Does anyone know of someone who's done an engine conversion on a TE-TJ model? Inparticular the 6G72 SOHC -> 6G72 DOHC Mivec? I know RPW's site lists it as an option and Dave has said it's a straight swap but I want to know if anyone has done it. They have a Mivec available for purchase but I don't think they've done a conversion yet.

Can anyone help?

no one has done it on AM, if they have they've kept it a pretty good secret!!!

in regards to swapping, it should be an easy swap as dave says, the bottom end is exactly the same, its just the heads are a little different....

Yeah. The people I've been talking to say it should be a straight swap as it comes from a KF Verada. I think it's really a Diamante but minor point. My main worry would be the transmission mating up as I'd want to use my manual.

Yeah. The people I've been talking to say it should be a straight swap as it comes from a KF Verada. I think it's really a Diamante but minor point. My main worry would be the transmission mating up as I'd want to use my manual.
i'd have to guess it would be the same mounts... the autos in Jap and Aus are the same spec and seeing as the blocks are the same and our manual fits with the auto (A = B = C :? ) then it should fit no worries, and being a manual you dont have to worry about the ECU!!!

Yeah, engine mount's would be the same. I was worried about the bolt pattern from block to tranny. Dave also thought that I'd need to go after market on the ECU as it's Mivec and I don't have an auto or something else to do with the wiring harness. I wonder if funky_fresian_cows might have any knowledge?

Yeah, engine mount's would be the same. I was worried about the bolt pattern from block to tranny. Dave also thought that I'd need to go after market on the ECU as it's Mivec and I don't have an auto or something else to do with the wiring harness. I wonder if funky_fresian_cows might have any knowledge?
yeah, the mounts are what i was getting at earlier....

as for the ECU, if i was doing a conversion of that magnitude (no pun intended), i would be going with an aftermarket one anyway!!! assuming you could get it to work all the accessory crap (like what booya had drama's with) it would all be sweet!!! i reckon an easy 230kW ATF!!

as for the ECU, if i was doing a conversion of that magnitude (no pun intended), i would be going with an aftermarket one anyway!!!

Yeah, I was going to get one regardless of engine swap. The Greddy does VTEC but I don't think it does Mivec. Dave mentioned a possible solution. Ideally I'd use a system that could control Mivec but if there isn't one out there then dang.

I reakon they should stop fart arseing around with the SOHC engines and start modifying the MIVEC ones :D . Why cant the TT magna get traction? The fastest FWD car in Australia ( probably has been beaten now ) was a honda CRX with a 1.8 litre Integra Type R engine in it and it had over 280kw @ the wheels and 350kw @ the engine. Thats more power ( just )and less weight but it still gets traction and does runs of 11.2 sec. :roll:

Yeha dohc motors should be stock standard out here.

MIVEC should be an option on the high spec models at the very least!

Yeha dohc motors should be stock standard out here.

MIVEC should be an option on the high spec models at the very least!


its all about royalties mma isnt willing to spend the extra kesh to licence the engine.

Yeah thats coz MMC is a bunch of cardigan wearers whereas MMAL wants it to make some street monsters

The Ralliart is the best example..they did that as an act of defiance against MMC

its a strait fit...there was a guy in syd (parra area) with this conversion with a manual box...would easily keep up with a modded R33 gts-t.

good conversion i reckon...dont have ne more info for u thow...as the guy was sellin up bout 6months ago.

Yeah thats coz MMC is a bunch of cardigan wearers whereas MMAL wants it to make some street monsters


then why do you have that pair of pink fluffly dice hanging from your rearview mirror ? :lol:

Whilst flicking through a couple of perfomance car magazines, I've noticed someone offering front cuts of the 3000GT

Reckon it'll go into a second generation body? Of course, a LSD will be needed, and traction'll probably be a pipe dream, but whatdya think?

Sounds like a good idea gav. was actually thinking of putting TTV6 out of a GTO into my sigma but got a TH instead. now Im trying to get rid of the sigma so i can do more mods to my TH!

[quote:166e97e28c="Killbilly"]Yeah thats coz MMC is a bunch of cardigan wearers whereas MMAL wants it to make some street monsters


then why do you have that pair of pink fluffly dice hanging from your rearview mirror ? :lol:[/quote:166e97e28c]

Ahhh MMC got to my car!! Noooo!! :lol: :lol:

And Gav:

http://www.fastmagna.com/feature/feature4_part2.html

Hope that answers your question :D

I reakon they should stop fart arseing around with the SOHC engines and start modifying the MIVEC ones :D . Why cant the TT magna get traction? The fastest FWD car in Australia ( probably has been beaten now ) was a honda CRX with a 1.8 litre Integra Type R engine in it and it had over 280kw @ the wheels and 350kw @ the engine. Thats more power ( just )and less weight but it still gets traction and does runs of 11.2 sec. :roll:

The Magna is a great car and is more than competetive with dunnydores and the like for performance. But lets face it its a front wheel drive and that fact alone means that it will always have trouble getting its power down in flat out straight line acceleration. Its a simple matter of weight transfer to the non driving wheels under acceleration. Unfortunately (or fortunately)you cannot rewrite the laws of physics. As for the use of MIVEC engines. Cost and bottom line is probably the reason for not using Mivec or DOHC. The bean counters have probaly looked at it and said no. Unless they can justify the extra costs by way of increased sales and greater profit. These people exist to make money first and foremost. If they could sell an inferior product and still turn over a profit they would. Look at the engine in the commodore as a prime example.

Nigel

Yeah thats coz MMC is a bunch of cardigan wearers whereas MMAL wants it to make some street monsters
But they make the Evolution Lancer over there, not to mention the Pajero thats Turbocharged.


The Ralliart is the best example..they did that as an act of defiance against MMC
Hmm, Interesting theory. I think that its MMAL without the balls because they could have given us DOHC a long time ago (TR/TS) and even the NZ model V3000 (TM-TP Magnas) were powered by the 6G72.

I think it comes down to what the australian market is willing to pay, and sadly, its as least as possible.

[quote:aa9e1d5edc]But lets face it its a front wheel drive and that fact alone means that it will always have trouble getting its power down in flat out straight line acceleration.[/quote:aa9e1d5edc]

I beg to differ, most FWD cars weigh less therefore need less power to match a RWD car therefore since it has less power it can get equal or more traction ( with the right set up ). Hmmm i wonder if a SR20det will fit in the engine bay. At least that engine has balls.

mr Charisma,

We can argue forever here, a FWD set up can save weight compared to a RWD set up for obvious reasons. But straight line acceleration is about many factors and weight is important but so is traction. Take a look at the specs of a WRX or SKYLINE GTR . They are both far from light cars and in some cases their power to weight ratios are inferior to many rear wheel drive cars and even some FWDS. Where they really perform is in acceleration. Thats because they have four wheels to proportion their torque through, so performance robbing wheel spin can be kept at bay. Of course with enough power you can overcome traction in any set up. If straight line acceleration was my only criteria for purchasing a car then I would stay clear of a FWD. even with all the techonology available like traction control, LSD, tyres etc al this stuff is still available to the RWD brigade. Noyting can stop the front end of a car, any car becoming light under acceleration and when that happens wheel spin is just around the corner. Once traction control kicks in precious time is lost as torque is reduced to the wheels.

Nigel

Hmm, Interesting theory. I think that its MMAL without the balls because they could have given us DOHC a long time ago (TR/TS) and even the NZ model V3000 (TM-TP Magnas) were powered by the 6G72.

I think it comes down to what the australian market is willing to pay, and sadly, its as least as possible.

It's not a theory, it has been documented that's why it happened.

MMC makes the performance cars, they wont allow other countries to make them...THAT'S why they're bastards.

Not saying that your wrong but its funny how you mention the WRX and the GTR, both AWD and both turbo so of course they are going to win against a RWD N/A V8 for example since max torque for a turbo car is around 3000 - 3500 rpm where the RWD will be up around the 5000 mark therefore the turbo has more of a constant power and the V8 has a peak power.

As for weight they only weigh 1.5t or so, which is on par with a magna.. 8's weight another 2-3 hundred more.

Was that to me? Coz it was irrelevant? lol

Mr Charisma said

Not saying that your wrong but its funny how you mention the WRX and the GTR, both AWD and both turbo so of course they are going to win against a RWD N/A V8 for example since max torque for a turbo car is around 3000 - 3500 rpm where the RWD will be up around the 5000 mark therefore the turbo has more of a constant power and the V8 has a peak power.

As for weight they only weigh 1.5t or so, which is on par with a magna.. 8's weight another 2-3 hundred more.

What turbo engines are you comparing to V8s ? A lot of V8s produce a very high percentage of there max torque over a large part of the rev range, so whether the max figure is at 5000 rpm or 10000 is a moot point if the car has a reltively flat curve from low rpm. I think you will find that a lot of V8s produce max torque well before 5000 rpm that also goes for most 6 ers. Its virtually impossible to directly compare turbos to V8s, RWD to FWD and 4WD.

nigel

Anyways, back to the REAL topic...

no one has done it on AM, if they have they've kept it a pretty good secret!!!

in regards to swapping, it should be an easy swap as dave says, the bottom end is exactly the same, its just the heads are a little different....
How easy would it be to convert the 6G74 to suit the MIVEC heads. Obviously there are a lot of oil gallery diff. for the Mivec actuation, but I've seen Non-VTec's fitted with VTec heads, & 1.6l Mivec heads on 1.8l Lancer motor? so there can't be a HUGE diff. Has anyone seen or heard of this?
DAVE?

A few of us have pondered this. I think Dave said that it probably could be engineered but it's one of those things that you won't know until you try and then it's going to cost a fair bit.

The problem is not the heads fitting but the timing belt setup and other factros as the 3.0 mivec heads came out on a 3.0 remember, and the 3.5 runs a larger V pattern so odds are the manifold will not fit onto the mivec heads on teh 3.5 engine.

That is where some of the fun starts.

A larger V pattern as in a greater angle?

Yes because the 3.5 blocks are an extra 1/2 inch taller than th 3.0 blocks and hence why they use a different intake manifold

Ahh... okay. Thanks Dave. And you reckon the Mivec would fit straight into my car hey? (de ja vu? :D )

I know it will fit straight into a TE on magna as it came out of the same chassis.

IT is teh comptuer which would take time to sort out but nothing to fear there.

A larger V pattern as in a greater angle?

Redav,

The size of the V angle measured in degrees will remain constant regardless of the length of the V section of the block.

Nigel

Yup, okay. Gotchya. Cheers.

I know it will fit straight into a TE on magna as it came out of the same chassis.

Yeah, I realise that. My only concern is the Mivec plugging up to my manual transmission instead if using the tiptronic it comes with.

Mitsubishi is very good with interchangeability due to the fact that the auto and manuel bolts up the same. Yo wuodl be able to use the same magna flywheel and just need to make a special clutch that is all.

Of this I have no doubts abotu at all.

Mitsubishi is very good with interchangeability due to the fact that the auto and manuel bolts up the same. Yo wuodl be able to use the same magna flywheel and just need to make a special clutch that is all.

You know, that makes sence. I mean, there's a manual, auto and tiptronic all mating to the 3.0 and 3.5 blocks. Mind you manufacturing and tooling doesn't always make sence.

What's involved with making a special clutch? So, you'd use the flywheel from the Magna on the Mivec engine? Any idea why the flywheel on the Mivec couldn't be used? Could you use the same clutch assembly from the Magna if you're using the Magna flywheel? I think we're getting into undiscovered territory here. You're not aware of such a conversion, are you? I've tried a few avenues and come up empty handed. One of the dudes from Motor reckoned it would work and you may have some fun with the ECU / Mivec and no longer an auto side of things.

Essentially this is very easy.

Use standard magna clutch and flywheel.
But need to use a performance clutch as the standard clutch would kill itself straight away.
Use the same clutch as in my magna but with a standard cover plate that way you know its nice and light to use but will take the load no problems.

Also better consider a LSD as it is going to need it.
Funny enough I just happen to have one in stock :D

ECU would be no problems either go straight to a Haltech which woudl simplify things or we could fit the Mivec ECU and just delete the auto side of the fittings where necessary.

Just would take time to sort out but not something I would be concerned about

Ahh... okay. My bad. I thought you meant a different clutch setup. My current clutch is okay at the moment but I don't expect it to last for ever. I'd definately go for something like what you and Killbilly have. An LSD would definately be on the cards. Okay, so the Mivec ECU does the same job as the normal ECU that we have but also controls the Mivec component? I'd be looking at a piggyback like the e-Manage for tuning, smart move? Motor Mag's Dean Evans main comment was: 'The problem may be using the auto-configured ECU which, without its sequential shifting sensors hooked up, may go into limp mode or at best need modifying to cope'.

He also mentioned this: 'I think the MIVEC blocks have extra ribbing'. But that was when talking about swapping heads. I'd not do that but I was wondering what this ribbing was?

Thanks, Dave.

The extra ribbing is internal to the engine for more structural support.

They may be right about the mivec sensors - that is really the only unknown factor

They may be right about the mivec sensors - that is really the only unknown factor

Could be fun. Is it just based on RPM? Could the e-Manage operate Mivec and could you change the Mivec point? Could you use an existing ECU and use the Greddy unit for tuning and Mivec control? Could the ECU harness be compatable?

Any idea if it's possible to get 250 HP or more at the wheels for an NA engine like this? Wonder what sort of a quarter you could get?


Any idea if the ancillaries are all located in the same place? Nothing shifted about?

Redav,

I think its intersting what you are thinking of doing with fitting Mivec heads to your engine. From what I have read so far it sounds like this could turn into a very time consuming and expensive project. Dont get me wrong by all means if this is what you want to do then go for it. But have you considered some other tried and proven ways of getting more horses. Its always easier to let others do the hard R and D work first. Im probably a few years older than you and I have seen lots of young guys over the years spend a lot of money on cars and then regret it. If I was looking at getting substantially more power to play with, I would look at just getting another car . Probably work out cheaper and save a lot of time. Im ready too be shot down in flames here but I am justing saying that it would pay to consider all the alternatives before undertaking an ambitious project. If you think that your up to it than by all means go for it.

Good Luck

Nigel

I think its intersting what you are thinking of doing with fitting Mivec heads to your engine.

Nah, the whole engine, mate. I initially asked about the viability of such a silly idea but was only really interested in the whole engine.

Thanks for the thought though.