http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/1813/p31500397ru.jpg


What is it and what is it reponsible for??

Its the Plug Thingy on the side of the throttle body with the Red Plastic thing and wires coming out from all over it..

What does it do and what is it responsible for???


I am having a little difficulty with my 6g72.. It sometimes Holds Revs like the Automatic Choke is still on .. then the revs go back to normal after about 2 mins and it does it Hot or Cold During Driving and at Idle...

I am thinking TPS or Idle control Motor could be the possible culprit..

It's either the TPS or Idle Control, not 100% sure, but I think it's the TPS.

EZboy or someone with access to a service manual (I'm at work at the moment :shock: ) would be able to verify.

That thingi is the TPS, Throttle Position Sensor and your fault description sounds very much like TPS matter. It can be adjusted, but if it's faulty, then obviously requires replacement.
Undo the screw - quite tight cos clued in, then turn it (TPS) very little and try. Try to find best position via trial and error, unless u resort to adjusting it using Volt meter etc.
Of course your idle motor could be faulty too.... that is right underneath the TB.
Have u checked with the diagnostic connection to get possible fault codes? The one at driver's left leg.

There have been no fault codes reported ?

So u earthed the first pin and turned ign on and no flickering engine symbol light in the dash? Ok. Bugger.


There have been no fault codes reported ?

That thingi is the TPS, Throttle Position Sensor and your fault description sounds very much like TPS matter. It can be adjusted, but if it's faulty, then obviously requires replacement.
Undo the screw - quite tight cos clued in, then turn it (TPS) very little and try. Try to find best position via trial and error, unless u resort to adjusting it using Volt meter etc.
Of course your idle motor could be faulty too.... that is right underneath the TB.
Have u checked with the diagnostic connection to get possible fault codes? The one at driver's left leg.

Sounds to me more like it's the ISC motor or the fast idle valve that's at fault :doubt: . I woulda thought if it was the TPS then it would be putting out a ****ty air fuel ratio.

That screw that you mentioned is that the idle speed adjust screw or the throttle stop screw? Cos you should not play around with the throttle stop screw, there's no need, that wouldn't be your problem and it has to be set in a exact position. If it's glued in place then it prolly wouldn't have moved.

It could also just be that the throttle body needs a clean
here's how to do it
http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31288

The TPS lock screw. Once released (seal broken), the TPS can be turned/adjusted.
Play around? Well isn't anything in a car meant to be left for the "professionals".... :D
If one knows what he is doing, then proceed, but don't go and just turn things and wish for the best. Cos when TPS is incorrectly adjusted, the engine runs pretty strangely....


That screw that you mentioned is that the idle speed adjust screw or the throttle stop screw? Cos you should not play around with the throttle stop screw, there's no need, that wouldn't be your problem and it has to be set in a exact position. If it's glued in place then it prolly wouldn't have moved.
http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31288

The TPS lock screw. Once released (seal broken), the TPS can be turned/adjusted.
Play around? Well isn't anything in a car meant to be left for the "professionals".... :D
If one knows what he is doing, then proceed, but don't go and just turn things and wish for the best. Cos when TPS is incorrectly adjusted, the engine runs pretty strangely....
lol true

I just remembered something. When I first got my car I had a problem that may be the same as this. What I had was, when the coolant was cold the idle was normal, but when it was warm and in neutral, the idle would sometimes increase up to about 1000-1500 rpm. Is this what's happening to you?

What I did was I removed the fast idle air valve to test it, it works by using a wax pellet that is heated by the coolant and as it gets hot (30~40 C) it closes the port, stopping airflow. Anyway I removed the valve and tested it by placing it in water that I know the temp of. Anyhow no problem with that or the ISC motor that I could find.

I put it back together again wondering what the problem was, but ever since then I've had no problem. I've got no idea what was wrong but what I think was wrong, was that there was carbon or something in there that was blocking it and when it was in the water it was cleaned out :confused: . Anyhow this may be the prob with yours but first check out the ISC motor asit's easier to do. :D

yeah clean the electric terminals on your tps (pictured) and idle speed control; which is on the bottom from memory; see if that doesnt make a difference...

Define Crappy Air/ Fuel Ratio ??

At the moment it is Suffering:
*Creeping RPM at Idle to around 1500rpm
* Constant 1500RPM Idle after and During Being Driven which Resumes to Normal then creeps Back up again
* Running Rich..
* Spark Plugs Blackening too quickly leading to miss fires
* Sometimes Floods on Start up, Rare Occasion but has happened.

That sounds like the problem that I had, again I'm not sure what caused it but removing it and putting it in water seemed to fix the problem. :confused: Don't forget to take off the sensors before doing that though lol

If the TPS was gone you would definately know. Your motor would be running really rough. ie lumpy idle, spluttering etc. That's why I would go with it either being a problem with the fast idle air valve or the ISC motor, as these would only have any noticeable effect while idling.

It is carrying on like a Right Prune at the moment.. Surging power, Missfires underload and hold revs at 2000 rpm and then after about 2mins starts to drop the revs down to around 800rpm.. So is something Sticking ?? As it will hold this 2000rpm thing whilst Driving and Changing Gears ( Ah the Luck of having a Manual Box)

This miss fire is evident but then it sorts itself out..

Wowh, sounding pretty b-dy bad. Someting is loose.... Then it could be anything we have already covered, not just TPS. Oxy sensor, Air Sensor, Crank Angle Sensor...etc.
Have u checked for the err codes yet? Do they provide any help? Reset ECU before the check to get fresh codes.
I managed to find fault in Immobiliser wiring by checking the codes. Bit of fluke, but still.


It is carrying on like a Right Prune at the moment.. Surging power, Missfires underload and hold revs at 2000 rpm and then after about 2mins starts to drop the revs down to around 800rpm.. So is something Sticking ?? As it will hold this 2000rpm thing whilst Driving and Changing Gears ( Ah the Luck of having a Manual Box)

This miss fire is evident but then it sorts itself out..

How do I get the Fault Codes???

I realise that this thingy under the steering wheel is it but I am not sure How to go about Earthing it to get the Codes..

Would be easy to show but difficult to explain... :)
Do u have the Repair book at all?
Under the dash, on driver’s left ankle/leg bone area, there is a ~ 5 cm long connector socket with some ~15 female connectors. If I recall correctly, the top left is to be earthed. Insert paper clip, cos most testing wires are too thick. Once earthed (after ECU reset - disconnect battery for 5 min) turn the ign on. The engine symbol light in dash board will illuminate in slow and fast cycles - i.e. 4 slow and 5 fast blinks means code 45 etc. Then refer to the book to see what that code means.
But - I'm relying on my memory on the connector, so better check from the repair book (buy one, only cost 25 odd bux). All my staff at home and I'm at office now, so can't help more now. Perhaps somebody else here has the book handy and can send a pics and codes?
BTW, to see the test socket, u pretty much need to lye down, head first in the footwell. Very comfortable position :doubt: . Fortunately not dash components require removal.
Keep us posted. Hope this helps.



How do I get the Fault Codes???
I realise that this thingy under the steering wheel is it but I am not sure How to go about Earthing it to get the Codes..

Whoa that sounds worse than what I thought it was. If you haven't already done this then I very highly recommend you go out and buy the gregories workshop manual. It has how to check all the things that you'll need to and it's written so that anyone can understand it. Probably one of the best buys for your car.

Now this is just plain weird..

I Upped the Octane rating in the Fuel, Premium unleaded + Octane Boost and now miss fires are gone, and as long as I am light with the throttle I dont get it doing the 2000RPM thing..
So it has something to do with Full Throttle Applications..

Possible Idle Motor Problem ?

I will get a Gregories but they are more then $25 try closer to $50 !

Improved with higher octane? Ign timing? But it shouldn't go up and down....
None of the air hoses leaking, like brake booster/servo hose?
50 bux!!!! Grrrhhh....
Checked the plugs? Sooty, light brown, white? (Rich, ok, lean - respectively)
How is engine compression?

Spark Plugs = Black.. Cleaned and Replaced Yesturday Some result today

Every thing smoothed out with Octane Increase.. Compression seems fine on all Cylinders..
No signs of Exhaust or Oil leaks anywhere So I ruled out Head Gasket..
Coolant is still 100% Clean no Oil or Grime
I Disconnected the Oxygen sensor and the Engine Splutters so I reconnected it , all Went back to normal
I am leaning towards some where amoungst the Intake....
No leaks in the Induction system ( Tested this by removing the Piping from the Throttle Body and the engine tried to maintain Idle then stalled, reconnected the Piping and the engine went back to normal

So it has to be something sticking in order to Over Fuel the engine..

Ok.
When u removed the air pipe from TB u also made the air flow to stop at the air sensor... hence it wouldn't run :)
If u have major air leaks at intake side, u might hear whistling noise when the air rushes in thru small hole.

The sputtering, missing and high idle sound like a vacuum leak, but then you wouldnt have black plugs lol

Myself I'd be looking at the AFM, they're touchy buggers at the best of times, you got any friends nearby with magnas ? I'd just swap them for a test - take it for a drive and see what happens, we have a bunch of spares are work we use for all sorts of cars, makes life easy :P

Try free revving your car and see if the revs fall back to idle really slowly, usually if your ISC is stuffed your revs will try and hold as your engine is gulping air through your idle circuit - along those lines hows your engine braking, any left ?

Good luck man, sensor diagnosis is a huge pain, as fault codes are the biggest joke in the world, we tried on one car to disconnect every sensor in turn and then together and never threw a single fault code :doubt:

Matthius

Engine Braking Sucks.. It Will decline in revs but When it gets to 2000rpm thats as low as it goes...

So to Run down on the Symptoms we have

1. Miss fire Under load that is intermittent
2. Holding revs at 2000rpm under all conditions, can be avoided if full acceleration is not used.
3. Black Plugs in 12 Hours the plugs go jet Black..

1. ? Could be several things
2. Strange
3. Definitely too rich - Oxy sensor or AFS/MAS (what ever ppl wanna call it)?
Cos, when u have larger BF opening, there is more aiir going thru, hence the "richness" isn't causing that much problems. Plugs should be light brown.


Engine Braking Sucks.. It Will decline in revs but When it gets to 2000rpm thats as low as it goes...
So to Run down on the Symptoms we have
1. Miss fire Under load that is intermittent
2. Holding revs at 2000rpm under all conditions, can be avoided if full acceleration is not used.
3. Black Plugs in 12 Hours the plugs go jet Black..

Engine Light is now on

Car is Running Better then Ever before WTF is going on ??

I tried the Fault Code thing but I cannot Get it to earth in order to get a reading...

I stuck it in the Wrong Pin and shorted the Internal Light Circuit

Oouucchhhh.......


I stuck it in the Wrong Pin and shorted the Internal Light Circuit

No fault codes.. It reports all is OK...

No fault codes.. It reports all is OK...

Fault codes are a joke :( they're dodgier than the ****ed sensors they monitor.

Try pinch a MAF of another member and run around the block, thats where I'd be looking. They can be very intermittant as you describe.

Matthius

I like it better when the Engine light is on.. All Cylinders fire without any hesitation, it revs out nice and smooth

I checked the Oil level and it is fine with no signs of contamination.. Ditto with the coolant..

Fault Code .. Looks like a 21...

Code 21 is Coolant Sensor. Makes sense - faulty sensor is sending msg to ECU that the donk is cold and whacks the "choke" on (increases fuel amount in relation to air). And then it's ok for a while and so on. Rich mixture runs bad on low RPM when donk is cold. How is it now?


Fault Code .. Looks like a 21...

Sensor and light have not come back on yet..

It is Very intermittent..
I did notice that when the Engine Light comes on the Fans Come on aswell..
It doesnt go into limp mode as then engine is still free to rev well up in the Rev range..

Haa, plot thickens... I'd say it's the temp sensor. Shouldn't be too expensive to replace to try.


I did notice that when the Engine Light comes on the Fans Come on aswellrange..