Even with new o2 sensor, cleaning all injectors, cylinders and intake i'm only getting ~450km to a tank before reserve around town (~14.3L/100km) and about 10L/100km on the highway give or take .5L. Using most of the power off the lights but taking it easy on 60-80kph sections. Maybe some people are sniffing too much unicorn dust and quoting highly optimistic figures, or maybe thats about normal. Either way i'm thinking of what I can do to get some more ponies AND better fuel economy. Not just one

Question is, is it worth doing anything to it?
Car is a KF Ei Verada and currently completely stock with some factory options, but nothing to affect the power output. Would it be worth getting a tune or replacing any bits n pieces (injectors? extractors? etc)

Even with new o2 sensor, cleaning all injectors, cylinders and intake i'm only getting ~450km to a tank before reserve around town (~14.3L/100km) and about 10L/100km on the highway give or take .5L. Using most of the power off the lights but taking it easy on 60-80kph sections. Maybe some people are sniffing too much unicorn dust and quoting highly optimistic figures, or maybe thats about normal. Either way i'm thinking of what I can do to get some more ponies AND better fuel economy. Not just one

Question is, is it worth doing anything to it?
Car is a KF Ei Verada and currently completely stock with some factory options, but nothing to affect the power output. Would it be worth getting a tune or replacing any bits n pieces (injectors? extractors? etc)

If you are after better economy the best mod you can get a lighter right foot.
The only mods that may have a positive effect on both is a 2.5" cat-back system with a freer flowing muffler, such as an aftermarket one or one from a VRX. Other than that, maintenance.
Performance and economy are not normally found in the same circles in third gens.

Headers would provide more torque down low for better economy, and power throughout, Though I'd mainly look at the performance improvements, as the investment for better economy would take a while to pay them off, but they will help economy all the same... ( HM Headers are pretty popular) They have 1001 threads on them...

I'm wondering if a tune would be worthwhile. On one hand more power per unit of fuel means you need less of it to go the same distance or maintain the same speed. On the other the stock mapping may very well be as efficient as it can really be with the stock parts?

I live up north and the humidity here is almost never below 70%, often higher. Is that likely to drop economy? I know a friend with a Forester who indeed uses quite a bit more fuel here than in Sydney and I suspect humidity and potentially atmospheric pressure could be to blame (though doesn't EFI compensate for pressure?). Again, not sure if a tune would improve that. Or if its simply a drop in economy across the board

Even with new o2 sensor, cleaning all injectors, cylinders and intake i'm only getting ~450km to a tank before reserve around town (~14.3L/100km) and about 10L/100km on the highway give or take .5L. Using most of the power off the lights but taking it easy on 60-80kph sections. Maybe some people are sniffing too much unicorn dust and quoting highly optimistic figures, or maybe thats about normal. Either way i'm thinking of what I can do to get some more ponies AND better fuel economy. Not just one

Question is, is it worth doing anything to it?
Car is a KF Ei Verada and currently completely stock with some factory options, but nothing to affect the power output. Would it be worth getting a tune or replacing any bits n pieces (injectors? extractors? etc)

Hi, I'm a noob here ( only picked my TH ES up on Friday ) and I don't know how accurate the trip meter is, but I reset it on Saturday, and it's down to around 13l /100 with a mixture of 50/50 hwy/city and still dropping. It would want to, I get 11.5 out of my EL Futura with 212k on it. I'd say your driving style is having an effect, if your flooring it at the lights and hitting the brakes hard when slowing down for lights etc. I find this car has scads of power in reserve at cruising speeds, say 60kph upwards and I'm really impressed with the way the engine/ trans work together. It seems to hang on in first a bit long though, sometimes up to around 2700rpm. but anyway if I can get 11/12 combined I'll be pretty happy :)

I'm wondering if a tune would be worthwhile. On one hand more power per unit of fuel means you need less of it to go the same distance or maintain the same speed. On the other the stock mapping may very well be as efficient as it can really be with the stock parts?

I live up north and the humidity here is almost never below 70%, often higher. Is that likely to drop economy? I know a friend with a Forester who indeed uses quite a bit more fuel here than in Sydney and I suspect humidity and potentially atmospheric pressure could be to blame (though doesn't EFI compensate for pressure?). Again, not sure if a tune would improve that. Or if its simply a drop in economy across the board

stock tunes have a very, very wide range of things to cover. by having your car tuned for the environment it will be in the most, you'll get better performance out of it by eliminating a tune designed to cope with freezing, heat waves and everything in between. most tunes are done to improve power, but you could always chat to a tune shop and find out if they're able to work out the best fuel economy without sacrificing much power. you'll never achieve both as nobody has managed to have their cake and eat it, too.

Your ecu should start to react better to your driving style given time.
There is even an transmission reset procedure, out of a workshop manual or factory release paper. But I'd say you are nearly there any way. Trouble with a lot of mods, they are best at high RPM which kills the economy.

LPG and headers were a great combo for torque. But I got in years ago.

There is a little box that you can add for about 40-60 bucks that could make a real difference. Pretty tempted to try it too... :flamesuit:

There is a little box that you can add for about 40-60 bucks that could make a real difference. Pretty tempted to try it too... :flamesuit:

Oh Marty... :facepalm

Just be fair, it should affect available power, and improve economy.... Truly, should work!

I'd have to request the help of the local brains to pull this chip thing off, but it seems to make sense, if you get that extra HP that the AC usually uses, and saving you fuel by it running when coasting/cruising.. Some real figures in testing would have been nice....
Linky (http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_110710/article.html)

Could work for the Track Day enthusiast as well.....

would different / newer injectors with a better spray pattern help?

Could it be something left of field like a sticking brake?

But, a catback exhaust is probably the best first step. I only did it a month ago, and was impressed over my Sunshine sports exhaust.

I'd have to request the help of the local brains to pull this chip thing off, but it seems to make sense, if you get that extra HP that the AC usually uses, and saving you fuel by it running when coasting/cruising.. Some real figures in testing would have been nice....
Linky (http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_110710/article.html)

Could work for the Track Day enthusiast as well.....

I have sent you a message on Facebook mate. Very interested. In theory it should work. However, i have herd when you go WOT, the compressor switches off?? Either way? Im interested, can feel the load the ac puts on the motor when cruising along at 60km

Regarding tuning.
You can do it at home pretty easily.
Most of the systems on the magna (and most modern efi cars) cant be 'tuned' they are factory set.
First off, check that your air filter is clean, replace it if its really dirty. I would recommend a KN filter if you can spare the coin. its expensive at first but once you have cleaned it out 2-3 times its usually paid itself off.
You can also run a fuel system cleaner and upper cylinder cleaner through the engine, however you may have some benefit removing the injectors and getting a workshop to service them fully.
Best to change your fuel filter at that time too.

Check your plugs, make sure they aren't real old and crappy. http://www.mudinmyblood.net/forum/images/reading_spark_plugs.jpg (plug chart)
Note that you cant really set the gap or clean Platinums/iridiums, but the deposits found on the plug will still be applicable to the chart.

Check the leads for signs of cross firing, it can look like a white scorch mark if present, or sometimes on a dark night you can see the arcing with the engine running (it will be accompanied by a rough idle/stumble)
Note that the magnas do have a bit of a stumble in the idle from factory, nothing can be done about that...
You can check the distributor cap and rotor as well, usually the tips get corroded over time and need periodic replacement.

Check your exhaust for blockages, jack the car up and give the mufflers and cat a good solid hit with your hand, it should make a dull thud sound. there shouldn't be any rattling or loose noises at all.
If there is, make sure its not rocks in the heat shields first...

Pump your tyres up!!!! reduce your rolling resistance to increase your overall economy. note that big wide wheels with sticky tyres will increase your rolling resistance, but they grip and look cool, so its a compromise.
Check your tyre placard for the pressure settings. Personally i run 38psi in all 4 tyres.
Make sure the car free rolls easily, when you are driving somewhere SAFE, turn off your stereo wind down your window and put the car in neutral. coast along at about 50-60kph and listen for noises.
There shouldn't be any humming, squeaking ect and the vehicle should very slowly slow down, almost unnoticeable...
If there is squeaking, check the brake pads to make sure they are retracting properly. check the handbrake shoes to make sure they are retracting as well.
Do this by taking the wheels off, spin the brake rotor by hand, apply the break and release, then try to spin the rotor by hand again.
If its dragging, it'll feel heavier than the first time.
Same goes with the handbrake.
If your car pulls to one side, get a wheel alignment.

Lastly, drive like you have eggshells under the accelerator pedal.
All your driving should be as smooth as possible, think about it as if you are driving a limo with royalty in the back, you wouldn't want to accelerate/break/turn sharply and have they spill their drinks would you?

If you take all that on board, then combine that with recording your kms on your fuel receipts each time you fill up, you'll be able to build a very accurate economy average.
Each time you fill up, write the kms on your trip meter on the fuel receipt. reset your trip meter and continue.
I have an excel spreadsheet i plug all my fuel readings into, it gives me a average for each fill and a running average, its pretty simple to make.

Yesterday was the first time I ever felt the fuel economy was acceptable, not fantastic but not too bad
Did a full tank of fuel in 1 go and when I fueled up calculated 10.81KM/L or 9.25L/100km with 38psi (normally run 36 anyway)
Vast majority of highway with cruise control on, and a few spirited overtakes. So I could imagine 8.5L/100km if I didn't bother overtaking. Probably 8 if it was flat and I went off the speedo, which is not accurate if no one else has noticed. 110kph indicated is actually 104kph on mine

The only thing i've changed is a wheel arch. I noticed mine had come loose and was flapping around, probably not great for economy
I do need to do an alignment and balance, there is a very slight shake at 110 and yes it does pull slightly to the left. Brakes not sure, can just spin the front hubs with 1 hand, but i'm not sure if thats normal for cars. Compared to a motorbike wheel it certainly felt very stiff

Air filter looks fairly clean, barely a difference between front and rear of it
Have run fuel and injector cleaners through more than once in the past 6000km. Have used upper engine cleaner in the intake, as well as directly into the front 3 cylinders which smoothed the idle which was never that bad to begin with. Its now so good you have to concentrate to feel it, and yes i'm aware they are all a bit rough on idle. Otherwise perfectly smooth everywhere else and right through the revs.
All plugs were replaced 10,000km ago (RC10PYP4 rear and RC10YCC4 front), along with blow-by hose, rocker gaskets and tube seals, timing belt, tensioner, water pump.

I would recommend a KN filter if you can spare the coin. its expensive at first but once you have cleaned it out 2-3 times its usually paid itself off.
Waste of money IMHO. KN filters don't filter the air anywhere near as well as a stock Magna filter, thereby shortening engine life, and there's no evidence they do anything positive for either power or fuel economy on a Magna.

Pump your tyres up!!!! reduce your rolling resistance to increase your overall economy. ... Check your tyre placard for the pressure settings.
You should not over-inflate them, though, as that reduces traction, which you need for both cornering and braking - especially in the wet. The placard pressures aren't particularly relevant for anything other than the OEM tyres.

Do be aware, too, that some petrol stations have dodgy fuel metering. Interesting when the station's fuel pump says you've just added a few litres more fuel to your (not empty) tank than it holds... I've done quite a lot a long-distance driving and have found that fuel pumps at some rural service stations along the way have said I'd used rather more fuel than the car's own computer indicated, but others, especially in the larger towns & cities, pretty much agreed with the car's computer, as is the case also for my regular around-town driving.

I don't have a trip computer in mine unfortunately. Now there's question, whats required to fit one to a KF or is it more hassle than its worth?

But I do find that if I wait until reserve is steadily on whilst driving on a flat surface (ignoring that it comes on and off on hills, accelerating/decelerating, or standing still) then when I go to fill up in the next few km it's always pretty much 63L give or take half

Waste of money IMHO. KN filters don't filter the air anywhere near as well as a stock Magna filter, thereby shortening engine life, and there's no evidence they do anything positive for either power or fuel economy on a Magna.

Its interesting if you read that exactly as you have worded it, because if you do, you are correct in saying a cloth style filter doesnt filter as well as a stock paper filter.
That is 100% correct. however, given the compromise of reducing the filtration a bit, you get less resistance to the air flowing through the filter, increasing the potential airflow to the engine.
This allows the engine to breathe easier, making more potential power at higher rpm and a touch more power at lower rpm.
As i also stated, the cost benefit is quite good, as the $90 K&N filter will pay itself off after you have replaced the standard paper filter 3 times (assuming a Ryco $35 filter is used)
not recommended for dusty environments though...
As for a specific study on a magna with a K&N filter, there likely isnt one, there are however plenty of other real world example of cars getting a power/breathing improvement from a cloth filter upgrade, including before and after dyno runs.




You should not over-inflate them, though, as that reduces traction, which you need for both cornering and braking - especially in the wet. The placard pressures aren't particularly relevant for anything other than the OEM tyres.

Very good point, i should have added that.
It was more mentioned because a lot of people dont think about their tyres, they go flat slowly over time.
Once the air pressure drops to high 20's (psi) or lower, you start to notice a BIG increase in rolling resistance.
If your car is light enough (many small cars) you wont even notice an appreciable 'flat' looking tyre till you get to the low 20's

As for a specific study on a magna with a K&N filter, there likely isnt one, there are however plenty of other real world example of cars getting a power/breathing improvement from a cloth filter upgrade, including before and after dyno runs.
There are enough dyno charts on this forum alone that show no appreciable performance improvement - and even degradations - with those filters. Compare, for example, posts 9 & 11 (KN filter) vs posts 12 & 19 (std filter) on otherwise similarly-spec'd cars at: http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71053. And don't forget the little matter of all the filth the KN filters let through...

I don't have a trip computer in mine unfortunately. Now there's question, whats required to fit one to a KF or is it more hassle than its worth?

Dash out job, you'll need a upper dash loom, trip computer and cluster to suit from a later TH/KH-on model and you'll need to tap into injector pulse and oxygen sensor wires on engine loom.

around town (~14.3L/100km) and about 10L/100km on the highway give or take .5L. Using most of the power off the lights but taking it easy on 60-80kph sections.


Figures sound about right. I've had 7.7 L/100Km on a 300 km country drive, sticking to the speed limit and sitting patiently behind slower cars.


If you are after better economy the best mod you can get a lighter right foot.
Performance and economy are not normally found in the same circles in third gens.

+1 on what he said.
The V6 has a lot of internal friction compared to modern engines, and uses a lot of fuel when warming up, do lots of short trips around town in winter and it's easy to drop economy down to 15 -16 L/100km.
Current crop of Mitsu engines are mostly 4 cylinders designed for low friction. The 2.0L MIVEC motor in the Lancer puts out close to 100 Kw, will do less than 10L/100 km around town taking it easy and about 6-7 L/100 km on the open road. Same engine is in larger/heavier models, I imagine "spirited overtaking" wouldn't feel as good. lol

I never gave smaller engines much credit, yes they can make horsepower but I figured the torque's rubbish and the fuel economy would be too if you start bringing out the horsepower
A friends suburu forester changed my opinion on that, its what 2.5L? 4cyl, uses a good 50% less fuel than me and makes 300hp at the wheels and its AWD, not fair....
But then his costs a heap more to get to that stage and is far less reliable so there is that...

Still, i'm not overly impressed with the 3.5L engine. Yes its incredibly smooth which is great, and it sounds quite good. But both power and economy are pretty rubbish, and they are notorious for leaking so...

...and they are notorious for leaking so...

Any engine will be prone to leaks if maintenance is not kept up (don't mistake this for scheduled maintenance, two entirely different things). The last of the 6G74 Magnas are nine years old, any engine of that vintage or older can be expected to develop leaks.
Mine is now twelve years old, I fixed what needed fixing (distributor seal, thrust cap seal, rocker cover gaskets, spark plug tube seals - and cam/crank seals as precautionary measure when replacing timing belt) and I haven't had any issues since.

It sounds like your issue is not based on any inherent failings of the 6G# engine, but rather your unrealistic expectations of a large family vehicle whose engine has roots in the 80s (as most large Australian vehicles of its era had).
Perhaps you should have researched your vehicle purchase better and bought something more in line to your requirements

The third gen V6 is getting old, but it is better - fuel and reliability wise - than the 12 valve 3.0L that came before it, and the 2.6L, 2.0L, 1.8L 4 cylinder balance shaft engines of the Sigma and the boat anchors they put in the Galant before that.
It's called progress. Not unique to Mitsu. Comparing a modern engine with the 24 valve V6 shows how much engine advancement there has been in that time interval.

If you are not happy with the Magna engine, look at modern hot hatch Euro cars or current Japanese and Korean cars. Lots of power, little petrol. lol

Still, i'm not overly impressed with the 3.5L engine. ... But both power and economy are pretty rubbish, and they are notorious for leaking so...
What, exactly, do you suppose a 9-18y.o. 3.5l engine pushing a 1.5-1.7 tonne vehicle should deliver in terms of both power & economy? As for "they are notorious for leaking", where did you get that notion from?

It sounds like your issue is not based on any inherent failings of the 6G# engine, but rather your unrealistic expectations of a large family vehicle whose engine has roots in the 80s (as most large Australian vehicles of its era were).
Perhaps you should have researched your vehicle purchase better and bought something more in line to your requirements

The thing is, you simply cannot buy a car in as such good condition, so comfortable, and so well equipped for under $5k reliably. There are a few gems, but every magna/verada goes for under that regardless of condition. I like the prelude's and perhaps would have got one, but a really good example 4th gen is closer to $8k or more

I'm happy with everything except the economy for its amount of power. And they don't seem to respond well to basic bolt-on's either. Doesn't seem like many are pushing more than 200rwhp even with a few grand of mods. I'd have thought a supercharger alone should push it above that. Oh well, it is what it is. And i'll be keeping for a long time yet
But if I could economically swap the engine for a much punchier turbo 2.0L or 2.5L 4cyl, I would. Far more punch and far better economy

But if I could economically swap the engine for a much punchier turbo 2.0L or 2.5L 4cyl, I would. Far more punch and far better economy

We all have our little daydreams. lol

PS Took the 2011 Lancer for a 30 km suburban shopping run today, with aircon on. Got 7.2L /100 km. Feel free to be jealous.

What, exactly, do you suppose a 9-18y.o. 3.5l engine pushing a 1.5-1.7 tonne vehicle should deliver in terms of both power & economy? As for "they are notorious for leaking", where did you get that notion from?

every second thread on here mentions a leak :ninja:

Doesn't seem like many are pushing more than 200rwhp even with a few grand of mods

Rwhp? The Magna is a front wheel drive...

And putting a supercharger on a 3.5 will get you well over 200fwhp (or do you mean fwkw?)

Rwhp? The Magna is a front wheel drive...

That explains why there's so little power going to the rear wheels then :D

That explains why there's so little power going to the rear wheels then :D

That's a design feature instigated by Mitsu, who noted that Holden and Ford drivers were putting up with massive rear tyre wear and smoke. They tried to do the same to the front wheels, again to minimise tyre wear, but they ran into drivability problems . . . .

Taking it easy I can get 7.5L/100k on the highway (flat roads@110km.h, some overtaking) and 10.5L/100k in suburban driving. Being so smooth you don't realise how hard you are pushing the engine and that can increase your fuel consumption a lot. The leaks are relativley easy to fix (rocker cover gasket, dist. seal etc), better than doing rear main oil seals or sump gaskets.

every second thread on here mentions a leak :ninja:

Despite your exaggeration, it may possibly because the current owners inherit the results of the previous owner's misgivings toward maintenance, or they themselves have let maintenance issues accumulate.
Don't forget also that those who are members of this forum represent only a very small number of Magna owners in total, and the amount of issues presenting on forum will undoubtedly be bias toward the negative, as with any forum or advice site.

every second thread on here mentions a leak
Yeah, right (not).