10:48 AM
The ECU fuse is separate, from memory that was a 10 Amp.
Ensoniq5
22-01-2014, 05:52 PM
The circuit diagram is a bit confusing re that 20amp fuse, but from what I can tell it powers a bunch of things engine-management and/or auto tranny related. If it is dodgy it could be the cause, definitely worth cleaning up the contacts and replacing the fuse and having a good check of your plugs and relays in the area you fiddled with after the first failure. If the problem keeps happening I'd definitely check the battery (slow cranking is not always apparent in a battery that's failing, particularly if your tune is good and your engine fires up quickly), it's quite a common problem and the battery or terminals is very often the culprit.
burfadel
22-01-2014, 07:33 PM
I checked the battery terminals and they are clean, but I did clean them again just to make sure. The battery is a few years old, so I guess that could be the cause. I just don't want to be replacing the battery if that's not the issue, especially since I will be changing the car over at some stage (probably next year).
Any idea which fuse the ignition coil runs through? I was thinking that the Engine Control fuse may run that. Improper connection = no spark.
Mcada
22-01-2014, 07:49 PM
Bad batch of fuel maybe?
burfadel
22-01-2014, 08:10 PM
It could be dodgy fuel I guess! I do have a 1L bottle of Flashlube Injector cleaner (the blue/green coloured one, not the yellow valve saver fluid) that I haven't starting using yet, I'll add some of that over the next few tanks and see how it goes.
http://www.flashlube.com/en/products/injector-cleaner.html
When I went away before Christmas I was running E10 which I don't normally, I guess it could have dislodged some gunk in the system. I then refilled with E10 on the way back. I have heard it can do that as the ethanol acts like a solvent? On the plus side though I did get 8.2L/100 KM with the air conditioner on, luggage, and passengers, so I was quite happy about that considering it was E10.
Ensoniq5
22-01-2014, 08:18 PM
The coil gets its power primarily through the 30A fusible link. The EC fuse (fuse 15 in the relay box I believe) appears to power much of the engine management system, such as the crank angle and top-dead-centre sensors via the engine control relay, and appears to also power the injectors, so I would expect a problem with this fuse would prevent the engine from running.
WytWun
22-01-2014, 08:41 PM
On a side note, what does the 'Engine Control' fuse operate, the one that is 20 Amp?
Fuse 15? All the bits that actually allow the engine to run (crank angle sensor, injectors, dizzy amongst other things).
burfadel
22-01-2014, 09:03 PM
Fuse 15? All the bits that actually allow the engine to run (crank angle sensor, injectors, dizzy amongst other things).
Fuse 15, that's the one! So the coil does run through it? Just trying to work out why the points on it were more more corroded.
WytWun
23-01-2014, 06:54 PM
Fuse 15, that's the one! So the coil does run through it? Just trying to work out why the points on it were more more corroded.
Hmmm... that's not clear from the diagram in the Ellery manual I was looking at :( it just shows a red wire going into the "distributor assembly" from that fuse (via the main engine relay). The another diagram shows the coil connected to the ignition switch via a junction box link... If you can I'd check the circuit diagrams in the downloadable manual to confirm.
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