Hey all!
Just a post to say I have flowed my own TB and it was an absolute peice of cake!

First up, BIG THANKS to EZBoy. Basically I was gonna ask him to do it but he doesn't do them anymore, and he gave me the tips and confidence to go ahead with it.
I will also be making my own CAI soon following in his footsteps :D

Anyway, probly been covered before but heres what I did in exact order;


Went to Supercheap and bought a dremel ripoff for $39
Drove home and using only a socket set, removed the throttle body via the 5 bolts.
Marked the Accel cable position and undid 2 bolts to let me undo cable from buttefly easier
undid 3 plugs off TB and 4 or 5 vaccum hoses, take a photo if you think you will forget
Now for the fun part!
Read dremel rip-off manual in poor engrish...
Blu-takked all holes
attached conical stone and with fear in my heart, attacked main intake side lip.
made confused face and attacked some more
still not alot of material coming off...


OK, i will stop here and clarify those last 2 points.
Everyone has been going on about how you need to be soooooooo cautious and how you must have a skilled hand, etc. etc.
Look, i personally had a hard time getting the stone to cut fast enough. In the end i used a round stone which i think did a better job... hey, i might have had a soft stone, who knows, but dont be scared, you won't muck it up, i mean it. I kept the butterfly closed mostly the whole time and only opened it for the final smoothing, I didn't find it got in the way at all...
(remember, butterfly closed, you cant muck up seating position!!)

OK, well anyway once i had done intake top and bottom i progressed to the infinitely rougher plenum side and attacked. The idea is basically not to cut away all material, but smooth any rough edges as much as possible. Mind you i did cut away alot of material... lol

I then used the included bit of sandpaper on a drum tool (linisher i was told its called) and smoothed all the surfaces even more.

Then to be a bit of a perfectionist i used the wire wheel attachment to polish it all shiney like :D

Tool came with all these attachments for the $39 - its superworks brand, 2 year warranty, etc.

Washed it all out with a bit of WD-40, had a hell of a time getting all the blu-tak back out of the holes, and stuck it back on the engine!


OK, what did i notice? Not alot really to begin with.
Engine below 2000rpm feels 'lighter' if i can call it that, but see, my driving style means i don't generally drive in that rev range much, or at least i didn't, until now.
Also i found that at cruise around town the engine sounds happier (this may sound wierd) but it does. It runs smoother now...
Also, once you get used to the new pedal feel you dont feel the need to mash it so much anymore, you can cruise about and not feel bogged down, i think that 0-3000rpm is what you guys call a flat spot, i just always thought 4000-7000rpm was the power band (which i lived in) but oh well...:confused:


All in all, cost me $39, about an hour and a half of time and i got a wicked dremelesque tool out of it!!!
Hey, if you want to learn to port and polish stuff? Start here, its very basic and i now feel confident that i could do some mild head work eg. port matching, polishing heads and intake runners, etc.

Oh yeah..! The best part an i forgot to mention it!! DUH!
OK, you know how magnas make that noise when you change gears at like 5000-6000 rpm and they go like vrooooooooom - chusssch! when they drop revs into the next gear?? Welll, that sweet as noise sounds much cleaner and passengers all reckon it sounds like i have a turbo now. Dunno how, it does, just beleive me!

Ok, I got like 8 pics if you want them posted... just request, im on dial up and they are 2megapix each and its 2am and yeah. request and ill post. It looks sexy. :cool:

http://users.bigpond.com/purcival/collage.jpg

Ive got a Ozito, same thing as dremel but cheaper. Might give this a go, hopefully wont mess it up, if i do ill blame you :badgrin: jks

yer i had a dremel cordless 40'000rpm unit, those things are the best, untill it died recently, rip :(

it wont really do much except increase throttle response ... it does feel faster cos it wants to accelarate with less throttle but at the end of the day at full throttle its really no different as that butterflt is still the same size ..

good work though.

have u found the butterfly to get a lil stickey? mine does occasionally since i did this

Ive got a Ozito, same thing as dremel but cheaper. Might give this a go, hopefully wont mess it up, if i do ill blame you :badgrin: jks
i got an ozito, got it the other weekend with the TB in mind, its just got to get over pulling something out of my car and going at it with an electric tool, hummm i need a mates car to have a go one. or a 2nd TB that would be good



also the butterfly is it on a rectangular bit, wouldn't it be good to smooth the edges of that as well. to give the best flow when a at full noise

it wont really do much except increase throttle response ... it does feel faster cos it wants to accelarate with less throttle but at the end of the day at full throttle its really no different as that butterflt is still the same size ..

BINGO!

The throttle response is nothing which couldn't have been gained by using a little more throttle aswell.

Oh yeah..! The best part an i forgot to mention it!! DUH!
OK, you know how magnas make that noise when you change gears at like 5000-6000 rpm and they go like vrooooooooom - chusssch! when they drop revs into the next gear?? Welll, that sweet as noise sounds much cleaner and passengers all reckon it sounds like i have a turbo now. Dunno how, it does, just beleive me!

Yeah I noticed this aswell, never really heard it until now and with the NZ CAI as well it certainly makes some serious induction noise :D

Can I ask what a NZ CAI is?

Cheers
Heath Young

Yeah i did notice it was a lil sticky but that was from aluminium swarf stuck in carbon deposits and i soon cleaned that out... i think it only occured when i let the throttle snap shut which never happens on vehicle anyway due to the slow down throttle shutting thing they put on it for emissions...

Can I ask what a NZ CAI is?

Cheers
Heath Young


There is a thread on here with some pics of the CAI in question.

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21975&d=1147840161

It was a CAI that every Diamante (TL/TW) had fitted over in NZ. It actually made a noticable difference as MMC NZ spent many months trying different CAI mods, and this particular one made the biggest difference. It's the same one that people have been buying from a company here in SA.

Very interesting - I remember seeing this and ppl bagging it for doing nothing.

I might track one of these down... Do you remember who was selling them?

Cheers
Heath Young

I'm interested in this CAI to. Any more pictures?

EDIT: Will this fit on a TJ?

2ND Edit: That a TJ in the pic yeah?

I'm interested in this CAI to. Any more pictures?

EDIT: Will this fit on a TJ?

2ND Edit: That a TJ in the pic yeah?

This was only used on the TL/TW range in NZ as it is very easy to get air from the grill area near the LH headlamp. With the TJ and earlier models air is drawn in from behind the headlamp with this CAI, which would hamper its efficiency somewhat. I have a Mitsubishi part no MN156778 but I am unsure if any local dealer will supply one as they are apparenty an MMC part that was ordered by and sent to MMC NZ.

Greenmat did something similar with 100mm tubing, a much cheaper and just as effective option.

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16688&highlight=easy+cai

Emtech in Adelaide are selling the above CAI for a figure on the high side of $160. I got mine s/hand from a fellow MMAL employee, otherwise I would have done something similar to what Greenmat did.

I will get some pics of mine up when I get a chance. Thats if I can upload a pic to the forums.

This was only used on the TL/TW range in NZ as it is very easy to get air from the grill area near the LH headlamp. With the TJ and earlier models air is drawn in from behind the headlamp with this CAI, which would hamper its efficiency somewhat. I have a Mitsubishi part no MN156778 but I am unsure if any local dealer will supply one as they are apparenty an MMC part that was ordered by and sent to MMC NZ.

Greenmat did something similar with 100mm tubing, a much cheaper and just as effective option.

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16688&highlight=easy+cai

Emtech in Adelaide are selling the above CAI for a figure on the high side of $160. I got mine s/hand from a fellow MMAL employee, otherwise I would have done something similar to what Greenmat did.

I will get some pics of mine up when I get a chance. Thats if I can upload a pic to the forums.

It was actually used by MMNZ on the TJ Diamante VR/VRX as well, it is commonly know by NZ dealers as the JC powerup kit.

Oh and emtech are charging $155 to supply this CAI.

I admit... I'm a bit slow, blind etc.

Is someone able to explain what material has been removed from the before pics? Maybe even draw arrows on the original photo?

I admit... I'm a bit slow, blind etc.

Is someone able to explain what material has been removed from the before pics? Maybe even draw arrows on the original photo?
As far as I understand it...

http://www.ecn.net.au/~belated/collage.jpg

It's just some metal that's been dremeled out of the middle.

lol looks like a gasket missing to me

too hard to tell how much was removerd
look at green on pic
need to do one and measure it before and after

is that rust in the butterfly??

What is done is to remove the step each side of the butterfly.

This job i NOT making the bore bigger, this is many orders of magnatude!! more difficult. Forgive the pun!!

The idea is to have a smooth shape both leading into and out of the butterfly area.

Just search the site to look at the original sketches of why this will improve the air flow through the TB.
Gerry

BINGO!

The throttle response is nothing which couldn't have been gained by using a little more throttle aswell.
That's what the theory states, but it makes the autos so much easier to drive around town. Barely need to touch the throttle to keep up with traffic. Frees your attention up a bit to focus on your boost gauge, fondle your girlfriend, pose in your pimped ride etc etc.

The important improvements from the flowing are the improved fuel econ and smoother low rpm running.

It is important when flowing the TB to make the air entry angle as flat as possible. So the removal of material at the top of the inlet lip between the TB lip and the butterfly is important. I used a small metal ruler to guage my progress but without compromising the seal of the butterfly.

It's good wholesome fun so get into it folks and where the grin that only comes with making and driving something you've achieved yourself. Good work and glad it turned out like the photo on the box :P

P.S. Use kerosine as a cutting oil for aluminium. Just poor about 10mm into the kero bottle lid and dip the cutting tip in after each attack and use your finger to smear it onto the TB surface to be cut. Kero also cleans up the TB grime too.

DON'T USE HYDROCARBON DEGREASERS ON THE TB AS THEY CAN DAMAGE THE PLASTIC COMPONENTS NOTABLY THE ISC AND TPS!!

P.S.S. Go to Bunnings etc and buy a high speed cutting tip. The ones I use are cylindrical shaped, approx 8mm in diameter. These will blitz thru this job in 30-40mins when you've done a few. Don't but the carbide cutters as they will cut too fast and don't protrude from the shaft enuf to provide a useful and accesible cutting action/ability esp around the butterfly.

Peace.

When i did this the hardest part was getting one of the screws that holds the butterfly in place out ( i.e. the actual flap of metal). I ended up drilling it out and replacing it with a new bolt and some epoxy resin stuff, did the job.

It doesnt do alot but it does help with off the line starts, i also find that it lets my auto reach the sweet spot ( and hence the sweet noise with the lukey back box) much quicker.

One thing to note is that after i milled it out i polished the whole thing with what can best be described as a cloth polishing wheel, took an extra 5 minutes but was well worth it, looked stock after i'd finished.....

With the cutting tip I mentioned, you can work right upto the butterfly and under it without removing it. Saves time and hassle.

hate to revive an old thread but did anyone notice a change in induction noise after performing this

my response and all that is better it just sounds different

Possible to do on a 2nd gen at all?:confused:

it would be possible to do to any car if it needs it
principle would be the small make it flow better

On my TL VRX AWD (auto) with stock induction snorkel I couldn't hear any increase in induction noise (although I'm told that I've got selective deadfness; does that apply to cars?).

The best gain that I got was greatly improved drivablity in traffic. The lag between putting your foot down and anything happening has geen greatly reduced.

Ken

That's what the theory states, but it makes the autos so much easier to drive around town. Barely need to touch the throttle to keep up with traffic. Frees your attention up a bit to focus on your boost gauge, fondle your girlfriend, pose in your pimped ride etc etc.

We are talking about a high flowed throttle here, with the same size throttle plate are we not?


The important improvements from the flowing are the improved fuel econ and smoother low rpm running.

The air before the throttle is travelling very slow. It really picks up as it passes the throttle plate and then slows down again as it enters the vacuum section. The plenum chamber is designed to slow down the air and allow even flow. No matter what a throttle body does to the air, the plenum sorts it out.

The plenum chamber is designed to slow down the air and allow even flow. No matter what a throttle body does to the air, the plenum sorts it out.



Could you explain this into more detail please Jason?

It basically uses a venturi effect, where when pressure increases, velocity drops and vice-versa. So where the air is passing through the butterfly there is a low pressure zone and thus the air has a high velocity. When it enters the plenum chamber it enters an area of fairly low pressure(lower than atmospheric), so the air's velocity becomes very low.

If the air had a high velocity then the runners at the endof the plenum chamber would get a lot more air than those that are near the throttle body, due to the air 'over running' past the runner entrances.

Hope that helped.

Its actually Bernoulli's Law dude.

V1*A1=V2*A2=Q

V is velocity at each point (point 1 and point 2)
A is area at each point (point 1 and point 2)
Q is flow (standard notation is Q for some odd reason, maybe f was taken, its been too long for me to remember that uni rubbish)

Q is constant (not really relevent but helps complete the equation if Q is know but another value is not)

If say through the throttle plate(point 1), there is a 0.10m^2(keeping units constant) opening and flow is at 10m/s

V1=10m/s A1=0.10m^2

Now the plenum chambers cross section area is MUCH MUCH larger, at least double.

A2=0.30m^2

Therefor V2 is the unknown so re-arrange to calculate

V1*A1=V2*A2

0.1*10=V2*0.3

0.1*10/0.3=V2

V2=0.3meters per second vs 10m/s through the throttle

Now the punch line, as if that isn't an obvious killer for the argument;

At cruise and light load, there is FRIG ALL opening in the throttle, so your looking at roughly 3 or 4 percent of a 60mm throttle (which is 3.1415*0.009 = 0.0028m^2) and then the area of a plenum is usually around the 0.1m^2 mark, which is about 10x10cm..

Now I try avoid comming on here and dashing dreams from fear of getting banned again, but this is a no brainer. Highflowing a throttle body without changing the throttle plate size is not going to make ANY difference.

The fluid flow through it is already getting smashed to pieces as it splits between the top and the bottom of the throttle to sneak through the throttle openings(light load) and then is comming to a relative stand still before being drawn in to the intake runners.

Its what a plenum is there for.

errrrrrrrrrr...... yes.. i knew that!:D

Good post TC.


Now I try avoid comming on here and dashing dreams from fear of getting banned again,

Maybe add IMO after every post. lol

Good post TC.



Maybe add IMO after every post. lol

How about, IM expert, experienced and qualified O :P

How about, IM expert, experienced and qualified O :P

You will probably get told to get of your high horse, and Charades are for girls/and or a social miming game..lol

The important improvements from the flowing are the improved fuel econ and smoother low rpm running.


I must admit that flowing mine had absolutly no effect on fuel economy. :confused: Yes the throttle was a lot snappier off idle but with my TL AWD VRX I have found it always requires more right foot as apposed to my brothers manual TL VRX. Dammed drive train loss.

Craig O, the increase in throttle responce is something you could have had with a un-modified throttle by simply putting your foot down a little more.

A high-flow/larger throttle CAN NOT increase torque/power down low, only at WOT and even then you need a very highly modded machine to need a bigger throttle.

Craig O, the increase in throttle responce is something you could have had with a un-modified throttle by simply putting your foot down a little more.

A high-flow/larger throttle CAN NOT increase torque/power down low, only at WOT and even then you need a very highly modded machine to need a bigger throttle.


I hear ya mate. I fitted my old unmodified one back on the car last night and driving home form work today, I found the car felt smoother, and yes after being concious about the change in throttle body, I found that I was using the same amount of throttle as I did as with the modified one.

Plus I ditched the K&N panel filter I had and it's nice to have lost that flat spot and get a little torque back in the lower rev range.

I hear ya mate. I fitted my old unmodified one back on the car last night and driving home form work today, I found the car felt smoother, and yes after being concious about the change in throttle body, I found that I was using the same amount of throttle as I did as with the modified one.

Plus I ditched the K&N panel filter I had and it's nice to have lost that flat spot and get a little torque back in the lower rev range.
YAY YAY YAY YAY YAY YAY!

I got through to someone :D