Hi Every one, I have been reading prev post regarding fuel consumption.

its a Magna Altera TE 97 model
automatic
Drive like grandma, most of the time. even let ppl go first at red lights, coz the acceleration is slow at first gear , have to push a bit over 2000 rpm to actually feel the push.

however i normally try to kep it below 3000 if acelerating and most of the time is 2000 rpm.

my fuel consumption is 350kms per full tank that is almost 60 littre. ithink it's a bit much, considerign my driving mode is like that. i normally drive arround city 10%, suburban 60% and highway 30%

what i want to know is if i get the o2 sensor change, will it increase fuel economy, and where in arround chatswood NSW or north shore that i can change this that is not too pricey.

i know Im asking a lot of question but any suggestion is appreciated.

Thank you :redface:

if you have a socket set snap of the ceramic of the old one and undo with the right socket

fit new one ---a diy

Northshore Mitsubishi:

http://www.northshore-mitsubishi.com.au/

the service centre is in Artarmon - quite close to you. Have a a talk to the service person - you may want to change your main temperature sensor as well.

how far do you drive at a time? if it is only short trips then you would be spending a lot of time on cold start enrichment, which uses more fuel.

also, how long do you spend sitting in traffic? even though you are just sitting there idling, you are still using fuel.

and even though you keep the revs low, how far do you actually push the accelerator down? if you push it down a fair way to start off with then it will still use more fuel than light acceleration and going higher in the rev range.

changing the o2 sensor will only restore economy if it is stuffed. if it is working fine it won't make a difference. other things to look at would be thermostat and water temp sensor. if either of these are stuffed the car could be running too cold (or the ecu thinks it is running cold if the water temp sensor is stuffed) and keeping the car on cold start enrichment.

how far do you drive at a time? if it is only short trips then you would be spending a lot of time on cold start enrichment, which uses more fuel.

also, how long do you spend sitting in traffic? even though you are just sitting there idling, you are still using fuel.


I drive arround 35k per day , when i sit in traffic, i put the gear to neutral. also not very long , total waiting time from daily traffic is prolly 10 minutes max. for the total duration of the travel.

by the way good point in regards to the reving, I did press the gas slowly so i can save more fuel. but seems like im not getting any push , so ended pressing the pedal deeper, and engine didn't even rev that high - arroun 2300 rpm, and very slow acceleration, will it help if i press the pedal faster but shallower ? am i making sense :)

if i press quicker i pressed it shalower and get more rpm then when i press slowly andd go to deeper. also if I press the pedal slower the changein gear from 1 to 2 is a lot slower.

is there a problem there or it's normal.

also thanks for all the replies everyone

sitting at idle for 10 mins will use approximately 1 litre of fuel

so if you do that 5 times(per week) in the morning and 5 times(per week) in the arvo... thats 10 litres wasted for zero kms

sitting at idle for 10 mins will use approximately 1 litre of fuel

so if you do that 5 times(per week) in the morning and 5 times(per week) in the arvo... thats 10 litres wasted for zero kms

1 litre for 10 minutes at idle???? maybe in a 500hp V8 mate, sure as hell not in a stock magna!

driving on the highway at 100kmh for 10 mins would use approx 1.5L of fuel. so i'd say it would probably be closer to 500ml of fuel per 10 mins.

thats why i said approximately... cause i was unsure of the exact figure...
even at 500ml thats still 5litres per week wasted on idle

sorry to steal thread here.

would a faulty o2 sensor cause the car to run really rich. like so rich its losing alot of power. like in excess of 10hp atw..

also, i dont think mine is staying on cold engine cuz the rev's drop as per normal once the engine is hot.

car just doesnt seem to have the power it should. and dyno print out showed it running really rich.

What do you mean running rich ?

the air fuel ratio says there is way to much fuel.

ideal ratio for na v6 is mid to high 13
mine is low 10...

lower reading the richer it is.

you may be getting a faulty reading from 02 sensor..
1. there is unmetered air flowing into the TB
2. the 02 sensor is broke... (computer will indicate this, engine light should come on in the v6's)


you may be getting a loss of power due to the age/wear of the engine

using slightly more fuel is not true of sluggish performance.
generally more fuel = more power (they tune the vehicle for power vs economy)

you may be getting a faulty reading from 02 sensor..
1. there is unmetered air flowing into the TB
2. the 02 sensor is broke... (computer will indicate this, engine light should come on in the v6's)


you may be getting a loss of power due to the age/wear of the engine

using slightly more fuel is not true of sluggish performance.
generally more fuel = more power (they tune the vehicle for power vs economy)

how could unmetered air be flowing into the throttle body??

i dont think the o2 sensor is totally broke, maybe only a little??

what about like maf sensor???

also its not noticable sluggish performance. only really noticable when compared to other cars which i usually perform better than,

Hey Adza on my rada, pajero and type40's mitsu the 02 sensor did not throw a code. But it definetley caused a rich condition on all the above. Type 40's showed up on a dyno day no code but reading was in the 10's way too rich. On cruise should be 14.7 if your on lpg 15.5. He has since changed his and all is good again. Getting close to another 100 odd kays from what i remember when we last spoke to the tank.

Over time 02 sensors get real slugish. There are some tests you can perform to test it in the mitsu manual.
Other factors can also come into play causing a rich condition.
Eg retarted timming, Temp sensor faulty sending wrong resistance to ecu as well as leaky injectors and faulty fuel regulator.


regards

Hey Adza on my rada, pajero and type40's mitsu the 02 sensor did not throw a code. But it definetley caused a rich condition on all the above. Type 40's showed up on a dyno day no code but reading was in the 10's way too rich. On cruise should be 14.7 if your on lpg 15.5. He has since changed his and all is good again. Getting close to another 100 odd kays from what i remember when we last spoke to the tank.

Over time 02 sensors get real slugish. There are some tests you can perform to test it in the mitsu manual.
Other factors can also come into play causing a rich condition.
Eg retarted timming, Temp sensor faulty sending wrong resistance to ecu as well as leaky injectors and faulty fuel regulator.


regards
This is correct. Over time my car started using more fuel, not excessive but noticeable and i really never gave it another thought until it was on the dyno and was running in the 10's and 11's (air/fuel ratio)... Needless to say i went off to price a new one and a genuine plug in 4 wire O2 sensor was $330 ish at Mitsu so i did some shopping around. I eventually found a sensor (made by NGK) at Bursons that plugged into the factory loom for $110. I felt the difference immediately! The engine revved that little bit cleaner and the car's drivability improved. My fuel consumption went from @ 550 to 50 litres on the highway to 690 to 55 litres for the same driving... So it should have paid itself off in a tank or 2! lol

I eventually found a sensor (made by NGK) at Bursons that plugged into the factory loom for $110. I felt the difference immediately! The engine revved that little bit cleaner and the car's drivability improved. My fuel consumption went from @ 550 to 50 litres on the highway to 690 to 55 litres for the same driving... So it should have paid itself off in a tank or 2! lol


Hi For $110 do you did this your self /Install your self or get some one to do it. i really hesitate to punch / take anything off the engine bay ( since my old car died)

Hi For $110 do you did this your self /Install your self or get some one to do it. i really hesitate to punch / take anything off the engine bay ( since my old car died)
I did it myself. The actual sensor sits just before the cat and on top of the pipework that is your exhaust. The sensor itself just inscrews from the exhaust and then unplugs from the loom which sits inside the car. The only issue i had was the loom didnt pull through enough to acess the plug and fell back into the car which meant i had to pull the passenger seat out, some of the console and pull the carpet back just to find the plug! When i found it all i did was push it through the hole in the floor and assembled everything underneath, started the car to make sure it all worked and then put it all back together. All this took about 40 mins.

so what do u think mine would most likely be,
I have no reason to believe the timming would be retarted, do I?

so temp sensor or o2 sensor?? which one is more likely to cause a rich reading?
pretty much like what has been described..

Either one but more than likeley 02 sensor... I would do this first. I its a lazy 02 due to age you should notice an improvement. Then if no success look elsewhere. Have a hunt around the forum for a service manual. There are links posted. It has the procedure how to test it. You just need a multimeter.

Regards

Either one but more than likeley 02 sensor... I would do this first. I its a lazy 02 due to age you should notice an improvement. Then if no success look elsewhere. Have a hunt around the forum for a service manual. There are links posted. It has the procedure how to test it. You just need a multimeter.

Regards

thanks mate.

is the o2 sensor on the rear bank extractors??

The only issue i had was the loom didnt pull through enough to acess the plug and fell back into the car which meant i had to pull the passenger seat out, some of the console and pull the carpet back just to find the plug! When i found it all i did was push it through the hole in the floor and assembled everything underneath, started the car to make sure it all worked and then put it all back together. All this took about 40 mins.

Thanks for that, yes still could't see my self doing all that , i mean with the plug fell back in to the car, I prlly would lost it lol .. i know , i prolly save some money and get a mechanic to do it. woudl any mechanic be a ble to do it for a fair price , or should i go to mitsy and spend that much ie $330

Ps: i never actually seen the fuel line,:shock: if someone can post a picture for Altera TE of how the o2 sensor would look like and picture of where it goes. I can prolly do it.

anyone? :pray:

follow your manifold's down, it will be impossible to miss.

your o2 sensor shouldn't affect your top end power. the o2 sensor is used for closed loop which is for cruising and idle. once you floor it it goes into open loop, and your o2 sensor has little affect on this. you may have another problem causing over fuelling such as a faulty air flow meter, or dirty injectors.

but changing the o2 sensor won't hurt, it just may not fix the problem.

your o2 sensor shouldn't affect your top end power. the o2 sensor is used for closed loop which is for cruising and idle. once you floor it it goes into open loop, and your o2 sensor has little affect on this. you may have another problem causing over fuelling such as a faulty air flow meter, or dirty injectors.

but changing the o2 sensor won't hurt, it just may not fix the problem.

im really up to any suggestions, especially ones that will help isolate the problem...

thanks for responses!

your o2 sensor shouldn't affect your top end power. the o2 sensor is used for closed loop which is for cruising and idle. once you floor it it goes into open loop, and your o2 sensor has little affect on this. you may have another problem causing over fuelling such as a faulty air flow meter, or dirty injectors.

but changing the o2 sensor won't hurt, it just may not fix the problem.
On the dyno the sensor was causing the car to run between 10 and 11 air/fuel ratio... So i do dispute this. It was visibly holding the car back.

I agree with Type40 my understanding is if the 02 sensor is shot it will cause the ecu to dump extra fuel into the engine to avoid a lean condition. (Built in safety) In turn your fuel consumption will increase substantially and loose performance due to this.
Best burning air fuel ratio is around 12.5- 12.7 some vehicles can run in the high 13's air fuel ratio not quater lol.. A drop from the 12's to the 11's or 10's is quite substantial in regards to fuel ratio.

Think about it as a carbi vehicle. As you turn the mixture screw it will richen the mixture as you turn it the other way it will lean out. Further in you go you will start to see black smoke comming out of your tail pipe which means unburnt fuel.

Its mitsus way of saving your motor if 02 broken dump more fuel. :)
Regards

thanks for all the replies,

can someone please link me to where i can find how to test the o2 sensor?

i have tried searching for ages, but can't find it.:rant: