Wifes car wont start... usually when hot.......

I know a lot of guys have the same problem.

My mechanic called me today to see if i have solved it as he has another car with the same problem.

This is what we have looked at so far with the help from these forums and what we have found at the workshop.

Faulty Imobiliser antenna?? looked at it, cleaned the terminal, its just a piece of wire really nothing can go faulty on it.

Whist not starting......

1. Was giving us injector pulses

2. Was giving us spark therefore the ignition side was still active

Makes me turn to fuel...

Fuel Pump?? The other Magna had the fuel pump changed to drive down to the local shop and it wouldnt start.

SO

We stuck the thing on the analyser to give us a immobiliser fault...54 from memory...

OK maybe maybe not

We cleared the fault codes

after a while the car wouldnt start,,

Analyser again.... no fault codes....

OK this is where we get to dig a bit deeper....

Does the imobiliser kill the fuel supply (pump)when active???

Can anyone send me a wiring diagram for the 96-97 Maggies or point me in the right direction in these forums.

I want to work out how to bypass the immobiliser (i doubt anyone would want to pinch it..i wish they would.. and if they try they wouldnt be able to start the bastard) hahaha

cheers

Paul

I have the same non starting problems sometimes. A definitive answer would be great.

theres two things that cause this problem and may be the same in your case
1. check the connections on the ignition barrel as the sometimes lose contact, just bend them out abit and it should be fine
2. the wire the connects the ECU to the imobiliser, the wire needs to be re-soldied on the ECU side. theres a thread around stating how this is done
http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43689&highlight=problems
says for TJ's but you never know its worth a try

I had the same problem not long ago. After a lot of stuffing around my car ended up at mitsubishi and they replaced the immobilzer antenna and that fixed the problem.

had random start problems after i installed a new battery.
seemed to happen after it was sitting in the hot sun a while.

no fault codes... eventually after 1.5weeks it went away itself :nuts:

theres two things that cause this problem and may be the same in your case
1. check the connections on the ignition barrel as the sometimes lose contact, just bend them out abit and it should be fine
2. the wire the connects the ECU to the imobiliser, the wire needs to be re-soldied on the ECU side. theres a thread around stating how this is done
http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43689&highlight=problems
says for TJ's but you never know its worth a try

OK for starters it doesnt stall but ill look at the ignition barrel switch connector anyway....

Secondly, how would you directly solder a wire to the module when you have a largish connector connecting the other wires to the modules...hmm unless i solder close to the module and maybe file out a bit of the plastic for clearance for the new wire... yep its worth a go.

ill let u all know what happens

if the problem is in the ignition barrel the car wont start at all
cause the imobiliser doesnt deactivate

thats why i want to look at the ignition barrel switch the car wont start at all so the wife waits 2 to 5 minutes then it will start again

So if the car starts then immediately stalls it isnt a problem with the immobiliser aerial? Also I put in a new battery a few weeks ago and it still does it.

my stupid car has same problems, and its deffffinatly not the fuel pump as i had mine changed and it still happens.

So if the car starts then immediately stalls it isnt a problem with the immobiliser aerial? Also I put in a new battery a few weeks ago and it still does it.

sounds like a vacum leak, havent played around with your intake or throttle body?

Are you guys running the Mitsubishi Diamond battery or an older Exide battery?

The Mitsubishi batteries tend not to go flat immediately, however they will become unreliable for charge.

Do all magnas come standard with an immobiliser? If yea when Does it turn on and what does it cut out?

Don't mean to Hijack, just the topics were raised and Thought I'd ask while im about

Do all magnas come standard with an immobiliser? If yea when Does it turn on and what does it cut out?

Don't mean to Hijack, just the topics were raised and Thought I'd ask while im about

thats what im asking...from what ive experienced when the car doesnt start, i get injector pulse and i get spark so i guess it would be fuel that cuts out.

no the Mitsubishi battery died ages ago, i have an aftermarket one now

it cranks over easily so id say theres good charge there

sounds like a vacum leak, havent played around with your intake or throttle body?

Actually it has been played with, EZ boy swapped it out with a flowed one. It does it maybe one start in 30 so its hard to track it down. I will check all the hoses though.

My Father-in-Law's TR won't start unless you move it through the gears (Auto-box) and then back into Park / Neutral.

My Father-in-Law's TR won't start unless you move it through the gears (Auto-box) and then back into Park / Neutral.

But does it crank over?? if it doesn't then its you neutral starter switch

Ok bit more info...

i looked a this info


http://martybugs.net/articles/magna-stall.cgi

this info is good but a bit misleading for earlier Magna models like my TE

i was looking at the link but that was steering more for the TJ model, mines the TE, i think that i have located the immob.. module, this is the module under the stereo, drivers side in the actual console behind two relays. i traced the brown/white wires from the Diagnostic connector to find this.

i assume that the ecu is the large box with the colored connectors sitting on the hump near the firewall.

there is no chance in hell for someone to solder a wire directly from the ecu to the immobiliser....i CAN call myself a soldering expert, but i dont recomend anyone trying this as you could damage your ecu...

the other option is to clean the plug and pins at the ecu end with contact cleaner. Can be bought at Radio Parts or electronic stores etc.

It got dark so i put the whole shebang back together again.

I was right though in assuming that the imobiliser kills the fuel pump, someone else sensed the same thing.

I WILL LOOK INTO THIS FURTHER!!

cheers
Paul

may also be the fuel pump relay.... another thing to check....getting closer....

if your car is sparking i cant really help you, or if the engine is turning over i cant help u,

butt when i first bought my car, i found that i would park it, come back it it and i would turn the key...nothing would happen...

i put the gear in drive, then pushed it back into park and it started...

now i know your all not stupid, and your problem could be alot more complicated, but i thought i would add my 2 cents, just incase it saves you some money taking it to a dealer :)

No this is quite different, the car starts then immediately stalls.

my mechanic fixed my problem although i got no idea if it relates to you.. when you car is is netural or park does it rev (up to 1500) and then just drop, and do it again and again? well thats what mine was doing and my mechanic hooked up a digonostics to it and came back with nothing, although then he figured out that the diognostics was too new and didnt have all the cods, he tracked down an older one, and found out i had a faulty coolent temp sensor.. but yeh dunno worth a try if it just idles everywhere, part only cost me 60 bucks so!

when you try start your car does it crank over? if it does look at the instrument cluster while its cranking and see if all the ignition lights come on. If they do it means that you still have starter and ignition. Therefore youre immobiliser is disarmed.

immobilisers will either cut out starter motor, ignition or both. So if you have both ur starter and ignition circuit then it wont be the immobiliser thats making your car not start.

Failing that pull the fuel line off your fuel rail and get someone to turn the key to ignition, if no fuel comes out then that means you have no fuel coming to your fuel rail so that will be why your car dosn't start.

-Daniel

Mine would start and stop again within a couple of seconds.

Worked out from these forums it was in two wire connector from immobilisor to ignition barrel under dash just to left of ignition switch.

Took it to Mitsubishi dealer who new all about the problem which is apparently fairly common

Cut out connector and soldered wires together.

15 min job

Problem solved

Cheers

Does anybody have any pictures of this connector?

Does anybody have any pictures of this connector?

This one?

http://martybugs.net/articles/images/magna_ecu.jpg

Cheers,
Martin.

Does the imobiliser kill the fuel supply (pump)when active???

Can anyone send me a wiring diagram for the 96-97 Maggies or point me in the right direction in these forums.

I want to work out how to bypass the immobiliser (i doubt anyone would want to pinch it..i wish they would.. and if they try they wouldnt be able to start the bastard) hahaha

cheers

Paul

No it doesnt.

I called mitsu yesterday when i was fitting my new alarm to ask which was the fuel pump wire. they didnt know as they dont touch it when working on the factory imobiliser. so obviously its not part of the circuit

my mechanic fixed my problem although i got no idea if it relates to you.. when you car is is netural or park does it rev (up to 1500) and then just drop, and do it again and again? well thats what mine was doing and my mechanic hooked up a digonostics to it and came back with nothing, although then he figured out that the diognostics was too new and didnt have all the cods, he tracked down an older one, and found out i had a faulty coolent temp sensor.. but yeh dunno worth a try if it just idles everywhere, part only cost me 60 bucks so!


Yep ive heard this can be an issue also but it doesnt come up in the my codes

when you try start your car does it crank over? if it does look at the instrument cluster while its cranking and see if all the ignition lights come on. If they do it means that you still have starter and ignition. Therefore youre immobiliser is disarmed.

immobilisers will either cut out starter motor, ignition or both. So if you have both ur starter and ignition circuit then it wont be the immobiliser thats making your car not start.

Failing that pull the fuel line off your fuel rail and get someone to turn the key to ignition, if no fuel comes out then that means you have no fuel coming to your fuel rail so that will be why your car dosn't start.

-Daniel

i get spark and injector pulse but im almost 100% the immobiliser kills the fuel pump

Yep ive heard this can be an issue also but it doesnt come up in the my codes


do you have one of the older diognostics, cos my mech said that he had one of the newer one and it didnt have all the codes and he had to hunt down an older one for me?

i had this no starting problem as well, the car would run hot on occasions and the coolant would boil like a kettle lol turned out to be the coolant temp sensor and once replaced fixed all issues!! although it might not be the solution to you're issues

do you have one of the older diognostics, cos my mech said that he had one of the newer one and it didnt have all the codes and he had to hunt down an older one for me?

is there a way of getting the codes out manually??

for example in the commodores you short out 2 pins and a light flashes giving you the codes


By the way, its doesnt start then stop...it cranks but no start...as said b4 i do get spark and injector pulse, i played with the connectors on the ecu (pulled them off and on a few times to clean them) but the same is still happening.

maybe a intermittent pump relay?
intermittent pump?
temp sensor? is there a way i can check this?? resistance check and where is it located??
someone suggested to clean the terminals behind the ignition barrel

all worth a go
(its a TE btw)

is there a way of getting the codes out manually??

for example in the commodores you short out 2 pins and a light flashes giving you the codes



i have deff heard a way that you can do it manually.. imi prretty sure that its the same as the commodores although no idea where you would connect it or soemthing, but im sure soemone around here would know


By the way, its doesnt start then stop...it cranks but no start...as said b4 i do get spark and injector pulse, i played with the connectors on the ecu (pulled them off and on a few times to clean them) but the same is still happening.

maybe a intermittent pump relay?
intermittent pump?
temp sensor? is there a way i can check this?? resistance check and where is it located??
someone suggested to clean the terminals behind the ignition barrel

all worth a go
(its a TE btw)


ahhh okay well then it was a differant problem to me then. cos yeh mines would start then rev to 2000 and then cut down to 750, then rev to 2000 again and then cut out...

butt when i first bought my car, i found that i would park it, come back it it and i would turn the key...nothing would happen...

i put the gear in drive, then pushed it back into park and it started...


This is my personal bug-bear. Esp when I turn the car off and try to get the key out :rant:

my mechanic fixed my problem although i got no idea if it relates to you.. when you car is is netural or park does it rev (up to 1500) and then just drop, and do it again and again? well thats what mine was doing and my mechanic hooked up a digonostics to it and came back with nothing, although then he figured out that the diognostics was too new and didnt have all the cods, he tracked down an older one, and found out i had a faulty coolent temp sensor.. but yeh dunno worth a try if it just idles everywhere, part only cost me 60 bucks so!


OK I did the diagnostics test the manual way..

got code 21 coolant temp sensor!!!

as you said and same with my mates tester..code 21 didnt come up...

Ill go get a temp sensor and find out

BTW does anyone knpw where this sensor is located on the V6??

cheers

Paul

I hope this is it!!

Here it goes...

The car wouldn't start again....i simply pulled off the connecor from the coolant temp sensor and the thing started.

It did tho start up with the thermos working. I guess it thought it was either too hot or it started in limp mode. ( i didnt check for the engine lamp in the dash)

Rang Mitsu spares but they shut 11.30 on Sats

Rang repco, said thay have one... went there.... wrong one... apparently there are a few different types.

so then i thought ill try a few different resistances to stick in the socket to fool the ecu that the car has a temp sensor connected....

stuck in about 570 ohms and the thing runs fine

ill try to get a new temp sensor on Monday...

ill drive it all day morrow (SUNDAY) to see if it plays up...so far its fired up every time.

Cheers Paul

Repco had issues trying to find the coolant temp sensor but they rang me saying there is one in QLD 67 bucks and ME paying $15 for freight.

Repco ......$82.00

Mitsuripme.....$127 +

Eastcoast didnt have it

Bursons $26.90 inc


Guess where i got it from.............


MITSUBISHI not! lol

thanks all for your help....the Maggie hasnt played up yet....fingers crossed.....it would have by now,,, it was a daily occurance lately

haha i helped someone.. i rule! haha yeh, my mechaninc got mine for 62, and installed it for free, cos he was gettin paid for it anyway.. well since mine has been changed about two weeks ago car has not missed a beat, it has started everytime, and economey is so much better.
hope the same for you!!!

edit: im very sure mine was a genuine mitsu part too. haha.

haha i helped someone.. i rule! haha yeh, my mechaninc got mine for 62, and installed it for free, cos he was gettin paid for it anyway.. well since mine has been changed about two weeks ago car has not missed a beat, it has started everytime, and economey is so much better.
hope the same for you!!!

edit: im very sure mine was a genuine mitsu part too. haha.

Yes you WILL get better fuel economy cause the car now knows if its hot or cold which tells the ecu to run your engine rich or lean...

The brand of the sensor is a Tricon? from memory in a yellow package made in Australia or Made in China (Australian Owned)

2 years guarantee,,,, gee who cares the car starts again and the wife is off my back..now i can play with my XW again :bowrofl:

No this is quite different, the car starts then immediately stalls.

How did you go with the starting problems?
If put my key in and turn it to start straight away it will run then die, turn the key again and it fine.
If I put the key in and turn it to on and wait 2-3 sec then start it starts and runs fine.
I was told the keys need to be reprogamed?
It started doing it once in a blue moon but now if I dont wait it does it most of the time.
Any ideas?
Shane

Hi. my car was doing the start then stall thing, really annoying. It started happening after the car had been sitting for a month, replaced the battery and problem fixed.
The battery was the original and was about 4 yrs old. Don't ask me how it fixed it but prior to sitting idle for that time it was starting without a problem. Seems strange that a battery fault would let it start and then stall but its been running sweet since. I put in a 550cca($130!) just to make sure the battery had a bit extra to cope with all the short trips my car normally does.

could be as easy to fix as this...

OK I did the diagnostics test the manual way..

got code 21 coolant temp sensor!!!

as you said and same with my mates tester..code 21 didnt come up...

Ill go get a temp sensor and find out

BTW does anyone knpw where this sensor is located on the V6??

cheers

Paul

I hope this is it!!


How did you perform the manual test to find the code ??

I had been having a similar problem with my car not starting if it wasn't cold even if the temp gauge was nearly at the bottom.

Some times when it was cool it would start but splutter a lot before it would idle. Also the idle would constantly be shifting up to about 1400 then down to about 600 when it was at the lights or not moving.

Also the check engine light would come on every now and again. I had everything checked but no mechanic could find the problem

I had the O2 sensor changed, the injectors reconditions, the throttle body, fuel filter and pump all checked which made the car run a little better but the problem still occurred on a regular basic. Also the check engine light was coming on nearly every time it was driven.

This has all been fixed by replacing the coolant temp switch.

Just wanted to share the solution that worked for me :D