Long post warning..

So I drove to Alice on the weekend, and had my air conditioner compressor seize up about 100km south of Katherine :tantrum: which meant 1000km there and 1500km back in 40 degree heat :cry:

Why did I go to Alice? To get some ported cylinder heads fitted by Street Torque :cool: The end result was a peak gain of 8hp at the wheels (although one dyno run gave me 11hp) with increased power and torque all the way through the range. And this is with the factory computer still in service. Before the heads - 161hp, after the heads 168-172hp

I was going to be getting a Haltech Interceptor fitted at the same time, but it didn't arrive. Thank you, freight company, you suck! :rant: But based on the dyno analysis Dallas did I'll be receiving the chip some time this week with a program that goes 90% of the way to being a good tune with just some tweaking left to do.. can't wait!

Unfortunately I don't have a copy of the dyno sheet with me cos Dallas' printer was out of red ink lol but I'll get a copy later in the week and post it up, or maybe if Booya is feeling kind he'll post a copy for me.. It's worth seeing the sheet just for the change in the AFR. Wow.

Oh, the CAI bit.. I've been running about $20 worth of 90mm PVC from my airbox down to a spot behind the front bumper for a few weeks now and was confident I could feel the difference over the factory snorkel, so while on the dyno we put the factory intake back on and power dropped 6hp back to 163hp straight away.. replacing the PVC jobbie saw power straight back to 169hp at the wheels, so anyone wanting to keep their panel filter in service but get some more air flow should seriously consider some custom large bore pipes.

I'll post a scan of the dyno sheet as soon as I get it for anyone who cares, and pics of my dodgy PVC snorkel tomorrow ..

Oh, and Dallas from Street Torque comes highly recommended for anyone wanting to mod their car. He's a top bloke and knows his stuff

Looking forward to more physical results, and how much more is the port+polish in comparison to RPW's $1000 dollar job?

That sounds great, any rough idea on cost for the ported heads? Also hows driveability or is it only an improvement in top end?

Looking forward to more physical results, and how much more is the port+polish in comparison to RPW's $1000 dollar job?

I can't tell you what I got charged for labour cos he did me a good deal :D You'll probably find the heads are comparably priced to RPW's.. then you need gaskets, genuine ones come in at about $250, and labour on top of that. It's a fairly lengthy job from what I understand. It's not cheap, but the gains will start to add up with other mods you do. Call for the best price though. I know for a fact he's got a set of 3.5L heads sitting in the workshop (my old ones) just waiting to be worked on that he could do as an exchange.


That sounds great, any rough idea on cost for the ported heads? Also hows driveability or is it only an improvement in top end?

There's more torque and power everywhere now, but at only 8hp/6kW ATW it's not going to blow your mind. It should come into its own once I get the chip done. There's potential for much improved flow and the huge change in AFR means it's burning the fuel better too.

good to see dallas did a great job..

now for some pricing...

Dallas has set his exchange heads at approx $1300.00 which includes resurfacing of the original heads, the heads that have been worked on are from vehicles with less then 30,000 on the clock this price does not include your labour to exchange.

Dallas ONLY recommends the OEM original metal gaskets and apparently these retail for around $330.

so to start off with you are looking at around $1600.00 for AGGRESSIVE headwork.. dallas doesnt worry about stage 1, 2, 3 etc.. they are all aggressively ported and polished equlivent to stage 3 rpw, while still maintaining the drivability.

these heads will be something chronic if bunded with a set of proformance cam shafts. expect some chronic gains over the whole range with some street torque heads + cams.

--------------

if you want a full rebuilt top end (heads, springs, cams etc etc) its best to call dallas for best pricing and can be done.

ETA for just a set of heads is less then one week (<7days) and can be carefully shipped anywhere in oz or aborad.

Dallas ; Street Torque Proformance
08 8952 7755

if you want to order through me as well - i can take your order and you can pay me also if you wish :) - call me for best pricing ;)

IM sure as time goes buy, a few people will start using ST. as an alternitive to other companies, as we have now started building a parts list that everyone can use with proven results!

oh - Brendan - you forgot to mention that you fuel economy is up ;) hehe

call me now for good pricing :cool:

Ben ****as
08 89641966 :badgrin:

ben can you be a bit more specific with the power gains for an entire re-built head? ie cams, springs, head etc?

Also im guessing that MMAL are going to go !@#$^@#$%#$%@#$%# NO WARRANTY FOR YOU! if you do this mod.. so does street torque provide some kind of warranty on their work? and would this warranty only apply if they fit it themselfs rather then a different place?

Im not looking at doing anything just yet, but certainly a little bit further down the track i am interested in doing a bit of a N/A build-up on my 3.5 and have been completely scared off RPW by the RPW horror stories.. and other then RPW not many people do work on magnas...

what is involved in their worked/rebuilt/flown head?

ben can you be a bit more specific with the power gains for an entire re-built head? ie cams, springs, head etc?

That's going to completely depend on what sort of grind you're looking at.

e.g. Ralliarts have very mild porting, 9.5:1 (up from 9.0:1) c/r, and very mild cams but pick up 17kW at the flywheel over a VR-X.

Once I've got my chip fitted and had a bit of a tune I'll be sure to post the results and they can be compared against Manual's old car, or TZABOY's ralliart, etc, which will give a better idea of what the porting alone has to offer.

Until someone is brave enough to get a set of cams fitted, it's pretty much only guess work, but I'd be thinking numbers on the fun side of 200hp ATW without question.

I spoke with Dallas last year re heads and this man KNOW HIS STUFF! No second guessing, its in his blood.

For background: Porting a head removes hot spots, rough areas and ultimately improves flow into and out of the combustion chamber. The more effieciently this can be done the more power an engine can generate because it doesn't have to lose power overcoming the inefficiencies of poor port formation or design.

In the real world this translates to better fuel economy and an improved torque curve right thru the rev range.

At this point you can investigate your valvetrain; seat angles, valve stem milling, oversized valves etc.

Dallas can also benchflow your heads so you can provide this information to a Cam manufacturer for custom grinds. This is the norm for aftermarket performance camshafts.

Talk to Dallas, support the guy that co-founded Booyaism and got Haltech into out lives.

I haven't got the heads done yet because my daughter was born the same month I made the call = no money until she leaves home in 25+years :bowrofl:

I haven't got the heads done yet because my daughter was born the same month I made the call = no money until she leaves home in 25+years :bowrofl:

:bowrofl: :bowrofl:

seriously tho, if you took a 6G74, bored it out to 3.8litres, wacked up the compression ratio a bit with some new pistons, had everything balanced to ensure smoothness when i get it up to 7000 rpm :badgrin: put a flowed head on it with maybe larger valves and a moderately aggressive cam, large TB and the usual CAI, extractors and exhaust.. what power does people reckon is possible?? im thinking around 240kw's would be absolutely awesome from a N/A V6, especially if it was in an AWD magna... but is it possible to get that kinda power??

:bowrofl: :bowrofl:

seriously tho, if you took a 6G74, bored it out to 3.8litres, wacked up the compression ratio a bit with some new pistons, put a flowed head on it with maybe larger valves and a moderately aggressive cam, large TB and the usual CAI, extractors and exhaust.. what power does people reckon is possible?? im thinking around 240kw's would be absolutely awesome from a N/A V6, especially if it was in an AWD magna... but is it possible to get that kinda power??


240kw.. are you crazy! youd be pushing the boundries of around 270kw easy.. my 3.0L na build was pushing 240hp on the ground ~ 240kw at the engine.

i seriously wouldnt be surprised if you could push beyone 280kw with the mods listed above.

:bowrofl: :bowrofl:

seriously tho, if you took a 6G74, bored it out to 3.8litres, wacked up the compression ratio a bit with some new pistons, had everything balanced to ensure smoothness when i get it up to 7000 rpm :badgrin: put a flowed head on it with maybe larger valves and a moderately aggressive cam, large TB and the usual CAI, extractors and exhaust.. what power does people reckon is possible?? im thinking around 240kw's would be absolutely awesome from a N/A V6, especially if it was in an AWD magna... but is it possible to get that kinda power??

All things are possible. It's only a matter of cubic dollars. :) Personally I think 240Kw in a FWD Magna would be pretty scary, probably way more than you could actually put to the road..

240kw.. are you crazy! youd be pushing the boundries of around 270kw easy.. my 3.0L na build was pushing 240hp on the ground ~ 240kw at the engine.

i seriously wouldnt be surprised if you could push beyone 280kw with the mods listed above.

well i was being rather conservative.. i didnt wanna sound like an idiot! lol

one things for sure.. magna V6's sound bloody awesome as it is.. throw a lumpy cam in and the sound would be just sensational!!

All things are possible. It's only a matter of cubic dollars. :) Personally I think 240Kw in a FWD Magna would be pretty scary, probably way more than you could actually put to the road..

indeed it would.. i think if i was to do it i would do it in an AWD.. but still.. if i couldnt afford an AWD and still wanted to do it.. i still wouldnt knock back 240-280kw's in a fwd.. booya seems to like it :badgrin:

it just comes down to how much money you would like to spend on the car.

i still wouldnt knock back 240-280kw's in a fwd.

May I recommend welding a huge-ass piece of RSJ across the struts? :badgrin:

indeed it would.. i think if i was to do it i would do it in an AWD..

I was talking to Dallas on Sunday and he was talking about what he wants to do when he gets a bit of spare money.. he was talking about buying an AWD and building up a monster N/A engine that revs up to about 10,000rpm with a hot pair of cams and all the good bits to go with it. :drool: I'd like to see that :badgrin:

May I recommend welding a huge-ass piece of RSJ across the struts? :badgrin:

at risk of sounding like an idiot (hey whats new) what is an RSJ?? Also obviously you would need a LSD on the front if you where to do it on a FWD car... but with a decent LSD and some good chassis tuning you should be able to make it so its not too much of a problem.. but as turbocharade says.. depends on how much you are gonna spend.. it all ads up

I was talking to Dallas on Sunday and he was talking about what he wants to do when he gets a bit of spare money.. he was talking about buying an AWD and building up a monster N/A engine that revs up to about 10,000rpm with a hot pair of cams and all the good bits to go with it. :drool: I'd like to see that :badgrin:

:shock: omfg 10 000rpm!!! will he sell an uber-v6 to me too!!!

All things are possible. It's only a matter of cubic dollars. :) Personally I think 240Kw in a FWD Magna would be pretty scary, probably way more than you could actually put to the road..

Considering Booya, Dave from RPW and Velocity are all putting out over 300kW at the front hoops (let alone at the flywheel), I reckon the Magna can cope with 240kW lol

When you've built up this 3.8L 14:1 105RON monster, I'll let you put in my AWD to see how it goes. :D

Should be able to near calculate the fly output. Each compression point added is equiv to 1atmos and thats 7% O2. So 190kw (assume exhaust, headers, heads, cams, etc) x 1.35 = 256.5kw. That's a mild estimate too. It doesn't allow for changes to capacity, stroke or bore ratios etc.

Considering Booya, Dave from RPW and Velocity are all putting out over 300kW at the front hoops (let alone at the flywheel), I reckon the Magna can cope with 240kW lol

exactly, super tourers run BIG power through the front wheels, its all about traction, if you can get the chassis set up so that you can get the power to the ground effectively, its not too much off a problem, ofcourse its not optimal, but i think possible

imagine a 10 000rpm FWD silver magna wagon :badgrin:

that sounds just stupid enough for me to do :D

donations anyone??

Considering Booya, Dave from RPW and Velocity are all putting out over 300kW at the front hoops (let alone at the flywheel), I reckon the Magna can cope with 240kW lol

Sure, but nobody's saying it's not scary.. :P

Sure, but nobody's saying it's not scary.. :P

Haha touche! I'll pay that :cool:

Oh, the CAI bit.. I've been running about $20 worth of 90mm PVC from my airbox down to a spot behind the front bumper for a few weeks now and was confident I could feel the difference over the factory snorkel, so while on the dyno we put the factory intake back on and power dropped 6hp back to 163hp straight away.. replacing the PVC jobbie saw power straight back to 169hp at the wheels, so anyone wanting to keep their panel filter in service but get some more air flow should seriously consider some custom large bore pipes.


THAT is the sh1t i been talkin bout!!!

added muffler, "yeh i think its made a difference".
added k&n panel, "yeh its made a bit of a difference",
added 90mm PVC intake, "daamn i KNOW that has made a difference"

THAT is the sh1t i been talkin bout!!!

added muffler, "yeh i think its made a difference".
added k&n panel, "yeh its made a bit of a difference",
added 90mm PVC intake, "daamn i KNOW that has made a difference"

alright alright fine you've convinced me.. ill go buy my k&n and a peice of pipe next time i get paid

Sorry to sound stupid but how long is an engine with very high compression and big cams going to last and are the service intervals going to be extremely short? Also the problem with the AWD is that you only have auto, is this going to be able to take frantic revving and or be driveable? As booya has said many times and look at his progression why wouldnt you go with forced induction for a heavier AWD or even FWD? For similar results would not turbocharging or supercharging almost be cheaper (if there is such a dream) and less likely to explode?

Sorry to sound stupid but how long is an engine with very high compression and big cams going to last and are the service intervals going to be extremely short? Also the problem with the AWD is that you only have auto, is this going to be able to take frantic revving and or be driveable? As booya has said many times and look at his progression why wouldnt you go with forced induction for a heavier AWD or even FWD? For similar results would not turbocharging or supercharging almost be cheaper (if there is such a dream) and less likely to explode?

The gearbox is from the Lancer GT-A, transfer case, front diff, centre diff, transfer shaft, and LSD are all from the EVO 6. These are turbo charged high revving machines. Ask MRT or someone who does work on an EVO for track or trail and they'll tell you what the gb can handle. It's all good news :cool:

For similar results would not turbocharging or supercharging almost be cheaper (if there is such a dream) and less likely to explode?

ok here is my opinion on this. lets just say your power target is 260kw's. You could get this figure very easily and alot cheaper by going the forced induction route, no doubts about that. But if you do it n/a, you will have a much much sweeter engine. For proof look no further then ferrari.. 95% of ferrari engines are n/a. It will have cripser throttle reactions, it will rev smoother and will all round be a nice engine to drive, however it will cost ALOT more.

As for it being less likely to explode. Yes and no.. if you go for a silly redline like 9000rpm then yes their is a good chance your gonna mince the internals pretty quick, but if you retain a fairly conservative redline, then the engine will be more reliable then a foced induction engine every time because forced induction puts alot of stress on the bottom end of an engine

ok here is my opinion on this. lets just say your power target is 260kw's. You could get this figure very easily and alot cheaper by going the forced induction route, no doubts about that. But if you do it n/a, you will have a much much sweeter engine. For proof look no further then ferrari.. 95% of ferrari engines are n/a. It will have cripser throttle reactions, it will rev smoother and will all round be a nice engine to drive, however it will cost ALOT more.

actually, good post RJL25, but id argue against that - building a N/A worked block will be a pig to drive at low rpm. higher in the rpm band they will be onsong, but after driving a high comp na and a forced induction car, i can honestly tell you, the drivability is nothing short of "different worlds".. the forced induction wins hand down.

start building a wild cam and a high compression - your asking for
a) worse fuel economy
b) very rough idle
c) pig to drive at lower rpm
d) driving becomes an "art" to move a n/a car from standing still/getting it to move in the revrange.
e) as previously pointed out - cost..

i can honest with you, forced indcution is so much smoother - more torquey' and way better fuel economy. pros with the N/A - as mention'ed - instant throttle response in any gear - any rpm

oh - and dont be compairing our 3.0/3.5l to a 10cyl or even a 12cyl ferrari - they are in totally different leagues - and even a few new ferrari's are looking at turbos...

hell - Mercedes AMG CL65, S65 and the SL65 - bi-turbo V12's with 450kw/1000nm on tap :cool:

i saw a write up about an aftermarket merc performance factory oversea's and yeh like you said it quoted decent amounts of power(550-650kw) and absolutely insane torque figures(over 1000Nm) :drool:

i saw a write up about an aftermarket merc performance factory oversea's and yeh like you said it quoted decent amounts of power(550-650kw) and absolutely insane torque figures(over 1000Nm) :drool:

the gods name is "brabus"

they have made some of the most insane merc's in the world!!

What I want to know is how you guys with 200kw+ get your power to the ground! I have enough trouble with the stock power and rims.
I know wider tyres would help and LSD... (btw what sort of price am I looking at to get LSD fitted?)
But apart from that what else can you do? I dont know much about suspension etc!

With the destroying @ high rpm of a stoked n/a engine, you dont need to hit the redline... you can have a lot of fun below that, and still have the engine last a long time. Cars that continually hit the redline will die no matter what they have under the bonnet. Redline is exactly that... the edge of safety.

Cheers
Pete

Hi Guys

Back after being away for what seems like a couple of years, been watching Killer tinker with his car across the road and I think the bug has bitten me again grrr.

Anyways I'm very keen to see how you worked the 90mm pvc CAI. I currently have an alright setup with some rubber tubing but wouldn't mind switching it to the smoother pvc piping but I'd like to see how you neatly attached it to the airbox and what angle connections you used to get it to the front foglight area.

*patiently sits back awaiting pics* :)

*patiently sits back awaiting pics* :)

Whoops.. I kinda forgot to take them didn't I? :shifty: I'll snap some tonight. promise!

the gods name is "brabus"

they have made some of the most insane merc's in the world!!

thats the one mate :cool:

I had a ride in a K73 a while back near Vienna. Think as name suggests a 7.3l V12, was older S class shape. doing 270km/h somewhere near 4000rpm, was interesting. It was just cruising along. But yeah if money was no object a Brabus would be nice but not nearly as useful here.

actually, good post RJL25, but id argue against that - building a N/A worked block will be a pig to drive at low rpm. higher in the rpm band they will be onsong, but after driving a high comp na and a forced induction car, i can honestly tell you, the drivability is nothing short of "different worlds".. the forced induction wins hand down.

start building a wild cam and a high compression - your asking for
a) worse fuel economy
b) very rough idle
c) pig to drive at lower rpm
d) driving becomes an "art" to move a n/a car from standing still/getting it to move in the revrange.
e) as previously pointed out - cost..

i can honest with you, forced indcution is so much smoother - more torquey' and way better fuel economy. pros with the N/A - as mention'ed - instant throttle response in any gear - any rpm

oh - and dont be compairing our 3.0/3.5l to a 10cyl or even a 12cyl ferrari - they are in totally different leagues - and even a few new ferrari's are looking at turbos...

hell - Mercedes AMG CL65, S65 and the SL65 - bi-turbo V12's with 450kw/1000nm on tap :cool:

well you have had both setups on the same engine, so i guess you are the most qualified on this matter then, so ill accept that. What about for the track though? if you had to choose between equal power but the two different setups which would be superior for a race track where your always gonna be above 4000 rpm anyway?

Ok, those CAI photos I mentioned... remember, this contraption was worth 5hp ATW over the factory snorkel.

In the circled bit in the engine bay photo you can see some magical tape which I'm using for a bit of insurance ;) There needs to be a bit of a twist there so the vertical pipe can fit down by the battery box. Ideally I think you'd want to use a bit of flexible rubber pipe here since I've never seen a PVC joiner with the right angle that I liked the look of.

Anyway.. the whole thing is fairly dodgy since it was just an experiment to see it it would work, and it does, so now I'm going to look for a way to construct something a bit more permanent and professional looking that doesn't need tape ;) It also needs a proper bell mouth on the intake end to improve pickup.

FYI the whole thing as seen here held together over 3000km of hard, fast, and sometimes bumpy driving on the trip to Alice so it's pretty robust despite any appearances to the contrary lol

Sorry the undercar picture is so dodgy.. I'll snap another with less shake once my parkinson's subsides ;)

Oh, we want photos of the ported heads too :D

Oh, we want photos of the ported heads too :D

Yeah, no problem.. I'll tear the motor apart tonight when I get home for ya :bowrofl: :P

I was hoping to get some pics myself actually, but he'd already put the heads back on by the time I got to the workshop :(

fantastic thanks for that mate so by the looks of it you needed a straight piece of 90mm as well as a couple of bends with 2 more short pieces shoved in? The main thing I was checking was that 90mm could actually make it past the battery which is obviously can I can't imagine it was easy! My next challenge will be is I actually cut off the snorkel about 5cm from where it attaches to the airbox so I could clip and unclip my current cai easily enough, I will need to see if I can adapt the piping to the connection.

Good news today was I had to do some computer work at a local school and while I was at it managed to scab around 1.5mm of 90mm pvc from the general assitant :) just need to work out what connections I will use now

thanks again for the piccies

I have some 90mm? PVC and a couple of bends/adaptors if anyone want them, theyre only taking up space, in Sydney.

I have some 90mm? PVC and a couple of bends/adaptors if anyone want them, theyre only taking up space, in Sydney.

where abouts in syd mate?

In city, near darling harbour.

In city, near darling harbour.

ahh ok lucky you I was going to see if killer wanted to redo his at all but we're both westies so probably not the most economical method :) thanks anyways

fantastic thanks for that mate so by the looks of it you needed a straight piece of 90mm as well as a couple of bends with 2 more short pieces shoved in?


My setup starts with a 100mm to 90mm adapter. The 100mm part is then heated (in boiling water) and reshaped to rougly fit over the opening in the airbox. It's not a perfect fit but it's not coming off.. in fact a few bits of rubber at the top and bottom would see it hold fast no probs. From that I have a short, maybe 50mm long section of 90mm diameter pipe (which would be better off being rubber) to join up to a 90 degree bend part, then enough 90mm tube to reach down to the bottom of the bumper. Attach another 90 degree bend and add another 100 - 150mm section of straight pipe pointing forwards and you're done.



The main thing I was checking was that 90mm could actually make it past the battery which is obviously can I can't imagine it was easy!

My car is a manual. It's a pretty easy fit in my car, but does rest against the coolant pipes. Some brakets to hold it away would help here but it's not causing any problems so far.

I'm lead to believe the autos have a lot less clearance in that area because of the size of the auto box so you might have to step down to 70mm pipe or something. Another option is to heat the PVC in the middle and squish it a bit to get through some of the smaller gaps.

*** see if killer wanted to redo his at all but**
Heh, nope. My aviation heat pipe is smooth enuff inside, no need. But if u get yours done easily and without using my small axe as an installation tool, I'll reconsider.
Your foglight scoop is sufficient as a bell mouth once it's sawn bit bigger to accommodate.

lots of stuff

My car is a manual. It's a pretty easy fit in my car, but does rest against the coolant pipes. Some brakets to hold it away would help here but it's not causing any problems so far.

I'm lead to believe the autos have a lot less clearance in that area because of the size of the auto box so you might have to step down to 70mm pipe or something. Another option is to heat the PVC in the middle and squish it a bit to get through some of the smaller gaps.

thanks for the info ahhh that could be exactly the problem I'll run into bummer might have to stick with what I've got :(

cthulhu,

Try using this black rubber plumbing joiner; it adds flexibility and an airtight seal. See PIC.

cthulhu,

Try using this black rubber plumbing joiner; it adds flexibility and an airtight seal. See PIC.

That's exactly what I was planning on, cheers :) just need to get down to a hardware store now.

cthulhu,

Try using this black rubber plumbing joiner; it adds flexibility and an airtight seal. See PIC.

That air box is very neat, how did you go about making that up.

My setup starts with a 100mm to 90mm adapter. The 100mm part is then heated (in boiling water) and reshaped to rougly fit over the opening in the airbox. It's not a perfect fit but it's not coming off.. in fact a few bits of rubber at the top and bottom would see it hold fast no probs. From that I have a short, maybe 50mm long section of 90mm diameter pipe (which would be better off being rubber) to join up to a 90 degree bend part, then enough 90mm tube to reach down to the bottom of the bumper. Attach another 90 degree bend and add another 100 - 150mm section of straight pipe pointing forwards and you're done.


Did you know to do that cos of how i described i did mine, cos that is EXACTLY how i did mine, even the 100mm to 90mm adapter boiled in water. (not that i mind if you copied of course). My mum wasnt too happy with me boiling dirty pipes in her kitchen lol

Heh, nope. My aviation heat pipe is smooth enuff inside, no need. But if u get yours done easily and without using my small axe as an installation tool, I'll reconsider.
Your foglight scoop is sufficient as a bell mouth once it's sawn bit bigger to accommodate.

yeh looking at the foglight scoop on my bro's TH, it looked perfect for CAI, but the TH bumper has extra reinforcement bars right behind that scoop! So my TE bar has been more effective so far.

Did you know to do that cos of how i described i did mine, cos that is EXACTLY how i did mine, even the 100mm to 90mm adapter boiled in water. (not that i mind if you copied of course). My mum wasnt too happy with me boiling dirty pipes in her kitchen lol

lol No, I made it up as I went along.. didn't realise someone else had already posted an identical setup. :D

Ok well killer and I had a muck around with my setup today and have just completed a sucessful CAI setup. My previous setup wasn't bad but the tubing I used wasn't as smooth as pvc so that was what tempted me to redo it. The main aim of the setup was to make the bends as smooth as possible whilst keeping the airbox stock. What we ended up with was the very end bit of my stock snorkal cut and locked into the airbox. We then fitted (very tightly) a 90mm 45degree bend into the left over snorkel so it's not going anywhere but can be clipped/unlclipped from the air box quite easily. the 45 bend then went into another 45 bend (resulting in a slightly longer less acute angle than 1 piece of 90degree pvc) this then connected in a 90mm pvc straight down to the bottom of the car (it fitted nice and snug in a 3.5L auto) with the use of a few more 45degree, 1 22degree and a short offcut of pvc we had the intake facing directly where my foglight would be. We then trimmed the grey piece of plastic that sits in the foglight hole increasing the overall diameter and put it back into its holder feeding directly as a scoop into the 90mm piping resulting in a stock looking effective setup. I took it for a quick hoon and it felt good and sounded nice. Very hard to tell if it is better than my previous setup (should be in theory) but I'm pretty happy with the results)

Just need to paint the visible areas black now and then I move onto dremelling my throttle body and I said I was done with modding a year back grrr :)

pics! :P

haha yeah mate no probs will be painting it black in a couple of days so will grab some piccies then

it's fairly similar to you're setup just with 45's instead of 90 bends (don't know how much difference this actually makes but it adds a slightly longer length to the curve) and it goes all the way to the fog light hole which you could extend yours to (involves cutting a bit of the black plastic catch tray to get the pipe through.

haha yeah mate no probs will be painting it black in a couple of days so will grab some piccies then

it's fairly similar to you're setup just with 45's instead of 90 bends (don't know how much difference this actually makes but it adds a slightly longer length to the curve) and it goes all the way to the fog light hole which you could extend yours to (involves cutting a bit of the black plastic catch tray to get the pipe through.

did you have the problem that part of the re-enforcement bar was right behind the fog light cover thingy?

and it goes all the way to the fog light hole which you could extend yours to (involves cutting a bit of the black plastic catch tray to get the pipe through.

Biggest problem with this is that I have fog lights ;)

I might look at the 45 degree bends. The less abrupt the corners the better for sure.

Biggest problem with this is that I have fog lights ;)



My CAI doesn't worry about fog lights and has a large surface area on the intake.

Ignore the POD arrangement, it's now a fully enclosed unit.

haha I can help you out there cthulhu you send me your foglights and I will send you a premodded and stock foglight holder :) Yeah will do some more looking at the bends tomorrow when it is light I stood in bunnings for an hour looking at all sorts of bends and the two 45's were only very slightly better imo so don't worry too much about it.

EZ BOY yeah that position is would of been an easier choice but we were worried about air turbulance or it being more likely to be an area with less direct airflow (think of a car in a windtunnel with air flowing over the top of the car and below) Our reasoning was hardly scientific and we were probably getting nitpicky by this stage but I certainly felt more comfortable have the fog light holder acting as a funnel directly from the front of the car into the CAI

Tim-E not 100% sure which bar you mean I do remember the first time I did CAI a year ago I actually removed the metal fog light holder completely with a couple of screws and never needed to put it back in which opened up alot of room. We had to cut away at the plastic a bit that you can see is about to get in the way of cthulhu's setup and other than that it wasn't too hard. Having said that my hand and arms are pretty cut up but once you have worked out the angles and lengths it's definately doable.

Tim-E not 100% sure which bar you mean I do remember the first time I did CAI a year ago I actually removed the metal fog light holder completely with a couple of screws and never needed to put it back in which opened up alot of room

ahhhh so its just the holder for the fog lights eh? I thought it was all part of the re-enforcement bar of the TH and therefore unable to be removed without hacking at it. I'll have a look at the TH when i next get the chance.

Here is my setup. I have been meaning to add another 90 to 100mm adapter at the end of the pipe cos it squeezes into an oval shape and fits snugly in that fog light hole.

ahhhh so its just the holder for the fog lights eh? I thought it was all part of the re-enforcement bar of the TH and therefore unable to be removed without hacking at it. I'll have a look at the TH when i next get the chance.

Here is my setup. I have been meaning to add another 90 to 100mm adapter at the end of the pipe cos it squeezes into an oval shape and fits snugly in that fog light hole.

I should note I have a TJ Advance so I don't know if it is any different to the TH setup but from memory the braket I removed look similarish to the thing on the left of your piping in your foglight. But it was nothing structural and was only there to hold the foglight.

Your setup actually looks quite good only thing I would consider is smoothing out the bend up the top near your air box but I can't see if there is much room left for you to move in that picture.

I might just have to look into these 90mm-100mm adaptors as well as you all seem fond of them and it's a cheap experiment :)

I was just looking at some pics and realised some CAIs are covered with alu foil (or something). Theoretically good idea for heat insulation. But matt black paint looks better. Hmmmm - desicions....
Hah - didn't think of it. One cannot use the foglight scoop if it's not there, but the foglight itself is there....

Your setup actually looks quite good only thing I would consider is smoothing out the bend up the top near your air box but I can't see if there is much room left for you to move in that picture.


yeh, well i have the benefit of having 3 3rd gens here to experiment on. My plan is to get it how i want it in my brothers TH, then swap it with mine. There is a little bit of more left in my setup. At the moment the pipe is touching a coolant pipe, but there is enough room for it the PVC to be moved to the right a little bit to get it away from it slightly. But there isnt too much i can do about reducing the angle from that first bend. I could use two 45 degree bends instead, but i am doubtful it would make much difference.
I am also seriously considering taking that idea of cutting the original snorkel 5 cm from the end and attaching it so that the piping can be slotted in and out very easily. I mean i have 2 spare stock snorkels lying around.

yeh, well i have the benefit of having 3 3rd gens here to experiment on. My plan is to get it how i want it in my brothers TH, then swap it with mine. There is a little bit of more left in my setup. At the moment the pipe is touching a coolant pipe, but there is enough room for it the PVC to be moved to the right a little bit to get it away from it slightly. But there isnt too much i can do about reducing the angle from that first bend. I could use two 45 degree bends instead, but i am doubtful it would make much difference.
I am also seriously considering taking that idea of cutting the original snorkel 5 cm from the end and attaching it so that the piping can be slotted in and out very easily. I mean i have 2 spare stock snorkels lying around.

ok well a bit of an update that might help you. I've done some more mucking around with mine over the past few days and managed to increase the length of the bend even more. I did this my using around 5cm of stock snorkel connected to the box. I then have 2 22.5's connected into that which then goes into 1 45 (this looks to be as long as I can make the curve but it's around 10cm longer than a 90degree from memory so definately worth it) the 45 then goes into the 90mm pipe down to the bottom where it curves pefectly into my fog hole which we trimmed slightly to increase the side of the hole which points straight into the 90mm pipe. I've driven it a bit and I'm very happy with the results it may even feel a little better than my previous black tubing setup. Still gotta find the time to pull it out and paint it and snap some piccies which I will upload in a thread on here just wanted to jump in before you went off to buy anything :)

Good work, mate. Looking forward to the pics. Doing it this way (with lots of small angle curves) might actually remove the need for me to add a rubber bit for flexibility.

Good work, mate. Looking forward to the pics. Doing it this way (with lots of small angle curves) might actually remove the need for me to add a rubber bit for flexibility.

well hopefully it will help you out somewhat I didn't think it would turn into such an ordeal but the quest for perfecting it is never ending and I'm considering pitching a tent in bunnings pvc bend eisle. It's a very tight fit at the moment and for ease of testing and installation last night we actually undid the 3 bolts holding the airbox in. With these removed we had extra room to move making it much easier to install. I've got to the stage where I've pretty much settled with it for now (for all of 12hrs!)

Where the 90mm connects to the snorkel is very snug and I'm happy with the airflow into the box in theory. Looks wise I'm still thinking about ways to optimise (pvc slotting into snorkel doesn't look fantastic) but it might not be so noticeable after its all painted. The other alternative is the 90-100mm adaptor molded like a couple of you have done but I'm a little more confident with the snorkel connection and I had already cut and butchered the snorkel from my previous install.

will keep you updated with any new thoughts/changes.