Hi everyone,
Looking at ways to stablise my THII the CG is damm too high...
i was thinking of getting a front strut bar and a rear strut bar...
but... i dont know which one to get... like some say for the front its the strut bar that is better and others say the strut brace... what is the difference and which is actually better? some tell me that by doing the front it doesnt make a difference and by doing the rear its more than enough... while others say only front is nescessary...
so guys who is right and who isn't?? and can you guys give me a rough estimation on how much for the bar and how much for the installation or can it be DIY???

Cheers,
Jared

front strut brace, rear sway bar, and lowered will give a relatively cheap and easy solution.

go to the bottom and check Philcomm Rally's prices, for the 3 things above your looking at $600-$700 inc shipping.

strut brace, easy to install. sway bar, easy diy guide on forums, do a search. springs, ask ur friends :)

A strut brace will not make the car feel more stable.

Lower profile tyres, new bushes on the anti-roll bars and if not fitted a rear anti-roll bar.

Other options would be to lower the car, but this takes away from the functionality in some cases. You can also get better struts.



First things first, pump your tyres up to 42psi front and rear. That will make more difference than a strut brace and it is free.

If a vehicle's tires are overinflated by 6 psi, they could be damaged more easily when encountering potholes or debris in the road, as well as experience irregular tread wear. Higher inflated tires cannot isolate road irregularities as well causing the vehicle to ride harsher and transmit more noise into its interior.

Thats true, but the tyre itself will say how high you can pump it up to. Usually about 60psi is the max, and about 38 is the recommendation on the cars door sticker.

42psi is not over inflated. It is on the high side, but still not anywhere near detrimental.

A strut brace will not make the car feel more stable.

I disagree in a big big way. I have a TH and its one of the best mods I have done to it. The front sits much flatter and firmer around corners, and torque steer is basically gone.
I really recommend this mod. A rear sway bar will also be a big improvement for the rear, and that is one of my next mods...

Turbo always argues about the strut brace...just ignore him. He's been proven wrong about it by the majority of the club but won't admit it.

Don't you have some hi-clones to install or something :P






I said strut braces will not help a car stay level, but don't get me started on their actual effect, or lack of, for a road driven taxi.

This is what you said:

A strut brace will not make the car feel more stable.

And the vast majority of the members here who have installed strut braces will prove you wrong.

That's all I have to say.

In the context of the sentance, it was implying that it would level the car out around corners..

In the context of the sentance, it was implying that it would level the car out around corners..

Why don't you give up? I have not heard a SINGLE person who drives a MAGNA who has one fitted give them anything but praise.

Well... Actually I found that it did stuff all to both the exec and to an AWD I fitted it onto so I got rid of it.

Rear swaybar makes a HUGE difference. I was very unimpressed with the results of the strut brace - I used to have a car that I fitted all sorts of aftermarket gear on, and discovered that you spend a lot of time convincing yourself that it was worthwhile. I am now a lot more critical/honest/cynical.

Cheers
Heath Young

The first thing to do is fit a rear sway bar, makes the biggest difference to steering response (limits slack sway before the car responds to an input), then lower profile/stiffer sidewall tyres and some SLIGHT lowering. The strut brace is there so that while cornering you can keep the front geometry as close as possible to your static set it up and doesn't make a diff until u get ur all round grip high enough to warrant it, more of a consistency aid really.

Cummins.

Thats true, but the tyre itself will say how high you can pump it up to. Usually about 60psi is the max, and about 38 is the recommendation on the cars door sticker.

42psi is not over inflated. It is on the high side, but still not anywhere near detrimental.

Really? :nuts: I thought there is an over-inflation if you go above recommended pressure for your car. :nuts:
Edited: I'm talking of stock tyres here, I'm sorry.

Really? :nuts: I thought there is an over-inflation if go above recommended pressure for your car. :nuts:


Not exactly....

The the recommended tyre pressure for your car relates to the standard wheel and tyres.
Even then if you go over the recommendation you can tell if the tyres are over-inflated by looking at the tread. If its wearing in the middle of the tyre it is over-inflated....

If im wrong dont be shy.

if you want better handling
lower it
low profile tyres
strenghten front sway bar
install a rear sway bar


imo a strutbrace is just to stiffen body flex THAT is all.

The strut brace is there so that while cornering you can keep the front geometry as close as possible to your static set it up and doesn't make a diff until u get ur all round grip high enough to warrant it, more of a consistency aid really.

Cummins.

That sounds about right.

And Turbo Charade (and Cummins for that matter!) have both done some form of circuit racing [more than just a once a year visit to the track] so I'd trust what they say over those who haven't.

Just think about it logically and theoretically. A strut brace across the front towers stiffens up the front. A stiffer front means the front two wheels spend less time in contact with the road, which makes for less traction and then :shock: UNDERSTEER!

But that's just theoretical and doesn't necessarily mean it translates into real life. From what I understand, the reason why so much praise is given to strut braces is because they make the car feel like it can handle better. A car like the Magna has very doughy, uncommunicative steering which tends to limit your confidence in the car and its handling abilities. But with a strutbrace fitted, this feel is improved and so does your confidence in the car. So the car handles (:doubt:) better.

It's sort of like the flowed TB. Everyone who has one would swear that the car has more power, but it is afterall just more responsive; giving the illusion of power.

Personally, I think Rear Swaybars is where its at :cool: .

cant say i noticed any difference at all when the front strut brace went on the magna, however on my mates old lancer it made a big difference. depends on the structural rigidity of the car. magnas are pretty rigid to start with so i dont reckon they are necessary. only put one on mine because it was a present, otherwise i wouldn't have bothered.
rear sway bars on the other hand make a huge difference to the handling of the car. remember that a rear sway bar will affect the front of the car, therefore reducing bodyroll and lateral flexing and really tightening up the front end. be careful not to go too big(thick) as it can make the car unlivable as an everyday car. my mate changed from a 26mm to a 28mm rear bar and it made the car(circuit spec WRX) noticably sharper. perfect for the track but terrible on the road. incidently the car ran standard shocks/springs, the sway bar transformed the cars handling.

or lack of, for a road driven taxi.

but them race taxi's... now thats a different story :P

if you wanna lower the centre of gravity and make it more stable, get some coil overs, get some custom 14 x 8.5" wheels made up, r compound tyres and drop it till its about 5mm off the ground :D the only way to lower the cars centre of gravity is to physically lower the car, or remove weight from the uppermost points of the car (read roof etc...)

Why don't you give up? I have not heard a SINGLE person who drives a MAGNA who has one fitted give them anything but praise.
ohsnap?

I disagree in a big big way. I have a TH and its one of the best mods I have done to it. The front sits much flatter and firmer around corners, and torque steer is basically gone.
A strut brace won't make the car sit flatter when cornering - that's the job of a sway bar.

Cheers,
Martin.

ohsnap?

:P You win this time, previously I had never heard of any!


A strut brace won't make the car sit flatter when cornering - that's the job of a sway bar.

I did with mine. I noticed a distinct difference in how steady and flat the front end remained when cornering, especially hard. I even took it off the other day to just see what the car was like now I had had it on for a year and promptly put it back on again. Its the rear end now that rolls around, hence a rear sway bar is next on the list.

ok... so to stablise my car... i understand from everyone that it would be better for me to get the rear sway bar first before everything else?
if i did the rear sway bar would i need to get the front sway bar??
to clear my doubt the bar that goes ontop of the struts are the strut bars right?
what about say bar where do they go?
it is easy to install the rear sway bar and the front sway bar??

cheers,
Jared

the bar that goes ontop of the struts is a strut brace

You are on the right track. There are 3 bars, front and rear sway bar and a strut brace. The strut brace can be installed in 5 minutes with a shifter, the rear sway bar (I have never installed one, just read other peoples comments) is a bit harder, but not impossible. The front from what I can gather is a bit harder again. You will already have a front sway bar, but the idea is the get a bigger one. You MAY have a rear sway bar depending on what model you have, but again bigger is better!

if i did the rear sway bar would i need to get the front sway bar??
No, you don't have to do both.
On a front-wheel-drive car, you want to stiffen up the rear end, hence the suggestion for a bigger sway bar on the rear.
You can optionally also upgrade the front sway bar, but I would suggest that you do the rear sway bar first, and see how the car handles.


it is easy to install the rear sway bar and the front sway bar??
The sway bars are pretty easy to install.
See here (http://martybugs.net/magna/swaybar.cgi) for my recent experiences installing a Whiteline rear swaybar on my TJ Magna wagon.

Cheers,
Martin.

to install a front sway bar, i wouldnt even look at DIY install unless u knew what u were doing...its a big job! anyway i agree with the previous post that strut braces do nothing but reduce body roll in the front end. about 1.5 yrs ago i bought coils, front and rear sway bar, strut brace and upgraded my rims. i installed the strut brace myself and notice **** all difference. then i got the coils, sways etc installed professionally and wow! big difference. so yeh if u wana improve handling without spending too much money id go sways and lowering. strut brace is kinda like a "placebo effect" and isnt really justified unless u have a full suspension set up

You are on the right track. There are 3 bars, front and rear sway bar and a strut brace. The strut brace can be installed in 5 minutes with a shifter, the rear sway bar (I have never installed one, just read other peoples comments) is a bit harder, but not impossible. The front from what I can gather is a bit harder again. You will already have a front sway bar, but the idea is the get a bigger one. You MAY have a rear sway bar depending on what model you have, but again bigger is better!

Four bars. Front/rear sway (or anti-roll) bars and front/rear strut brace/bars. The rear
strut race sits in the boot behind the rear seats.

I thought all magnas come with front sway bars and only certain ones also come with rear
sway bars (Ralliarts and AWDs etc).

Four bars. Front/rear sway (or anti-roll) bars and front/rear strut brace/bars. The rear
strut race sits in the boot behind the rear seats.

I thought all magnas come with front sway bars and only certain ones also come with rear
sway bars (Ralliarts and AWDs etc).

My TL has a stock rear sway bar.. I think that's when they started coming stock? It's pretty thin though.

I can vouch for what skyna is saying about handling, I was charging through roundabouts behind him and I thought my car handled reasonably for a relative stock car and couldnt believe how flat his was sitting, not a hint of body roll.

If you want to stabalise it, 1. pump your tyres up properly to get rid of the awful side wall flex, 2. rear sway bar to keep it flatter then 3. rims + lower it. 4. new shocks, 5, new bushes + strut brace + camber kits if you're getting serious. It will feel like a rally car by the end of it but it'll stick like **** to a blanket.

OK thanks to everyone...
i have decided on getting the rear sway bar... any idea on where to order and how much is it?? i BELIEVE its easier since everyone claims it to be like just unscrewing a few screws and stuff.... anyway i stay in brissy... any help would be appreciated by a pack of 6.... hahaa...

Cheers,
Jared

Philcomm Rally, down the bottom of the main forum page, and it should be $200 plus postage for an adjustable rear sway bar

I thought all magnas come with front sway bars and only certain ones also come with rear
sway bars (Ralliarts and AWDs etc).
My TJ Advance wagon had a factory rear sway bar.

Cheers,
Martin.

Heres (http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question432.htm)some interesting info on sway bars and another (http://auto.howstuffworks.com/framed.htm?parent=question432.htm&url=http://www.turnfast.com/tech_handling/handling_antiroll.shtml) one.

mpot, interesting that you have sway bars on a live axel.

mpot, interesting that you have sway bars on a live axel.

I don't think it's that abnormal to have a sway bar on a live axle.

However, a Whiteline rear swaybar has definitely made a big difference (http://martybugs.net/magna/swaybar.cgi) to the handling of the car. The factory rear sway bar is 18mm, while the Whiteline BMR67 is 22mm, which is a big increase in torsional stiffness.

Cheers,
Martin.

OK thanks to everyone...
i have decided on getting the rear sway bar... any idea on where to order and how much is it?? i BELIEVE its easier since everyone claims it to be like just unscrewing a few screws and stuff.... anyway i stay in brissy... any help would be appreciated by a pack of 6.... hahaa...

Cheers,
Jared

Brissy, Cruisin Auto Spares, tell them Marc Zande from Daihard sent you for a discount.

Tell them you are on the Daihard forum and you used to have a Charade :)