Ok, I was talking to my mate thats doing my boot install today regarding the directions with boot installs and what-not in my TR.
Part of the discussion that came up related to chioces of subs and speakers etc and rear speakers - here is the question.

How many ppl can say they knew about the effects of subs in a boot and rear speakers regarding the movement of air mass in the boot? anyone?

Ok, let' look at the problem.

Basics.
You got a pair of rear speakers and they are ripping out the tunes pretty good but you need more boom in your bass. Whaddya do.... add some subs, cool ay?
Maybe.
What happens when you put the subs in and they go boom-bigga-boom to tha bass you got thumpin inta them bigmutha subs from yo bigboy amps??? anyone?
Ok, so you have a standard boot with subs added, not too bad coz most of the air will move under loading around the sides of the boot walls and throught to the cabin via the side panels in a coupe or through the inner side area in a sedan.
BUT....
you went an did the big expensive fancy looking coolio way out install with nice matched sealed panels and really well bolted in hardware....
So where is all that bass air gunna go now?
Unless you have well sealed rear speakers in the shelf, guess where it's going to try to go - straight thru your expensive fancy rear shelf speakers.

So, does anyone besides me ever consider the effect of mass air movement on the little old rear parcel shelf speakers?

Here's a little experiment you can do yourselves if you have a sub installed and rear shelf speakers - disconnect the rear shelf speakers or fade to the front completely (as long as your sub amp is not connected to the rear output too) and tehn crank it up.
Take a good hard look at what your little rear shelf speakers are doing now then ask yourself what you are gunna do about it.

This is why he always suggest sedans do rear door speakers and coupes do rear side compartment sealed rear speakers and in both cases use plain old speaker grills over open rear shelf holes and you might be surprised what you see on a audio SPL meter too

Happy boom boxing ppl.

Rear speakers are just for rear fill anyway.. Ive never paid much attention to whats in my parcel shelf. I have front splits, and a few subs, and Its always been faded towards the front..

Even with your subs in a small box though, they push massive amounts of air through the boot (I know you can feel the air flow from mine with your hand just outside the boot when its open!) which always moves those rear speakers.. They end up working against each other.

Its nice to see someone actually paying attention to the effect of more speakers & speaker placement.. Theres certainly a lot to learn about car audio.. (most of it is in Tim's head too!)

Yeh my 6x9's cones move, probably not good for them at all. I might start leaving the centre flap open to relief some of the air pressure, probably sound better too :P.

Hey - it just turns the 6x9s into passive radiators...

but as Misti said - its just rear fill

I was aware of this but there only 6x9s. If the blow so be it. I have them running on high pass and faded mostly to the front. Only one is going at the moment anyway. Refer to the strange problem thread.

i pulled out my rear fill.. gives more room for air to move into the cabin, and means i dont have any crappy rear speakers.. problem solved! :D

i pulled out my rear fill.. gives more room for air to move into the cabin, and means i dont have any crappy rear speakers.. problem solved! :D

The whole parcel shelf and metal? Pics?

nah, just the rear speakers (also known as a rear fill).. i'd love to take out the parcel metal.. but that is unfortunately very illegal and results in red stickers :P

nah, just the rear speakers (also known as a rear fill).. i'd love to take out the parcel metal.. but that is unfortunately very illegal and results in red stickers :P

Weight reduction yo, with the speakers... oh and red stickers = FASTER

My mates rear fill got ripped to shreds by his subs, the surrounds just ripped apart.

I took mine out a long time ago, the magna boot is notorious for not being great for bass, anything you can do to help out is worthwhile. And my amps are mounted directly below the parcel shelf with around 1 inch of breathing space above, so these are perfect for aiding in air circulation, (not that i've had any problems with overheating, but best to be on the safe side)

Ditch the rears and learn what real car audio is all about :)

It will aide in your staging, (improving stage depth, it will help focus your image (multiple point sources playing the same frequency are the worst thing for staging.

Peace

Tim

not being good for bass? hrm.. i didnt have any idea about what they were like SPL wise until i tryed it for myself.. and i was getting windscreen wiper bounce, door flex, rear bar excursion, and people unable to swallow their drink.. so they cant be all bad :P

yeah i found this out the easy way too. i put 4 12's in facing upwards :bowrofl: only had crappy sony 6x9's in parcel shelf, they sounded terrible after a couple of hours. so i juz took them out and removed the covers. found that the covers rattled a hell of a lot too. so they went. sounded alot better as i cant hear the distortion anymore, also opened the armrest bit, and that made a hell of a lot of difference. soooo much more bass. also i have the 2 12's on the right running in 0 phase, and left running in 180 phase. that also helped alot coz when they were all running 0 phase the fought against eachother. but yeah. no more 6x9's or covers.

I must admit I am very lucky with the Bora. It is a sedan with hatch like acoustics ( for bass reproduction ). Also the rear fill is mounted in the rear doors in split form so that you can't really hear it affecting the front stage but loud enough for the people in the back to enjoy. Bora will soon score some more nice Boston gear. :D

rear fills are just as important and should have similar stats as fronts for best sound reproduction. also in a magna, because of the opening to the boot, ported box facing into the car is best for clearer sound.. i talked to the dude from tower audio about all this **** on friday

If ir sounds good to you thats all that matters....

In total i spent $230 on all four of my speakers and couldnt be happier and yes i love my rear fill:D

rear fills are just as important and should have similar stats as fronts for best sound reproduction. also in a magna, because of the opening to the boot, ported box facing into the car is best for clearer sound.. i talked to the dude from tower audio about all this **** on friday

who were you talking to there??

who were you talking to there??

everyone who says that you can get crappy speakers for the rear as they arent important anyway.. they arent important but will distort the sound if fronts and rears are different spec..

best spot in a magna for a woofer position i can assure you is in a rear corner of the boot, firing forward at the opposite corner of the boot, it really hides the woofers position in the car, gives great clarity and sounds fantastic :)

and in regards to rear fill.. it really comes down to preference. some prefer only having fronts, to replicate the sound from a stage (thus the term 'staging'). some have front and rears for that wholesome 'enveloped in sound' kind of feeling. some use fronts with ambient tweets in the rear + sub. then theres the 5.1 AV systems :D all preference, but if your going to have rears at all, imo its better to do it properly.. i mean a decent set of front splits is more than enough for your rear passengers to listen to happily, if you want better, may as well go that extra mile and invest in some decent rears as well :)

Ive actually had my rear speakers removed for months and months now since i put the subs in i couldnt really hear too much from the back anyway.

ever since the rear speakers were removed my ears havent been happier and the hair on my head moving when bass hits and my poor eardrums.

Its also funnier when a mate asks what speakers u got in the back and u say they are my bass vents lol

Tom

everyone who says that you can get crappy speakers for the rear as they arent important anyway.. they arent important but will distort the sound if fronts and rears are different spec..
nah not questioning that, just wanted to know, cos i know Adam... was he there?

nah not questioning that, just wanted to know, cos i know Adam... was he there?

yeah i was speaking to him for about an hour and a half, good bloke. got some quotes for rockford gear.. still thinking about it :)