Hey im looking at getting extractors for my car wat is a good brand and type to get? are pacemakers any good?

thanx

pacemakers are good. they are a tuned length design, make noticeable gains throughout the rev range, and are well priced at around $500ish installed.

thanx for that it is a great help

thanx for that it is a great help
Hi John,

If you want more information, click up on the search button and type in extractors.. You will most likely get 200 odd threads about it. Theres usually 1 or 2 a week..

(this is probably the reason not many people have replied to this one)

go the pacemakers..... around 450 a set.. excluding labor... i have them installed and they go nice.. :D

Got 3 letters for you. R....P....W.
Now many ppl will be quick to jump on and criticise RPW for one reason or another. To that I say "Flame Away" :flame:

I've got the RPW "Race Spec" headers. No complaints from here quality or performance wise, though unlike, say, AussieMagna, I don't have a proper 'after' dyno for comparisson.

I even went the extra mile and got them genuine HPC ceramic coated. A word of warning though, the ceramic coating on its own costs almost as much as you can pick up a set of pacemakers for lol

You'll pay up to twice as much for the RPW items vs Pacemakers.

If you dont want to go the expense of ceramic coat, get em Aluminum sprayed. Looks tops and is heaps cheaper but doesnt insulate any where near as good. Stops em rusting though, from the outside atleast.

I've got the RPW "Race Spec" headers. No complaints from here quality or performance wise, though unlike, say, AussieMagna, I don't have a proper 'after' dyno for comparisson.

I even went the extra mile and got them genuine HPC ceramic coated. A word of warning though, the ceramic coating on its own costs almost as much as you can pick up a set of pacemakers for lol

You'll pay up to twice as much for the RPW items vs Pacemakers.

I know you didn't get a dyno, but using the "seat of pants" dyno, what kind of improvements do you feel you got?

I'm thinking of getting these, so I have to ask, as far as "bang for buck", would you still get the RPWs, or would you get something else?

I'm not knocking extractors, but I had some Pacemakers installed on my previous TH Sports and there wasn't really much positive change in performance. In retrospect, I'm not sure that my $400 was particularly well spent. There was some small gain above 4500 rpm, but I feel it corresponded to a drop in torque lower down. ie. initial acceleration suffered.

I also note the interview (which has been posted elsewhere in these Forums) with Mitsu's Rod Campbell, who was part of the team behind the Ralliart Magna development. He said and I quote:

'The Ralliart Magna uses heat-coated tubular extractors that will happily bolt to the heads of any TE-TJ Magna V6. On the other hand, Rod tells us the standard cast iron exhaust manifolds flow very well - the Ralliart extractors "are worth only a couple of kilowatts here or there".'

'Interestingly, Rod says there's not much more to be picked up from further mods to the exhaust. "At one stage we tried a straight length of pipe with no mufflers and it made no more extra power."'

I guess I'm saying that the gains from all these exhaust mods may be pretty small, and possibly not worth the cost. Food for thought...

'The Ralliart Magna uses heat-coated tubular extractors that will happily bolt to the heads of any TE-TJ Magna V6. On the other hand, Rod tells us the standard cast iron exhaust manifolds flow very well - the Ralliart extractors "are worth only a couple of kilowatts here or there".'
Just because the they flow well, doesn't mean they do their job well. Have you looked at them? They're typical, crappy, economical cast iron exhaust manifolds. To date I've seen several Magna's gaining 5-8kw at peak and a noticeable improvement in mid rpm torque after fitment of Pacemakers. Oh well, dyno run on Friday hopefully will confirm the difference in drivability I've experienced. Then it's on to the drags to see if the ET and trap speed has changed.

Seat of the pants I'm feeling some definate improvements. I hate saying stuff like that without being able to quantify it, though.

Since I haven't driven a car with pacemakers I'm not sure I can really say whether I'd get RPW items next time or not.. one thing in favour of the RPW Race items vs their older Street design is that just changing the extractors over from Street to Race on a car with a greddy, high flow t/b, etc., picked up an additional 5-10hp across the whole range. Not bad. Still not a comparission between pacemakers and RPW though, as in I can't say if the pacemakers would have flowed better to begin with or not.

As others have said, the changes aren't going to blow you away, but once you strap a piggy back on the car you're going to get more improvements for having extractors fitted than not, and the RPW Race headers have 1 5/8" diameter primaries vs the 1 1/2" on the pacemakers. It doesn't sound like much (1/8 of an inch) but in area terms that's 1.76 in^2 vs 2.07 in^2.

As I said I'm not knocking extractors, and I agree that they make a worthy addition to a coordinated bunch of improvements. I just don't think you can bolt them on by themselves and expect a turbo-like improvement. The Pacemaker website says you should get a 10% improvement in power from having extractors alone - well, on a Magna that's in the order of 15 or so kW, which I think is probably bollocks.

Now I expect I'll get flamed for this: As for Dynos - they seem to be notoriously subjective too. I had three dyno runs done in a row (ie. one after the other a few minutes apart) on my TH Sports last year, and the power went up 2-3kW each run, and that's with no change what-so-ever to the car.

Now imagine if I had put a new panel filter in after the first run and done the second run. I would be pretty happy with my $110 purchase, as the next dyno read-out would have shown a 3-6kW+ improvement. But in reality it's just the vagaries of the dyno process.

From what I've seen, if you want to get serious bang for your buck, look at a new cam first - that seems to be where the big gains can be had on the 6G74 and from there turbo or supercharging if your budget stretches (of course with new extractors :D )

I'd agree with that from a point of view that it's hard to notice a peak figure increase unless it's a lot.

My last dyno run say a 10HP difference between the stock filter and the K&N filter :bowrofl: Gotta love dyno's. I know people whinge about the Dynapack dyno's because it removes the tyres from the equation but that should be a bonus in that it should allow slightly more consistant results. Don't car if they read higher than chasis dyno's. It's the gains that are the interest.

The problem with getting cams first is that unless your intake and exhaust systems can breathe well enough you're not going to get the full potential out of the cams. I mean, if the stock exhaust manifold breathes so well, why did Mitsubishi need to fit proper headers to the Ralliart? I'm positive they're not there just for show.

Then there is the issue of needing a new computer to cope with the new cams. The stock computer just won't be able to cope.. maybe in closed loop it'll learn its way back to 14.7:1 but in open loop the static maps will be way out of whack.

Yep, absolutely. That was my point on a coordinated approach, and the ECU tweak (ie. piggyback) is vital.

Doing things like new extractors etc, in isolation probably won't achieve much and at considerable expense. The Ralliart cam is a 10% lift change from the standard, and it appears to deliver a consistent 5kW at the fly. Imagine a slightly more aggressive profile and now you're talking noticeable power improvements.

In the case of the Ralliart, when combined with higher compression, reduced inlet and exhaust valve shrouding, new extractors and importantly revised ECU mapping, then you get the extra 17kW.

Now, with a more agressive cam again, and advancing the ignition timing (piggy back ecu) to run on 98RON, then you'll get real power improvements in n/a form.

I think we all agree that N/A sucks in terms of bang for your buck performance upgrades. :cry:

I think we all agree that N/A sucks in terms of bang for your buck performance upgrades. :cry:
Naturally hahaha :bowrofl:

errr... sorry.

Actually, whilst the Ralliart is a decent car, it's enhancement over the base model is pretty ordinary when you think about it. It's like they did half a job. I'd still have one though.

Has anyone got a stock Ralliart dyno graph? I'm yet to see one.

'Interestingly, Rod says there's not much more to be picked up from further mods to the exhaust. "At one stage we tried a straight length of pipe with no mufflers and it made no more extra power."'



Bet it that was loud though.

I think the Ralliart is a pretty fair advancement over the standard model (I say this having come from an auto TH - maybe not so noticeable from a manual VR-X).

However, I agree like anything else, you wish they could have gone further still. That said, I'm pretty happy and impressed with the Ralliart. I plan to get a dyno done in the next few weeks at the same place I had the TH done last year (so I have some point of comparison), and will post it.

I have had pacemaker extractors fitted to the VRX and I noticed some solid gains. A before and after dyno yeilded about 8kw gain and I was very impressed.

Quality is good and price is better, definatly reccomend the pacemakers to all! RPW's do have a good design, but with problems i've heard from quality, price and no proven results im a little hesitant to reccomend them. Some people love them though so dont cross them off you list just yet :D

But you will find pacemakers are the best option in terms of dollar per kw value.

I plan to get a dyno done in the next few weeks at the same place I had the TH done last year (so I have some point of comparison), and will post it.
Excellent. The Ralliart is still stock, isn't it?

Got 3 letters for you. R....P....W.
Now many ppl will be quick to jump on and criticise RPW for one reason or another. To that I say "Flame Away" :flame:


dont you mean liverpool exhaust not RPW thats where they get there extractors made and a little bit more for ya they are only hurricane headers so RPW headers = hurricane headers

dont you mean liverpool exhaust not RPW thats where they get there extractors made and a little bit more for ya they are only hurricane headers so RPW headers = hurricane headers

I'll be enormously surprised if that is the case, particularly with the newer "race" design.

BTW, just because two people get their products made in the same shop it doesn't imply the designs are identical.

But anyway, if you can buy the same product from a different vendor and get it cheaper, knock yourself out.

Incidentally, are you saying that RPW headers are actually good because they're the same as hurricane, or is this just an informational broadcast?

I'll be enormously surprised if that is the case, particularly with the newer "race" design.

BTW, just because two people get their products made in the same shop it doesn't imply the designs are identical.

But anyway, if you can buy the same product from a different vendor and get it cheaper, knock yourself out.

Incidentally, are you saying that RPW headers are actually good because they're the same as hurricane, or is this just an informational broadcast?


well i cant stand hurricane headers so you be the judge and yes if you do want the rpw headers just ring liverpool exhaust and get them from there even save a **** load of money

There's also a place in Penrith that sells the RPW design headers, it may even be Penrith Exhaust.