Hi all, I just bought a KJ Verada 4 speed auto and I noticed today its flaring a bit when it changes from 3rd to 4th, anyone had the same problem? and does a tranny flush fix it or is just wear? Cheers

Worn clutch plates.

Hi all, I just bought a KJ Verada 4 speed auto and I noticed today its flaring a bit when it changes from 3rd to 4th, anyone had the same problem? and does a tranny flush fix it or is just wear? Cheers

Wear, low fluid pressure, clutch plate baskets worn so plates hang up on the wear bits, ie the plates don't move smoothly or quickly.

High Km car I assume? Spent all its life around town doing the 3 to 4 back to 3 shuffle?

Learn to anticipate the 3 to 4 shift, and back off the throttle so the flare reduces, and the gearbox will be good for years more.
Fairly predictable when the 4 speeder shifts, my TJ and TL will shift exactly on 60 KPH when I lift off driving around town. If you find the flare annoying between 55 to 60, keep the gearstick in 3rd to avoid the constant 4 to 3 to 4 shifting. It's that constant swapping of gears at that speed that wears the plates out anyway.

On the open road I take 3rd all the way out to 80 KPH (gasp!) then lift off to change to 4 th before I put my foot down again.

Wear, low fluid pressure, clutch plate baskets worn so plates hang up on the wear bits, ie the plates don't move smoothly or quickly.

High Km car I assume? Spent all its life around town doing the 3 to 4 back to 3 shuffle?

Learn to anticipate the 3 to 4 shift, and back off the throttle so the flare reduces, and the gearbox will be good for years more.
Fairly predictable when the 4 speeder shifts, my TJ and TL will shift exactly on 60 KPH when I lift off driving around town. If you find the flare annoying between 55 to 60, keep the gearstick in 3rd to avoid the constant 4 to 3 to 4 shifting. It's that constant swapping of gears at that speed that wears the plates out anyway.

On the open road I take 3rd all the way out to 80 KPH (gasp!) then lift off to change to 4 th before I put my foot down again.

Yes its done 252,000 and has come from Sydney, not much flaring in 1st and 2nd but from 3rd to 4th with a bit of throttle it revved to 4000 rpm at 90k's an hour then dropped to 2000 rpm when in 4th, as you said Max I just need to back off on the throttle to reduce the flaring, its a 2002 XI for $1500 so I can't expect nothing to be wrong with it for that money.

Does it use any oil?
I remember your old one had an issue of using oil

How does a transmission use oil

Does it use any oil?
I remember your old one had an issue of using oil

The KH I still have uses oil, motor oil not transmission fluid, valve stems seals are rooted in it, valve stem seals seem ok in the KJ

Not bad for the price!

I'd be inclined to run around sub 60 to 70 KPH locked in third, then when you want to use 4th, back off the throttle and nudge the stick into drive, then ease down on the go pedal. The more you can avoid that flare, the longer the gearbox will last.

Old cars - they have their own personality. Driver just has to adapt to get the best out of the car. lol

How does a transmission use oil

Does it (the car) use any (motor) oil.


MadMax, does this mean that the tiptronic equipped cars can be driven in such a way that you back off the throttle on an upshift and the transmission would last a lot longer?

MadMax, does this mean that the tiptronic equipped cars can be driven in such a way that you back off the throttle on an upshift and the transmission would last a lot longer?

I'd imagine so.
I hate the way my TL revs out on a cold engine in first when in drive before it selects second. I just nudge the stick left and up from "D", and it takes off in second. Might be easier on the clutch plates too. I like the way the tippy will downshift to 3rd if the speed drops to 55, but won't upshift unless you tell it to. Avoids the hunting between 3rd and 4th when the speed varies between 55 and 60. Then again, I'm happiest in a manual gearbox car.

Check fluid condition
check fluid level in N and at idle hot
Does this have tippy? If so what happens in that mode manually upshift under same conditions

Is it improving at all each 3-4 i.e. re-learning?

I get 3-4 and 2-3 flare after a battery removal but it dials it out eventually

I'd imagine so.
I hate the way my TL revs out on a cold engine in first when in drive before it selects second. I just nudge the stick left and up from "D", and it takes off in second. Might be easier on the clutch plates too. I like the way the tippy will downshift to 3rd if the speed drops to 55, but won't upshift unless you tell it to. Avoids the hunting between 3rd and 4th when the speed varies between 55 and 60. Then again, I'm happiest in a manual gearbox car.

On a cold day I let my KL warm up ...... makes all the difference. It's also nice to have the heater warm.

Not bad for the price!

I'd be inclined to run around sub 60 to 70 KPH locked in third, then when you want to use 4th, back off the throttle and nudge the stick into drive, then ease down on the go pedal. The more you can avoid that flare, the longer the gearbox will last.

Old cars - they have their own personality. Driver just has to adapt to get the best out of the car. lol

Good tips thank you and very true about adapting to an old car to get the best out of it.

Check fluid condition
check fluid level in N and at idle hot
Does this have tippy? If so what happens in that mode manually upshift under same conditions

Is it improving at all each 3-4 i.e. re-learning?

I get 3-4 and 2-3 flare after a battery removal but it dials it out eventually

Yes it does have tippy,
The fluid looks like it could do with a change but its not dark just a bit more brown colour then red
Funny you mention about how your car flares a bit after the battery is removed as I blew a fuse yesterday replacing the interior light and I noticed the trip computer had to be reset, maybe it done the same to the ECU, I drove the car from Sydney to Bathurst on Friday and didn't really notice it flaring, I will take it for a spin today and see if its still flaring, it was mainly up a hill yesterday it did it.

I blew a fuse yesterday replacing the interior light and I noticed the trip computer had to be reset, maybe it done the same to the ECU,

When you swap the globe, it is really easy to short it out and blow the fuse inside the yellow rectangle in the fuse box under the bonnet.
You lose a lot of settings, like the trip meter and stored values in the ECU.
Takes a while for the transmission to re-learn shift patterns. The ECU compares input and output shaft speeds of the transmission on shifts, and adjusts the clutch take-up speed so that the shift neither flares or is harsh. Takes a while though.

So you may not have a problem at all, see how it goes.

When you swap the globe, it is really easy to short it out and blow the fuse inside the yellow rectangle in the fuse box under the bonnet.
You lose a lot of settings, like the trip meter and stored values in the ECU.
Takes a while for the transmission to re-learn shift patterns. The ECU compares input and output shaft speeds of the transmission on shifts, and adjusts the clutch take-up speed so that the shift neither flares or is harsh. Takes a while though.

So you may not have a problem at all, see how it goes.

I was being careless and was using my key to dislodge the bulb, bit stupid of me. So yes fingers crossed that's all it was, thanks for your reply Max, cheers

Yes it does have tippy,
The fluid looks like it could do with a change but its not dark just a bit more brown colour then red
Funny you mention about how your car flares a bit after the battery is removed as I blew a fuse yesterday replacing the interior light and I noticed the trip computer had to be reset, maybe it done the same to the ECU, I drove the car from Sydney to Bathurst on Friday and didn't really notice it flaring, I will take it for a spin today and see if its still flaring, it was mainly up a hill yesterday it did it.

when I did my transmission swap which you can read I had a lot of 2-3 flare at high rpm which took a bit to dial out. In tippy there was no flare just straight into gear which I figured meant the box was ok just the invecs needed recalibrating. I have made the mistake of being a bit low on fluid and at hwy speeds 3-4 gave huge flares. if the stick looks brown then I'd be doing a flush. from my limited experience when it looks brown on a wipe of the stick whenever I've then done a drain it looks more black than brown. Can't hurt to do a flush and replacement of the fluid.

rarely but maybe once or twice if I jump in the car after a reset and the MRS has done most of the driving because I'm a little more agressive I've had a slight 3-4 flare but the computer does dial it out pretty quick. A couple of shifts at the same point and it's gone. I currently have no flare issues at all on this old box of unknown mileage I put in.

Thats odd how a lot of people say the trans will play up a bit after a battery disconnect, I disconnected mine for a good 20 mins last w/e and then let it idle for 10, apart from the trip computer resetting, it drove nearly exactly the same as before i did it. Maybe because i didnt drive it immediately??

I've also had my battery disconnected many times and never had any issues, if anything the car runs better during the first 100-200km after a battery disconnect

I have the same issue, when I disconnect/reconnect the battery, the transmission flares quite badly on the 2-3 upshift and very mildly between 4-5. I predominantly use the the tippy during this time & back off the throttle prior to making the upshift into third until it settles. With my transmission, it usually takes 3 weeks before the flaring is all gone.

Interesting couple of posts there.

Perhaps after a battery disconnect the ECU uses a basic speed of clutch engagement which works well on a youngish gearbox, but on an older box it leads to flare - and the ECU then detects the flare through the input/output sensors, and slowly adjusts to a faster clutch engagement, until the flare is no longer there?

. . . . just thinking aloud there.

Perhaps some data on flare/no flare and km on the car is needed?


TJ 4 speed - between 111,000 and 150,000 km, no flare detected after battery disconnect.
TL 4 speed - no flare at 136,000 km, now at 188,000 km but the battery hasn't been disconnected for 2 years.

TW 4 speed 150,000 km at present, no flare after disconnect.
TH 4 speed 210,000 km when sold, no flare that I recall, but never disconnected battery in the time I had it.

Yes it does have tippy,
The fluid looks like it could do with a change but its not dark just a bit more brown colour then red
Funny you mention about how your car flares a bit after the battery is removed as I blew a fuse yesterday replacing the interior light and I noticed the trip computer had to be reset, maybe it done the same to the ECU, I drove the car from Sydney to Bathurst on Friday and didn't really notice it flaring, I will take it for a spin today and see if its still flaring, it was mainly up a hill yesterday it did it.

Up date on my flaring problem, its has greatly reduced since Saturday

KJ2 5 speed, 209,000km, no flare after disconnect