Hi all,

Woo hoo my first post. Anyway, I have been around for a while now reading and learning, but I havent registered because I didnt have a magna yet, but as of late next week I shall :badgrin: .......but more on that when I get the car and can take pics etc for its own post.

Now that I have the car coming I turn my attention to the sound. Considering the two current cars I drive are a 1985 Holden Commodore VK station wagon with 1 working speaker in the dash and a not working aerial, and an excel with whatever standard speakers they have, I figure any system I get will sound awesome. But I have fairly expensive taste in things :D, so I want a really good sq system. I havent worked out my exact budget yet, but will probably be around the $4000 mark I think. The music I listened to is very varied, rock, r&b, pop even.

Now I have seen Tim say that some of the best systems are ones that only have only 2 way splits and a sub in the boot. But is this only good for the people in the front seats? I will be driving friends around often and I want it to sound good to them as well. No point spending so much on a system if your friends arent creaming their pants with envy right? :D I have never heard a front stage type system like that, so Im still wary about it. Would it sound alright in the back if you had a 3 way split with tweeter in the pillar, mid range in the front door and midbass in the back door?

So brands Im looking at are Morel, the Elate 6" and the supermo tweeter. Maybe Rainbow (Reference in my dreams :D) CS~something in real life. Boston Z6 people are saying are good too. Im not sure how much these cost. Every car audio website I look at doesnt put product lists and prices. Anything else in this category that are as good as these?

For the amp and sub I would like Soundstream, because I think they look awesome with the Tarantula emblem and people seem to regard them highly. They dont seem to be easy to get in this country though. Is there anywhere in Melbourne that sells them?
Im not sure wether it would be better to get 2 x 4 channel amps (6 channels for the 6 speakers in the 3 way splits at the front and 2 bridged for the sub) or 1 x 4 channel for fronts and mono for sub, or just one really good 4 channel and have 2 channels for the front and 2 bridged for the sub. I will just be getting one 12" sub, something good for sq but I still want to feel it.

For the head unit I saw a Pioneer one (cant remember the numbers, but I think it had blue LED circles around the two knobs). It looked good and I can plug in an Ipod to it.

So if your still reading, I congratulate you, sorry for the long post but I just had to explain where Im at so it is easier for you guys to help.

So what can you guys recommend with around $4000 to spend, that includes installation, wiring, sound deadening, tuning, etc. Not restricted to brands mentioned, just like what Ive read about them.

I will end now so as not to be banned on my first post for indecent lengths :D

Thanks

Dave

i read the bit about this is your first post and then looked at how much ther was and couldnt be bothered to read it..... lol whats your question....... :D

hello and welcome to AMC!
long posts are good ones, especially how your wrote it out, very simple to read, not some noob who joins up and says "im in da mrket 4 sum sprkers and would liek sum help plz"...so as long as its readable its all good.

i have no idea on high end products as obvioulsy you have a bigger budget then me.
i am thinking along the line of;
$500 in sound deadning
$500+ for installation
$500 for wiring EASY
and then GIVE OR TAKE about $2.5K for components.
since you are only after SQ, i would say look around for a high end 4 channel, and a high end mono, then get a nice SQ sub, something along the lines of a RE XXX, ive heard these are really good (im sure its called RE XXX?) and 2 sets of splits.
thats just my little input, wait until the pros come on to give there opinions, hell cut the crap just PM S_tim_ulate :P

just remeber installation, SD, and wiring will take a HUGE chunk out of your system, especially if you want the best, in which case your looking at stinger 0 gauge throughout, anyway welcome to AMC and dont be afraid to ask

Cheers, Paul

']hello and welcome to AMC!
long posts are good ones, especially how your wrote it out, very simple to read, not some noob who joins up and says "im in da mrket 4 sum sprkers and would liek sum help plz"...so as long as its readable its all good.

i have no idea on high end products as obvioulsy you have a bigger budget then me.
i am thinking along the line of;
$500 in sound deadning
$500+ for installation
$500 for wiring EASY
and then GIVE OR TAKE about $2.5K for components.
since you are only after SQ, i would say look around for a high end 4 channel, and a high end mono, then get a nice SQ sub, something along the lines of a RE XXX, ive heard these are really good (im sure its called RE XXX?) and 2 sets of splits.
thats just my little input, wait until the pros come on to give there opinions, hell cut the crap just PM S_tim_ulate :P

just remeber installation, SD, and wiring will take a HUGE chunk out of your system, especially if you want the best, in which case your looking at stinger 0 gauge throughout, anyway welcome to AMC and dont be afraid to ask

Cheers, Paul
:stoopid:


...another dave, too many here :disgusted lol

i read the bit about this is your first post and then looked at how much ther was and couldnt be bothered to read it..... lol whats your question....... :D

why even bother posting a reply if you cant be stuffed reading the original message


my opinion is if you cant help, dont post

Welcome to the club (no need to pm me I prefer it in the forums then I dont have to repeat myself)

I noticed you're in Vic, I'm happy to give you a listen to what a good 3 way setup sounds like with no rears, tag along to the next Vic meet.

As for your system, you've got a very nice budget.

First things first if you like your sound your best bet is to let your ears decide and have a listen to some high end gear

Definetly listen to:
Dynaudio System 360
Morel Elate (6" or 9") 3 ways
Scanspeak, Diamond, Focal, Peerless, Vifa, Eton, Phass The list goes on.

Sign up at www.caraudioaustralia.com and have a peek around a lot of the info there is bull, but there's a lot of good info for retail knowledge. Where to audition this and that etc.
Also a good for sale section if you want to save a buck with second hand gear.

Personally I would suggest a 2 or 3 way setup with 1 decent sub.
Subs:
IDMax, RE XXX, Adhire Brahma, DD3512 ->if you want great SQ that also goes ridiculously loud
IDQ, Treo, Diamond TDX, Boston etc If you want great SQ.

Power wise I would look for a monoblock to handle the subs duties: Tru-Tech, Soundstream, PG, Phass

And around 200 w rms for 3 ways either a 4 channel amp bridged or a 2 channel amp with a lot of power. Going 4 channel gives you more options with running active vs running passive. I would try and run active midbass/subwoofer. Passive works well for Midrange and tweeters. Or fully active (factoring in cost/time for equipment and tuning)

You can upgrade the rears if you feel the need, but I wouldnt spend too much (if any at all), there's no need if you have enough power up front.

As for source units I would look at Alpine, Eclipse, Pioneer or Nakamichi high end units. Aim to spend a fair bit here, (>$800)

Door prep = aim to spend a fair bit, dynamat or stinger expert roadkill for the inside and outside door layers. ($135 for a 2 door pack you might need a bit more to do it all properly)
Then more to do the boot, parcel shelf, rear seat, and spot areas inside the boot.
Sound off deadening paint for behind the trims = $65 for a 1 litre tub.
Acoustic tiles behind the drivers to stop reflections $13 from jaycar for cheap ones or ~$50 for proper ones. dynaxorb, stinger etc...

As for speaker positions, I strongly recommend going in the kick panels over the sail areas/a pillar.
http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/4798/rhkicks3way3yt.jpg
This is due to reduced separation in the kicks, and smaller path length difference. If you want a one seat wonder that sounds good from the drivers seat (with time alignment), the sails might be ok, but if you want your system to stage well from both seats (without time alignment etc) you need to minimise path lengths between the listeners ears and the speakers.

Great place to find pricing is at FHRX's (AMC sponsor and really good car audio studio in NSW)
http://www.fastfoursforumscarclub.com/temp/fhrxstudios/products.asp

That should get you started

Peace

Tim

im starting to think of getting a POD from Jaycar, or something, instead of mounting my tweeter seperate.

My fat feet would render any speaker mounted down there Tim obsolete inside a Week..
Lets not go putting speakers down near our Pedals regardless of how good it sounds..

Or it will end in Tears

I heard a Different Set up with the Two Tweeters Mounted Central on the Dash Firing Towards the Centre of the Back Seat... This kept it sounding equal...

My fat feet would render any speaker mounted down there Tim obsolete inside a Week..
Lets not go putting speakers down near our Pedals regardless of how good it sounds..
Look again at your car's kicks compared to mine...

Mine could well have more leg room than yours as I took out the kick panels to fit my tweets and midranges in there.

I wear size 14 shoes as well and have no problems

you know what they say about guys with big feet....






















big shoes :P

I never said I had big feet... :P
edit: Here's my kicks from another angle
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/5813/rhkicks3way29ye.th.jpg (http://img34.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rhkicks3way29ye.jpg)

Thanks for the quick replies and the welcomes :)

Thanks for the info Tim. I looked at FHRX website, was a good read. I also looked at the DD3512 subwoofer you referred to........1600wrms!!!!!!! for only like $800! :shock: Sounds good to me, but to get an amp that would run that would cost like $4000 alone wouldnt it? :)

Paul said about $1500 for deadening, wiring and installation, that leaves $2500, then you said spend at least $800 on head unit, that leaves $1700 for front splits, sub and amp. That doesnt sound as good as $4000 did :(

Seems like even $4000 is not quite enough to get my dream system :(

So does anyone know anywhere that sells Soundstream in Melbourne?

With the posititioning, I am only new to car audio, so dont really know that much, but I thought it was better to have the tweeters and that higher up to lift the soundstage? I would have thought that putting them down in the kick panel would make the sound seem like its coming from the floor? and wouldnt that be a long path from speaker to ear down there than up in the pillar or dash?

So if you had plenty of power to the front speakers your saying, that it would sound good to the people in the back as well, or are you just saying screw the people in the back?

Also if I get 3 ways do I put the midbass in the back doors or all 3 up front?

Thanks again

Dave

In regards to speaker positioning you want the least path length difference between your left and right channels.
If your tweets are up on the dash your drivers side tweet will be much closer to you compared to the passenger tweet. This will result in a strong drivers side bias which wont help your staging.

By mounting them as far away as possible you improve this greatly.

In terms of stage height, yes it will appear lower, but your imaging will be much more accurate as all the speakers are closer to each other. Stage placement is much more precise. To overcome issues with stage height I use ambient tweets at about 1/5th of the volume high passed about 10khz, but I've seen setups in the kicks that achieve very good stage height without ambient tweets.

In terms of subs, don't pay rrp for a new one... (You can buy mine off me for $500 if you want) although I'd definetly audition an IDMax first as the are awesome SQ woofers. The DD will kill them all in SPL, but the IDMax is in top spot for SQ subs in Australia imo. The IDQ is also a very nice woofer at a fraction of the cost.

Try and have a listen to an IDmax before you buy a sub, you wont be disappointed.

Sub amps: Although the sub is rated at that much, doesnt mean it wont sound good with 500 w going into it. For good dynamics I wouldnt go less than 500 watts for a sub amp, but you can go upto and beyond 2kw as well. All depends how loud you want to be cranking it. Good sub amps can cost a couple of thousand, but for straight SQ, you dont want to spend too much here as it's not needed. 500 -1000 w rms is heaps of power and will drive any sub to uncomfortable listening levels. Aim for $600-$1000 here depending whether you want it new or 2nd hand.
Im running around 1kw into the 3512 atm. But it sounded great with 440 w rms.

If you go three way definetly pop your mids up front, either in your doors or in fibreglass pods in your kickpanels. Doors are easiest. You want to get as much sound in front of you as possible just like a concert if you are after SQ.




So if you had plenty of power to the front speakers your saying, that it would sound good to the people in the back as well, or are you just saying screw the people in the back?


A bit of both. To a certain extent, screw people in the back, you wont have rear passengers 'that' often. Chances are you will always have someone in the front seat. And more frequently have someone in the front passenger seat.
The rear seats may not sound unbeleivable, but in my car with no rear speakers, I've had a few people who's jaws drop to the ground when sitting in the back, (not to mention the fact that there's a lot more bass back there) There's still plenty of volume coming out of the fronts and in the confined space of a car I've never had any complaints.
Most of the time when anyone wants to have a listen they'll jump in the front seat anyway.

Peace

Tim

hey timbo,

how much power does your 'my first amp' - ghetto style - crossover put out?

heheh

OK I understand what you mean about the distance of the tweeter near the driver being closer to your ear than the passenger one, so does that mean you put the drivers side in the kick panel and the passenger in the pillar to even the distance? or do you put both in the kick panel?

$500 for your 3512 sounds interesting, but I will have a listen to the IDMAX first and see how that sounds.

So do you think $1000 would cover installation, sound deadening and wires, etc? or would it be closer to $1500? how hardcore would I need the wiring to be for say the 3512 and Elate 6"?

Thanks

Dave

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4183/audioartcustomppassiveclose4ms.th.jpg (http://img39.imageshack.us/my.php?image=audioartcustomppassiveclose4ms.jpg)
Its a crossover u twit!
Not an amp... So it puts out about as much as your sister... :P

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4183/audioartcustomppassiveclose4ms.th.jpg (http://img39.imageshack.us/my.php?image=audioartcustomppassiveclose4ms.jpg)
Its a crossover u twit!
Not an amp... So it puts out about as much as your sister... :P

blah. whatever, crossover or DIY bling made out duct tape and blu tack...... :D

You want to have an identical left and right setup (95% of the time anyway) As then it will stage well from both seats.

So both in the kick panel... I know it looks like it will sound low, but without ambients the sound stages about 10cm below the dash. With ambients it's about 10 cm above the dash.

What type of install do you want? Installs can cost thousands. How much skill do you have in electrics and handyman work. All the knowledge is in the forums, eg installing headunits and speakers, deadening etc. Or will you definetly get it all done by a shop/someone else?

Labour costs: If you want a decent install with 3 ways($250), headunit ($100), 2 amps($100), Door prep + Other deadening ($150) and a sub($50) with all the wiring ($100)
All up you're looking around $1000 minimum on labour(big estimate - You may want to get a quote yourself). If you can DIY some of that, the only custom work that will need to be done may be mounts for the tweeters and midranges. The rest is relatively easy.

Car audio shops I would recommend in Vic: Stylyn, GL Pro Sound, Freeway Car Audio, Hektik(ignore the name they have a good reputation)
All of these guys would be happy to demo some cars for you and write you up a quote.

Wiring: Doesnt need to be too fancy for your speakers and subs. It is Alternating current so the actual current draw is much lower than DC. This is why you will need to spend a lot on power wires and ground wires to your amps. I run 0 guage. I would use 4 ga minimum probably 2 gauge or 0 guage if possible. This can be over $40 a metre sometimes so can add up.

Main power wires = 5 m x ~$25 = $125
Distribution block for the boot to split the wires up = $60
ANL fuse + Fuseholder = $70
Power wires for amps and grounds = 2 m x $20 = $40
RCA leads = 2 x $50 (sub and fronts Run rears off h/u)= $100
Speaker wires for 3 ways = 6 x 5m runs = 30 m x $2 = $60
All up on wiring ~$500

Deadening(Sheets + paint for doors, boot, etc) = $350

Sub box = $150 or if you want a custom job = $400+
Starts to get a bit exxy... :)

Oh dont forget an alarm $500

Peace

Tim

Also tim, it may not be stinger but i got these aerpro products, for a little less then those you mentioned

go to say hi-fi supermakert, i picked up
6m of 2ga wire
3m of 4ga wire
distro block (gold plated)
ANL Fuse holder and fuse
- and + gold plated battery terminals
14ga speaker cable
ring terminal
3 sets of premuim RCA's

all for $260, all aerpro, so mate go there, buy it at once, and get them donw in price, the dood was gonna charge me $300 for that, and got him down $40 so cant complain

Yep sounds like a good price... The stinger stuff is very exxy for what it is... You'll never have any problems with any of their gear though. Tough as nails...

RCA's are the only parts that you really dont want to skimp on. But dont go overboard. Stinger Helix are great. Other than that, with fuseholders, distro blocks, fuses, power wire, speaker wire you can afford to steer clear of the high end expensive gear as the rewards are extremely diminished. Dont do it 'cheaply' but no need to go overboard.

Money is much better spent on speakers, headunit and door prep, than in magical cables as long as the 'weak' point in your system isn't going to be the cables.

Peace

Tim

wellthe RCA's i got were RRP @ $45 a set, so they are good quality ones, but becuase i was after the $25 ones, and they only had 1 set, he gave them to me for $25 each, all 3 of them.
Aerpro's equipment does look 1st class, so i have no problem with it so far, when its installed i shall provde plenty of pics for you to make up your own opinion. but for cabling, similair to mine i suspect you would be going (maybe 0ga if your case) very thick, i would set aside $300 for cabling etc.

once you have got a budget then work around that.:)

why even bother posting a reply if you cant be stuffed reading the original message


my opinion is if you cant help, dont post

Slight contradiction eh?

Alright well I dont know anything about electrical engineering, so I will be getting it all done by someone else. I dont think I could trust myself pulling the car apart to install things.

Well it seems that half my budget alone will be needed just for cables, installation and sound deadening.

Well I guess I will have to see exactly what my budget is after I have the car and then go around to some places and see if I can get some deals.

Thanks guys

Dave

just a few wiring diagrams mate to see if you understand it all.
im only 17 yet im giving it a go, 1st time ever, and i got a few things to go in aswell.
take a look at these, the 1st one helped me alot
1st pic - drawn by magnat
2nd pic - drawn by me

You dont have to do every thing yourself, although i recommend you do, but there are some things that you certainly can do.

just have a look at how to do it before you pay someone else to do it.

eg, 5 mins with a calculator, a $40 piece of crap jigsaw, some MDF ($30 maybe), some good glue and a couple of hours and you have a sub box, and a lot of spare cash in your pocket.

I have found that most things in cars are like that. The people that assemple and fix them are not all rocket scientists (I am not calling anyone dumb here) so these things are generally put together so that they can be pulled apart easily enough. Plus, any knowledge you might be lacking is right here on this forum.

The more you can do yourself, the better your gear can be!

its actually rather easy. At first i was overwhelmed with the idea of installing a head unit, but with a wiring diagram from the new one and old one you can pretty much do every thing your self. With the sub box, you can make one yourself which will fit better then off the shelf ones, or buy one from jb hi-fi, it seems they have a huge stack of cheap ones. Wiring the amp is really easy, amps look like they need alot more experience to put them in then they really do. With speakers, if you are just replacing existing speakers with better quality ones, then its piss easy, positive here, negative there (not that it really matters). Just follow suggestions on what to do by the guys on here and it will be really easily done.

swapping positive and negative will put your speakers out of phase, which will affect midbass and staging... Instead of a mono sound or centred sound coming from the center, it will appear to come from two points where your speakers are...

Easy way to test if ur unsure... get a small battery (AA) touch one end onto each wire, if the speaker pushes out, the wires correspond to the battery ends, if it pulls in then it is the opposite.

Or:

i know this, its just that regardless its a still gonna make sound.
I'd test it with a volt meter

As another axample, I have a headunit, Morel splits up the front, a sub in the boot and 2 amps.
I had only installed headunits and crap speakers before, but this time I did the whole lot myself (apart from building the speaker box). I learnt heaps in the process and the forum is always here if you need the help. You will save yourself $$$, loose your temper at least twice, skin your knuckes and be proud as by the time you have finished!

My gear so far: (detailed I know, but it gives you a pretty good idea)

Headunit: $500
Morel Pulse 6 splits: $320
Sub: $220 (RRP i paid less)
Sub box and fitting sub into box: $160
Sub box straps: $15
Deadening (Stinger Expert Roadkill - 3 door kit all up for the front doors): $220
Acoustic Tiles: $22.50
Stinger Distro block: $20
2 guage power cable (7meters): $79.50
Stinger speaker cable 16AWG: $50
4 gauge power cable for amps: $33
Stinger Hyper RCAs: $60
Battery terminals: $64.40
Fuse & Fuse holder: $48
Two 2x150 Response Amps: $400 (RRP I paid less)

Total: $2,212
Total without sub and amps (as you want more expensive ones!): $1577
Total (no speakers, amps or headunit): $597.4

A very nice system, for not too much. The only let down is the sub. It is not an SQ sub but still sounds great. If I had the cash I would have bought Tim's, but I have already spent more than I anticipated.

Hope that gives you a bit better idea! Let us know what you end up getting, with that budget it should sound sweet as!! :D

Cheers
Pete

piota - where did you get 2ga from that cheap?
My Aerpro 2ga for 6 meters cost just over $100 dammit!
also do you have any pictures of your battery terminals?
just keen to see what they look like as i only paid $44 for both of mine
(Aerpro AP502/503 here (http://www.aerpro.com/p.php?pcode=AP502&xno=07) )
damn you a good deal on some of that stuff!

at least you can find 2 ga wire, every where i go they are outta stock or dont have it. Very disappointing. By the way i thought about the installation of the sounds system a bit more and i thought, you might be able to get someone from AMC to come help you out for a carton of booze, some cash, or free :D . I would but i dont think your in SA, i didnt check.

are you reffering to me d@ve? if you are ive decided to go solo......

']piota - where did you get 2ga from that cheap?
My Aerpro 2ga for 6 meters cost just over $100 dammit!
also do you have any pictures of your battery terminals?
just keen to see what they look like as i only paid $44 for both of mine
(Aerpro AP502/503 here (http://www.aerpro.com/p.php?pcode=AP502&xno=07) )
damn you a good deal on some of that stuff!

Thread with pics of my install:

Pete's Install (http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19620&highlight=wiring)

Pics of the battery terminals are in there. Some newer pics are coming as soon as I can get the time to take them.
I got the 2 gauge with the trade discount from Jaycar.
A lot of the stuff I got pretty huge discounts on as I got most of it through JB HIFI, and by the end of it they began to recognise me and gave me some sweet prices!

Cheers
Pete

Thanks for the diagrams TUFFTR. Yeah I understand them. Im sure I would be able to put all the wires together, my main concern is pulling out door trim and whatever else I have to do to get it installed. My dad is an electrical engineer, so I could always get him to help with the electrical side of things, it was just the pulling the car apart side of things Im not sure about.

Thanks for the breakdown Poita. If I could do it myself and get everything done for $600 (well it would probably be more cause I wouldnt get your discounts) insteed of like $1500 that would save nearly another thousand to put towards the actual speakers/amps/sub etc :) hmmmm maybe I could try and make a project out of it. How long does it take roughly for a do it yourself sound system installation? Then i'll just times that by 10 lol

Yeah ill definately tell/show everyone what I get when its all done :)

Thanks

Dave

mate to take door trims off......wouldnt take you more then 5 minutes, remove all the screws, and yank out, your done.

set aside a full day IF you know what your doing and have all the equipment....a full day should be all you need

Cheers Paul

I'll have the leather interior on the door, so that just screws out too?

OK a days not too bad, ill set aside two or three though ;)

What tools do you need to do it?

Dave

']are you reffering to me d@ve? if you are ive decided to go solo......
i refered the 2 ga wire to you and the installation part to aurora, i guess it wasnt clear, my bad :D

i refered the 2 ga wire to you and the installation part to aurora, i guess it wasnt clear, my bad :D


Oh, yeah Im in Melbourne. I guess if I try and do it myself and end up in the foetal position I can always get some kind soul on here to come help me :D

Dave

plenty of people here that can help you, if your that desperate, just post up ya need some assistance in the VIC section, or, best thing would be to come to a cruise, or meet, and yeah you'd have 20+ people there to help ya!

buy a gregory's manual from nearly any auto shop (you might have to order it in) it may seem like a lot of money but for whats in it its worth it. mine was $50 but yours might be around $100, just because of how often they are sold etc...

Ripping apart a car is not a hard as people think. Just be careful and take your time.

It helps if you are doing a full install to take the seats out. The bottom of the rear seat has 2 clips at either end holding it in, pull the tab and the seat should come free. Front seats have bolts, 14mm is usually the go.

Door usually have about 3 or 4 screws that need to be removed. To get the winder of there is a little metal clip that holds it on, it is only a semi circle and has little pongs on either end so a long neck plyer is needed. Beware it does fling off though. Electric windows take the panel out and unplug the harness. All that is left is the clips, work your way around setting them free, virgin doors can be very loud. lol

Facias to put the headunit in, usually work your way from the bottom up, find any clips and pull it away gently, beware of screws as you can snap the facia.

Amp cables, make sure to keep all the power cables together, run the power cable and remote turn on down the passenger side of the car. RCA cables should be run away from any power cable so not to get any induced noise. Try and run them down the middle or drivers side if you can put it up the middle.

Make sure to fuse the power cable around 30cm or less from the battery. Would be handy run another earth off the negative terminal the same size as the power cable to help the cars earth. Doesnt have to go far. Make sure you have the battery disconnected while you are doing all this!!

Alright, thanks guys.

I will have to hold onto this information for when my car finally arrives......god damn it I want it now! :rant: :)

Dave

http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com

Just to emphasise the importance of sound deadener... And some comparisons...

re: tim's speakers at the feet:
Magnat, I came out with the same comment as you when i saw where he put his speakers, but after going for a drive with him, they really arn't in the way at all, and unless you're very careless, i think they'd stay in good nic for quite a while :)


So does anyone know anywhere that sells Soundstream in Melbourne?
Gary's Car Radio are the big players for SS in melb. They're scattered all around, there's bound to be one within 30 mins from you. My local one is mitcham, but there's others around, one close to essendon i think too? Also the guys at Autobarn Airport west are the only autobarn that sell soundstream.
If you go into gary's, don't be afraid to bargin for price, they'll drop it to make a sale.
They will however try and push you into a sale, so go there last when you've got some other quotes, and really haggle, they'll make sure you're serious first, then will drop the price.
Also, as tim said, sign up to car audio australia, talk to a few people there. If you manage to talk to the right people, you can get 10% discount at stlyn car audio