Hi, i have noticed a bit of oil coming out of unusual places...

Inlet Manifold

http://www.vagweb.co.uk/showroom/pic2077.jpg
http://www.vagweb.co.uk/showroom/pic2078.jpg


Throttle Body

http://www.vagweb.co.uk/showroom/pic2079.jpg


What could be causing this? something blocked?

Check out the small right elbow on top of the rear rocker cover and also the tube leading from that back to the air throttle sensor, as either or both could be blocked and is forcing oil out.

I had a similar problem where I had excessive gas pressure forcing oil out of about 3 places. On advice from this Forum. it was suggested to check the small elbows on the rocker cover. Also check the front one where the hose leads to the PCV Valve. If blocked, use carburettor cleaner and some stiff wire. I actually bought some long pipe cleaners from a craft store, and twisted two together which made the wire firm enough without it bending.

Are you sure that it's oil? I only ask because there are brands of gasket cement that look exactly like the sludge in those pics. If it's hard, and powders when you scratch or chip it, then it's gasket cment. If it's oil, then there's a lot of crankcase blowby coming back up through the PCV valve, and it's working it's way out of component joins. Is your idle stable or is it up and down?

idle is much better than it used to be, but sometimes it still drops and rises by a few hundred RPM. Problems get much worse under acceleration, with heavy power loss, with power surging and dropping off. I am pretty sure it is oil, it is a fluid rather than a cement, and it has the qualities of oil when i wipe it with a cloth. the front breather pipe is split, and is being held together with electrical tape LOL. does this lead to the PCV valve inside the rocker cover???

idle is much better than it used to be, but sometimes it still drops and rises by a few hundred RPM. Problems get much worse under acceleration, with heavy power loss, with power surging and dropping off. I am pretty sure it is oil, it is a fluid rather than a cement, and it has the qualities of oil when i wipe it with a cloth. the front breather pipe is split, and is being held together with electrical tape LOL. does this lead to the PCV valve inside the rocker cover???

Sure does, ya PCV Might be blocked up mate, take that hose off and see how clogged it is, When i had a look at mine it was at least 50% clogged up, your PCV Might Be clogged up too, just take that out with a spanner and clean it with carby cleaner, Why oil is dripping from your intake plenium is beyond me lol

also, i had all the valve stem seals replaced just a month ago, as it was burning mucho oil!! also had new timing belt and all water pump, tensioners, pulleys replaced. ICV replaced, and injectors professional cleaned ultrasonically. It is MUCH better than it used to be, but the hesitating engine under load is really bugging me again. could it be this PCV valve??

Also, where can i get new breather pipes from for cheap?

hoses are definately fubar'd, had a look but i cant see how the valve comes out?? had a look at the workshop manual but its no help really. its like the automotive equivalent of Ikea instructions. there is oil splurged all round the breather hose, so something must be very blocked. The PCV hose is clear, water runs clear through it no problem. it doesnt look very wide though...

Fuel hose will do the trick

']Sure does, ya PCV Might be blocked up mate, take that hose off and see how clogged it is, When i had a look at mine it was at least 50% clogged up, your PCV Might Be clogged up too, just take that out with a spanner and clean it with carby cleaner, Why oil is dripping from your intake plenium is beyond me lol

its leakin outta the plenum too as that has a fitting connected to a breather in rocker cover also to do with the pcv. if u are getting this then it is time to think about new rings my friend. that is pretty bad blow by and would explain power loss

are you serious, piston rings :shock:

how much am i looking at

are you serious, piston rings :shock:

how much am i looking at

Rings require the bottom end to be pulled apart, so you're looking at about ~$2000. Mostly labour. Then of course you may as well replace the pistons and bearings. Engines are expensive toys...

**** about. there is no way im spending that sort of cash on that car!

**** about. there is no way im spending that sort of cash on that car!

lol haha at least have a compression test done before jumping to conclusions mate.. lol

Does the car run ok? Is there a noticeable loss of oil from the engine (ie, have to top up often due to loss)?

If it runs fine and isnt losing heaps of oil... dont worry about it mate!! Remember its not a new car anymore.. they all get their quirks after time.

Imho, keep driving it and just keep an eye on the leak.

compression was only done a month ago, my mechanic said it was spot on. equal compression across all 6 cylinders. yeah it loses power big time when under full throttle, but not always. sometimes its great, other times its really bad.

take the oil cap off while the motor is running if theres a heap of air and oil comming out the rings have gorn

compare it with a nother car

it looks like glue to me not oil

I agree totally with the other 2 dudes who also said it.... I'm willing to bet some serious coin that the "leak" is not oil, it's Permatex form-a-gasket aviation Number 3.
Using any kind of sealer on metal gaskets is not necessary, if anything, a light mist of Hylomar will do the job!

Rings require the bottom end to be pulled apart, so you're looking at about ~$2000. Mostly labour.
Are you for real man $2000? Can't be that expensive?

Might as well get a new engine?

Are you for real man $2000? Can't be that expensive?

Might as well get a new engine?
For a V6 is not a bad sort of price for top and bottom end rebuild and a good mechanic will make it as good as new


For that to be oil, the PCV would be totally blocked and the breather be pumping oil in flat out. THat would explain the TB leak in a way however everyone here has failed to remember otwo things.
1. At the TB gasket there is a vacum thus the oil would not run out, even in motor turned off state the amount of oil here is excessive.
2. for that much oil to be in the inlet, the smoke would be amazing as if it is running out that much, imagine how much is getting into the engine?

The "oil", as stated above looks like gasket cement as oil would also run off hot surfaces and only leave a smear, not a run like this.

Simple test, engine cold, grab a rag, if it wipes off leaving no trace witha single wipe, it is oil and you have issues. If it takes some rubbing to remove, it is gasket cement and you need a new mechanic who replaces gaskets, not gums them up with gunk!

Its not blowing ANY smoke at all. How do i check this PCV thing? and where can i get new breather hoses from?

Its not blowing ANY smoke at all. How do i check this PCV thing? and where can i get new breather hoses from?

Well if you are not blowing smoke, then it is not oil which is a sure bet.

The PCV can be cleaned, the hoses you can use pretty much anything, I usually use fuel hose given the V6 breather hoses do not have any real bends in them

and where can i find them from? my local repco?

Yep, or your local hardware shop, they will have something.

can someone tell me how i get this PCV valve out? i have looked at the workshop manual but it doesnt really help :(

i have just replaced both the rocker cover breather hoses with new fuel lines. took off the PCV, what a bastard to get off :shock:

Cleaned that thoroughly with carb cleaner, the PCV was absolutely gross, and completely blocked. i could not get a single whisp of air through it lol. Its clear as a bell now.

I then proceeded to empty the entire can into my inlet, AFTER the filter assembly with the engine running. testiment to the hard work of my mechanic, there was absolutely no black smoke from doing this. it must be clean as in there!

I took the car for a spin and i swear the engine feels much healthier when accelerating.

Oh and the leak that i thought was oil, is in fact gasket sealant lol

thanks a lot guys for the help today!!!

Sorry mate but no offense when I say it is testament to your mechanic that he is both sloppy and a bad mechanic when he a/ uses gasket cement on areas which clearly do not need it and b/ uses that much!

Sorry mate but no offense when I say it is testament to your mechanic that he is both sloppy and a bad mechanic when he a/ uses gasket cement on areas which clearly do not need it and b/ uses that much!

Yep exactly... i'd say that he couldnt get hold of the gaskets so he substituted with permatex. Using a flexible sealant would generally be "acceptable", but seeing as how permatex hardens solid, its a dodgy job. Thats what ya do in the trade... hey Mal? lol

i fully trust his judgement, and the fact that he brought the car back from the dead is enough for me. He has been a mechanic for 40 odd years so im sure he knows what he is doing. The car is running MUCH better tonight after doing those few little things with the PCV and breather pipes. OBLITERATED a standard v6 commodore on my way home lol

Yep exactly... i'd say that he couldnt get hold of the gaskets so he substituted with permatex. Using a flexible sealant would generally be "acceptable", but seeing as how permatex hardens solid, its a dodgy job. Thats what ya do in the trade... hey Mal? lol

Yeah.....



















No, I would never use it on the metal gaskets as it is more than likely to such itself in.

The no3 does not harden, the no4 does.

Looking at these pics however it is plain to see that far too much has been used, some do tend to go way overboard, some old school mechanics swear by the stuff despite that in today's day and age it is simply not needed.

Being metal gaskets there is generally no reason to change them although the TB gasket I keep a couple of newbies here all the time. In doing stem seals, there is no need to replace the manifold gasket where it joins the top to bottom as the manifold clamps down fairly evenly when torqued evenly.

Glad to hear it is now running well though

just for the record, when i replaced my valve stem seals i checked the PCV valve in mine and it was fine, so i then blew into the breather hose while it was on the rocker box (which was off the car) and no air was getting through at all. the rocker box was totally blocked with...well my guess is smoke and oil residue from the crap stem seals.

i had soaked the rocker box in citrus degreaser over night, then the next day i used a cheap dremel and chopped the end off the flexible line thing which was included and shoved it into the pipe to "drill" a hole through the grime. once i did that i left it to soak in degreaser over night again and she was perfect after that.

so if the rocker box is blocked, a new PCV valve is useless to fix any problems. i highly recomend checking the rocker box before replacing a PCV valve.

hmmmm, that sounds like a hard afternoons work. but i think im up to the challenge. its only two bolts right

yeah its only 2 bolts for each box, rear is easy to get out, but a tad awkward to put back on with the glue on it.

If you disconnect the tube from the rocker cover to the PCV and then put another longer piece of tube on the rocker cover you can try blowing through it. If you can then its not blocked and you don't need to remove the rocker cover.

Rob

thanks for that rob, i shal give it a try