So I sold the TS wagon we had to a car yard. The engine oil had gone white and there was white froth on the underside of the oil cap. Head or head gasket. Goodbye dear old wagon...she'd reached 250,000km mostly fault-free. I got $500 bucks for her.

Anyway...I bought a TJ Solara a bit "younger" in age than our original Solara (pictured in my AV). The original was a series one TJ Solara with the double-din Verada sound system. The "new" one is the series two with the single-din CD player. The new car was bought from a lady I know and, as far as I know, the servicing had been done to the book specs. It's got 120,000km on it, new tyres, spotless paintwork and interior.

The roadworthy cost me a bomb (as I'd volunteered to do this for the lady) as the car needed the obligatory new windscreen, new exhaust centre section...etc... When I picked it up from the roadworthy place she'd chosen the guys there told me that the car was good...might need a transmission flush ("We'll charge you $480 for that if you want it.") but that all else was well. $800 for the roadworthy! Sheesh!

Well and good. I get the car home...Missus loves it...loves the colour ("Molten Red") and the car drives well...trans is smooth...so is the engine BUT there's a slight harshness in the acceleration growl which I put down to the exhaust bedding in and sooting up.

Next morning I start the car and I hear this slight rhythmic knocking. I open the bonnet and it seems to be coming from the belt area. I knew it wasn't the lifters...different, deeper sound. Anyway. I drove the car around and within a few minutes of the car warming up the knock was gone but that harshness in the growl persisted for a good ten minutes.

Over the next few days I notice the same pattern...Noise on a cold start...warm-up, noise abates but the growl remains. So I take it to a mechanic recommended to me by a good friend. He pops the bonnet...has a listen and says, "The tensioner and/or belt is out of whack...the slackness is causing that noise." Shock...horror! The lady I'd bought the car from told me the belt had been done at 90,000 by her son ( a mechanic, she tells me). I asked why the noise was abating after warm-up and the mechanic tells me..."One of those things." So I give him the go-ahead to change the belt, tensioners and the water pump. That's happening this Friday. $750.

So...all up...the car cost me $3300 + $800 + $750 = $4850

Am I nuts or what?

And what about the roadworthy mechanic asking for $480 to flush the transmission?

Arrrggggghhhh! I love Magnas too much!!

Are you sure the noise on cold start is timing belt/hydraulic tensioner?

An improperly tensioned drive belt can cause an awful cold-start noise and "growl" on acceleration that lessens after warming up. I'd be checking that before spending $750 on replacing the timing belt and associated tensioner/pulleys.

Drive Belt Tension (Extract from 3rd Gen Service Manual) (http://www.mediafire.com/view/oclycjzwfh4rbp2/Drive_Belt_Tension.pdf)

Edit: $480 to flush trans is fairly excessive in my opinion. Seems probably double what it should cost, but other members would be better guides on how much it should cost. It's generally a somewhat more expensive job than one might think, purely because of the amount (and price) of Mits SP3 fluid you need to completely flush -- but not worth $480.

Are you sure the noise on cold start is timing belt/hydraulic tensioner?

An improperly tensioned drive belt can cause an awful cold-start noise and "growl" on acceleration that lessens after warming up. I'd be checking that before spending $750 on replacing the timing belt and associated tensioner/pulleys.

Drive Belt Tension (Extract from 3rd Gen Service Manual) (http://www.mediafire.com/view/oclycjzwfh4rbp2/Drive_Belt_Tension.pdf)

Edit: $480 to flush trans is fairly excessive in my opinion. Seems probably double what it should cost, but other members would be better guides on how much it should cost. It's generally a somewhat more expensive job than one might think, purely because of the amount (and price) of Mits SP3 fluid you need to completely flush -- but not worth $480.


Hi Karj,
The mechanic had a good listen to the motor and used a stethoscope around the timing belt shield. He said you could actually hear the noise from the belt. I will tell him about the drive belt tensioning as well. I've printed out the page you linked to...thanks heaps for that.

I dunno... When your Magna is running sweetly all is right in the world but when they start making odd noises!!!!!!

Anyway...thanks for your reply. I hope I am not being dudded out of cold hard cash!

I think you have been over charged on about everything you have listed thus far

The groan is well known and is generally the Power Steering belt too loose or is simply too old. Is as I stated a well known issue.

Noise or Growl will most likely be an aftermarket exhaust system, this is also common when replaced as the aftermarket ones are never anywhere near as good as genuine

Trans flush here is $189 including 12 litres of fluid, more fluid = more cost of course however unless very bad will generally be fine for a standard flush.

IF the timing belt needs doing we charge $688.50 for the complete belt kit fitted INCLUDING new Tensioner, depending on the age of your timing belt (not just mileage) you may only need a tensioner HOWEVER if you are still getting the groan after warm up I doubt this is the case and doubt is even the issue. Only someone who knows these cars can accurately diagnose these noises. If you get the noise, shut down the motor, sit for a few seconds, restart. If the noise is gone is the tensioner.

So...all up...the car cost me $3300 + $800 + $750 = $4850

Am I nuts or what?


9 months ago my KL Cost me Purchase price of $5000, I just got the RWC and that included windscreen, tyres, a few front end bits and bobs, exhaust, brakes and a new seatbelt to clear the srs light all up with reg about $2500 so total $7500 for a KL wagon on LPG with a replacement low kms engine.

No such thing as a cheap car .....

I note from Stroppy's initial post that he had to replace his windsreen for a roadworthy.
I think this is a bit of a try-on by some testers who have links to windscreen shops.
I have had windscreens initially rejected, however, after drawing their attention to Section G, Page 7 of the Roadworthy Requirements (found on VicRoads website under registration-
roadworthiness) they have changed their mind and passed the screens.
In a nutshell the requirements state that chips, stars, bullseyes and cracks (the size oif which are detailed in the abovementioned documentation) within the wipers swept area - are allowable provided that they do not impair the driver's vision to the EXTENT that the vehicle CANNOT be driven safely.
The screen has to be in a pretty bad way not to pass.

I think you have been over charged on about everything you have listed thus far

The groan is well known and is generally the Power Steering belt too loose or is simply too old. Is as I stated a well known issue.

Noise or Growl will most likely be an aftermarket exhaust system, this is also common when replaced as the aftermarket ones are never anywhere near as good as genuine

Trans flush here is $189 including 12 litres of fluid, more fluid = more cost of course however unless very bad will generally be fine for a standard flush.

IF the timing belt needs doing we charge $688.50 for the complete belt kit fitted INCLUDING new Tensioner, depending on the age of your timing belt (not just mileage) you may only need a tensioner HOWEVER if you are still getting the groan after warm up I doubt this is the case and doubt is even the issue. Only someone who knows these cars can accurately diagnose these noises. If you get the noise, shut down the motor, sit for a few seconds, restart. If the noise is gone is the tensioner.

Cheese! Really?

Quotes in my town; Tranny flush - max 12 litres = $480, Timing belt - $900 - $1200. Sh!t, my transmission guy charges me $300 just to drop the oil out and refill it. I'm getting shafted up here!

No such thing as a cheap car .....

I beg to differ... you just described one. $7500 is cheap for a car that offers as much as a KL in good nick.

...Missus loves it...loves the colour

Next morning I start the car and I hear this slight rhythmic knocking.

Am I nuts or what?

And what about the roadworthy mechanic asking for $480 to flush the transmission?

Arrrggggghhhh! I love Magnas too much!!

Point 1 Missus loves it - money well spent...

Point 2 - Sounds like a badly adjusted timing belt tensioner/offset pulley - or one of those cheap ebay tensioners the noise is bad but unlikely to give engine problems.

Point 3 - Flush $ - I got quoted $480 to do my TJ 5 speed by a very reputable local transmission service center - After doing a Claude Greengrass Blink Blink I left in a hurry, nearly worth driving all the way to MadMagna his price is very realistic.

MadMagna...I will be coming to see you from now on but I can't back out of this repair as the car is already at the Mechanic's workshop ready for action tomorrow. The mechanic wanted to keep the car overnight so he could start it in the morning to get a better gist about what was going on with the noise. He seems like an honest bloke...at least he isn't talking rip-off prices like the guy who did the roadworthy.

I suppose, in the long run, I am getting a lovely car (finish is still spot-on and the interior is wonderful) with the safety features my old TS wagon lacked for a still quite reasonable overall price compared to buying new. Everyone tells me that 120,000 km is bugger all on a V6 Magna and that's how far the car has now travelled. And it was literally only driven locally by an elderly man and his wife.

How long would it take to drive to your workshop from Brandon Park, MM?


P.S. The EPIC overchargers are the dealers. I was charged $1450 a year ago for the timing belt service on my original Magna which included the water pump. Bear in mind the car had only travelled 350,000 km from new at that stage but I was told that time was as important as distance in changing the belt. I will NEVER take the car back to a dealer.

Point 1 Missus loves it - money well spent...

Point 2 - Sounds like a badly adjusted timing belt tensioner/offset pulley - or one of those cheap ebay tensioners the noise is bad but unlikely to give engine problems.

Point 3 - Flush $ - I got quoted $480 to do my TJ 5 speed by a very reputable local transmission service center - After doing a Claude Greengrass Blink Blink I left in a hurry, nearly worth driving all the way to MadMagna his price is very realistic.

She who must be OBEYED!!! She loves the "Molten Red" colour...which is what your car seems to be in your AV picture. I like the colour too but the silver Solara garnish with this colour seems a bit mismatched. I LOVE the Riversand/silver combination in my original Magna.

Oh..separate question. Missus doesn't like the original radio/Cd in the new car. She wants what we had in the wagon...a "mechless" unit that played stuff off a USB or SD card. I bought one of those cigarette lighter-poweered FM/USB transmitter thingamees off Ebay which also has a Bluetooth unit built in but, oh no, that's too fiddly for her!

I've heard all sorts of horror stories about installers stuffing up the HVAC controls and dials fiddling about with third gen Magna dashboards. Is this true? Or are they just as easy to work with as any other car?

Missus already has her heart set on a unit she saw at Autobarn with DAB radio, bluetooth...etc... She's good at spending my hard-earned, she is!!! ):

Pioneer make some good mechless units, check out Jb HiFi. I bought two basic units, for $55 and $60 but no bluetooth on these - adds about $100 onto the price. USB input works well, just don't use a USB stick with a blinky light, too distracting. A short extension cord for the USB stick is a good idea.
Install is a simple job (but I'm sure some installer can stuff it up), I did mine after watching a video on this forum.

I just had another look at the JB HiFi website, might be worth a look just to compare prices with the Autobarn ones.

This one seems good for the price.
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/gps-car-audio/jvc/jvc-kd-r856bt-usb-ipod-cd-bluetooth-receiver/537453/

How long would it take to drive to your workshop from Brandon Park, MM?

20 minutes, depending on traffic.


I've heard all sorts of horror stories about installers stuffing up the HVAC controls and dials fiddling about with third gen Magna dashboards. Is this true? Or are they just as easy to work with as any other car?

I installed a single DIN unit when the original died, wasn't really a big deal but mine has the push button climate control rather than the dials, I don't know if that's a factor.

MadMagna...I will be coming to see you from now on but I can't back out of this repair as the car is already at the Mechanic's workshop ready for action tomorrow. The mechanic wanted to keep the car overnight so he could start it in the morning to get a better gist about what was going on with the noise. He seems like an honest bloke...at least he isn't talking rip-off prices like the guy who did the roadworthy.

I suppose, in the long run, I am getting a lovely car (finish is still spot-on and the interior is wonderful) with the safety features my old TS wagon lacked for a still quite reasonable overall price compared to buying new. Everyone tells me that 120,000 km is bugger all on a V6 Magna and that's how far the car has now travelled. And it was literally only driven locally by an elderly man and his wife.

How long would it take to drive to your workshop from Brandon Park, MM?


P.S. The EPIC overchargers are the dealers. I was charged $1450 a year ago for the timing belt service on my original Magna which included the water pump. Bear in mind the car had only travelled 350,000 km from new at that stage but I was told that time was as important as distance in changing the belt. I will NEVER take the car back to a dealer.

Not sure where Brandon Park is, google maps may be your best estimate. We also have loan cars here so you are not stuck here for the day either if that helps.

Thanks Mad Max and Ensoniq.

Okay...got to the mechanic's workshop just as they were finishing the car. Saw the old timing belt (clagged ...stringy at edges) and I know they fitted a Gates kit with a new water pump as I saw the old water pump being chucked in the metal recycling bin. The mechanic filled the radiator with new coolant...running it for quite a while to normalise the level. No more noise...BUT much more cost! 900 bucks! I was not happy but didn't want to get into a prolonged argument on a Friday afternoon. Never again!

The noise is now gone BUT when I was driving home in heavy stop-start Springvale Road traffic I heard the thermatic fan kick in. I glanced down at the temperature gauge and this is what I saw:

http://i59.tinypic.com/ejd46b.jpg

Normally I see this AND when the thermatic fan kicked in the gauge did drop back to what I normally see, which is this:

http://i59.tinypic.com/2hpngw9.jpg

I am an obsessive old fart and I got a bit worried so I went for a prolonged drive and stopped the car often. When moving the gauge always shows as in the second picture above. when I stop in gear or in idle for more than two minutes it climbs to this:

http://i59.tinypic.com/20uv39k.jpg

...then the fan kicks in or I start moving and it goes back to what's indicated in the second picture above. Am I being too obsessive?? Help an old worrying fart out please!

P.S. On the move the gauge always sits as indicated in the second picture above.

First of all, nothing to worry about so long as the needle is below the red. None of these pics indicates a problem in my opinion. From your description and the pics it seems like the high temp (first pic) was a one-off, ie. it doesn't sit there while driving. If this is the case and the bottom two pics are the normal state of affairs between running and idling, possibly there was a bit of an air pocket in the system which has cleared itself. I would let it (and yourself) cool overnight and check the coolant level in the morning, both in the radiator and the overflow bottle, and top up if needed, then go for a drive and keep an eye on the needle. I'd give it a couple of days to settle down, if it gets above 3/4 (somewhere about the second highest white calibration mark) let it cool and take it back to the service centre for a check over.

EDIT: My TJ's temp sits pretty much constantly at your third pic's level, ie. bang on half way, once it's up to temperature, with a +/- fluctuation of about half a calibration point either way depending on circumstances.

My TJ's temp sits pretty much constantly at your third pic's level, ie. bang on half way, once it's up to temperature, with a +/- fluctuation of about half a calibration point either way depending on circumstances.

lol
Yep, air pockets. Takes a while to get rid of them. I've noticed that after a coolant change, the needle will peak, then drop down to normal. I find that when the engine cools down, the cooling system sucks back from the overflow bottle, and it will do that over several start/run/cool down cycles. I keep topping up, once that reservoir level stays steady, I know all the air is out of the system. Then the needle will be rock steady.
Both my TJ and TL do this.

First of all, nothing to worry about so long as the needle is below the red. None of these pics indicates a problem in my opinion. From your description and the pics it seems like the high temp (first pic) was a one-off, ie. it doesn't sit there while driving. If this is the case and the bottom two pics are the normal state of affairs between running and idling, possibly there was a bit of an air pocket in the system which has cleared itself. I would let it (and yourself) cool overnight and check the coolant level in the morning, both in the radiator and the overflow bottle, and top up if needed, then go for a drive and keep an eye on the needle. I'd give it a couple of days to settle down, if it gets above 3/4 (somewhere about the second highest white calibration mark) let it cool and take it back to the service centre for a check over.

EDIT: My TJ's temp sits pretty much constantly at your third pic's level, ie. bang on half way, once it's up to temperature, with a +/- fluctuation of about half a calibration point either way depending on circumstances.

Thanks mate...I tend to be an obsessive worrier and because of all the crap that has happened thus far with this car I guess I am letting myself jump to conclusions. When the car is moving the needle pretty much stays bang on at the half way mark...no movement. Stop the car in drive and the needle climbs within a minute or so but drops back when the second thermatic fan kicks in. Funny thing is that our other Solara's gauge needle always sits at the first "third" of the gauge and never moves from that point. That's why I got edgy when I saw what was happening in this car.

The mechanic that filled the radiator in the "new" car did so over the course of ten minutes with the car running. I suppose he was trying to minimise the air pockets you have written about.

Okay...I will keep an eye on the refill bottle. Sorry about the drama but I have become a fussy old worrier plus I am wary of the crap I'll cop from the missus if she noticed the same thing! Mamma mia!:eek2:

Forgot to add that the mechanic filled the radiator using a special funnel which I've never seen before.

Funny thing is that our other Solara's gauge needle always sits at the first "third" of the gauge and never moves from that point.

The nerves are understandable and it's always a good idea to pay particularly close attention to this sort of thing after 'major surgery', there's always the possibility of something being missed I guess. Re your other car, I don't know if Mitsubishi spent a lot of time carefully calibrating each gauge and sender unit to the exact same values, the fact that there's no actual temperature markings on the scale suggests it's there more to indicate a problem than provide an actual measurement of the temperature. There's any number of factors that could affect a car's 'normal' operating temperature, but I'd guess that your Solara's gauge or sender unit is probably just calibrated a bit differently.

The nerves are understandable and it's always a good idea to pay particularly close attention to this sort of thing after 'major surgery', there's always the possibility of something being missed I guess. Re your other car, I don't know if Mitsubishi spent a lot of time carefully calibrating each gauge and sender unit to the exact same values, the fact that there's no actual temperature markings on the scale suggests it's there more to indicate a problem than provide an actual measurement of the temperature. There's any number of factors that could affect a car's 'normal' operating temperature, but I'd guess that your Solara's gauge or sender unit is probably just calibrated a bit differently.


When I saw the needle hit the 3/4 mark on the gauge when I was in the stop/start traffic on Springvale Road (on the way home from the mechanic) I freaked out! I then drove the car down FerntreeGully Road until I almost hit the Burwood Highway. I stopped on the edge of the road several times for a couple of minutes each time. The needle would then climb to above the 6th ( 6 out of ten markings) gradation...the thermatic fan would kick in and it would drop back to "normal". Once I was on the move again the needle was rock steady at its normal level. Jeeze I'm an obsessive old fart!

Fart,yes.
Old, yes.
Obsessive? No, just careful.

Fart,yes.
Old, yes.
Obsessive? No, just careful.

Lol! If you ever met me you'd probably immediately think of Felix Unger (The Odd Couple...yes I am THAT old!).

MadMax and Ensoniq...your blood's worth bottling! A friend of mine sent his mechanic mate around to look at the car this morning. He said pretty much what you both said...then he "burped" the cooling system by parking the car with the nose up and leaving the radiator cap off until the thermostat kicked in (keeping a close eye on the temperature gauge). You could see gurgling little bubbles rising out of the cap opening. Once that was done the system was topped up with coolant and I ran the car for a while. Now the temperature gauge sits where it normally always sits...just below the halfway mark. The mechanic said to keep an eye on the coolant over the next few days and to drive the car as much as possible. He also checked the oil colour and checked the thermostat...all good! One obsessed fat old man now content...Sheesh! And the gent didn't charge me a cent but I bought a bottle of whisky to say thanks anyway.

Lisle Spill-Free Funnel (http://www.lislecorp.com/divisions/products/?product=606)

Pretty nifty funnel actually. I've got one and it makes life pretty easy (no mess!) and ensures no air locks when used properly.

I'd like my blood to stay where it is, thank you. No good to me in a bottle!

I'd like my blood to stay where it is, thank you. No good to me in a bottle!

Ditto! Good result stroppy, thanks for the confirmation :)