Would like to thank Mal aka MadMagna for installing my pacemaker extractors in for me. It was a tricky task as it involved cutting and welding, and also, pacemaker only makes 1 set of extractors for both the 3.0L and 3.5L engines, hence there would be some preload in the extractors, but hopefully they will set into the bolted shape.

Well, the job took about 2hrs with an addition of 3 hours of letting the car cool down and running around to pick up gaskets and all that.



Changes? : HEAPS,
+ Sound of the whole exhaust system is now throaty, above 4500RPM, in the driver's seat it sounds like an V8 pulsating behind me.

+ The resonace I had at 1100RPM and 2000RPM has decreased in dB, I say it's now virtually gone.

+ I feel much better torque - I would say it now feels more connected compared to before, as I have an Auto box, before the extractors, it feels like it would not go anyway even though i'm reving it, but now it feels 'almost' like an Manual.

+ REV much much faster and free reving.

+ I think it's actually not as loud as before in normal driving conditions as it is better flow design.

- the rear collector is rather low, it's about 12cm from ground, not so good.

? Not sure if it will run more economical as yet, i've just filled up a tank and hopefully by the end of this tank, i'll find out whether it gave me more kms.

CAI : I've also installed a custom Cold air induction with Air conditioning duct material. No noticeable difference, and no audiable difference. it goes from the air box to the bottom left fog light slot. But as it doesn't do any harm, i may just leave it there. [I gotta remember not to drive over puddles now]

If you don't mind me asking.. How much did the extractors set you back and what do you reckon they have done for you in power, 1/4 mile time and 0-100 time's?

SuFz :badgrin:

i rekon i got 5-10kw gain and it does pull doesnt it!!!

hehe i love em ;) , u can pick em up for $380 off ebay

Glad to hear it mate!! :D

If you don't mind me asking.. How much did the extractors set you back and what do you reckon they have done for you in power, 1/4 mile time and 0-100 time's?

SuFz :badgrin:

The whole job cost me close to $490

I think you will definately feel the torque increase, power i don't know as I got no where to do 240 km/h in.

0-100 I am guessing 7 something
1/4 mile i haven't tried, maybe 15 - 16 i hope.

I would like to add a couple things that i noticed today:

+ It has really nice burble now.

+ It has controlled back fire (not a loud bang, but I would say a louder burble), I did it by changing from 1st to 2nd at 5000RPM > realised the accel and it created a very nice "burbp" sound and 2nd came in at about 4000RPM and i pulled away again.

+ It starts pulling hard about 3000RPM, in 1st it'll go to about 70 when i hit 6000RPM, but i change before that. It's starting to feel like a manual now.

I am thoroughly enjoying this MOD. Very highly recommanded to all you guys out there with filter and exhaust mods already.

I think this goes with any custom designed Extractors, doesn't have to be Pacemaker.

End note, I think it's money well spent.

Yours is an auto i take it? Also is yours a 3.0 or 3.5?

Yours is an auto i take it? Also is yours a 3.0 or 3.5?

my is an auto 3.0l

Brilliant, im getting some then :P I just landed a nice 3.0L Auto myself :D

Brilliant, im getting some then :P I just landed a nice 3.0L Auto myself :D

BRILLIANT! :D

oh could you please do a dyno before and after please. haha. as i forgot about it.

I think it Revs like there's no tomorrow once you pass 3 grand, it just goes off the scales! haha. I think i should get it advanced a bit to compensate.

Yep one step ahead of you there :D Im hoping to try and find a firm willing to susidise it :D

Blake

Coolness to the Pacemakers!

Now u can race me :P

heeheehee

Coolness to the Pacemakers!

Now u can race me :P

heeheehee

HEHEHEE.. I'll race you when you get yout stock accord. hows that sound?

[quote:8b607bb667="EuroAccord13"]Coolness to the Pacemakers!

Now u can race me :P

heeheehee

HEHEHEE.. I'll race you when you get yout stock accord. hows that sound?[/quote:8b607bb667]


How about I race your WhiteDevil with my BlackBeast, if you win, you'll get a run in my Accord :D


Actually, the Stock Euro did 7.4 seconds by the yanks... but I got to run in the car first LOL... prolly has only 10kms on it..

[quote:a0c9bda782]oh could you please do a dyno before and after please. haha. as i forgot about it.[/quote:a0c9bda782]

i might have to get around to that for ya, i dynoed it before now ill book it in for after ;)

go the mighty 3.0 auto's

Sounds like your happy with the extractors then, but how do the pacemakers shape up to the RPW extractors? From what Ive read on this site the RPW will give better power gains compared to pacemaker. Comments anyone? Mitsiman or KB?

Oh yeah, go the 3 litre auto's :D .

i have also wondered this. as i am in the midst of choosing between the two.

i am told that pacemaker kick it at approx 2000rpm and RPW at about 3000rpm

can anyone answer this?

thanks

Trav

My pacemakers don't kick in until 3000RPM.

I think you get what you pay for. RPW's extractors go all the way to the CAT, which will be much much better as you won't need to weld anything on as the PaceMakers would.... so it is expected that the RPW ones get more power...

but how much are they?

Nick, I already know your blackbeast is faster than mine. hehe.. I bow to you already, you can't expect a 3.0L with less mods to be faster than your 3.5L.

Is the Accord really that fast, 7.4 sec to 100km/h... shet, i might have trouble keeping up with your accord. haha. Though I haven't timed myself since i got my extractors.

oh well.. I feel it to be bit faster... can I borrow your RSM with G sensor nick?

i also have pacemakers and noticed a huge difference - but i think that it definately helps right through the rev range and the most noticable (in my case) was in the torque down low......

the gearbox also remapped itself and now it hangs onto 4th gear much much longer up hills and attempts to use the torque of the engine (successfully) instead of pointlessly hunting around the gears and using engine speed un-necessarily to get up a hill that it would have been able to handle without a problem!!
(that was a mouthful!!!)
the result is a much more powerful feeling car that is more of a pleasure to drive!! - feels like it has some balls haha

anyhoo - im happy with the pacemakers and would recommend them to anyone!

i have also wondered this. as i am in the midst of choosing between the two.

i am told that pacemaker kick it at approx 2000rpm and RPW at about 3000rpm

Umm... aren't you going to be the test fit for the 3.0? I'm hanging out to see what how they fit so I can talk to my installer.

This kick I think is probably really one of two things:

a) the effect of the cams hitting the RPM where they really start to show. i.e. 3000RPM will see my 3.0 come alive

b) if it's lower in the RPM than a stock car then it probably means they're poorely designed if you're aiming for peak power and will actually become a restriction high in the rev range.

This is a function of the size and design of the primary pipes.

yeah how much are the RPW ones..

i ALSO .. have a 3.0L auto... so extractors is next.. just which ones is the question...

hey whitedevil., do you find the revs really kick in between 3-4grand? i love it when that happens. but be weary though, my oxy sensor died after 5 months.... :cry:

yeah i think it died because of the type silastic they used or how much they used, i think thats whats happened with mine, hey john did u notice the silastic burning off for a while after you had them installed.

What burning?

anyway, yeah, it does kick in a lot after 3000rpm, so it kills the ox sensor did it? What fuel did you use mate? I don't think your ox sensor dies just because you change extractors.

[quote:dfd7c8ac32="KJ GTV"]If you don't mind me asking.. How much did the extractors set you back and what do you reckon they have done for you in power, 1/4 mile time and 0-100 time's?

SuFz :badgrin:

The whole job cost me close to $490[/quote:dfd7c8ac32] I got a quote yesterday when I went to get my injectors cleaned and they quoted me between $800 & $900.. :(

hey crystal was that just for the extractors or a full system. if its for extractors(pacemaker) tell them to jam it but thats a pretty good price for a full system. also how much did your injector clean cost?

I'd go RPW if you car is lowered, just because they don't dip any more below standard.

I got a quote yesterday when I went to get my injectors cleaned and they quoted me between $800 & $900.. :(
You should get a guy to ring up to get the pricing for you and/or tag along with you. If you're single no doubt there's many eligible, good looking batchelours on this forum that would be willing to hold your hand for a few moments while you ask the man behind the counter for a price.

I know, it sounds sexist and all that, but thats the way society works.

magwgn: I don't think it was for a full system but i'm not positive, got my injectors cleaned for $150.

magna: I've learnt thats the way it works many times so i did get my bf to ask for me so ..... i dono why so much :?

well, i think that the change in airflow/data is just too much for the sensor to manage. just my 2c. or it could be my mechanic just manhandled it too much!! hey clarion, so it was your o2 sensor right??? told ya!! nice lowering job by the way!!! now the 18's do look like 18's

well it looks like it is not my o2 sensor as first thought, after testing the o2 sensor it proved to be alright so i used the car self diagnosis system and came up that my airflow sensor and air temp sensor are at fault, weird considering iu had the exact same problems as u did.

does anyone think the pacemaker extractors would make a worthwile difference on a 2001 vrx ? i got quoted about $800

800? **** that

checkebay and a company called online performance autos first, they sell them for 380 then look around for a good deal on installation

That's right, I got mine from Onautos.com.au for $380 and then just shop around for your install, shouldn't be more than $150 for install, so you do the maths.

I had Pacemakers installed a month ago - $400 fully fitted. There's no doubt it revs easier and there is a definite shove in the back from 3000 rpm up. I can't say low down torque was significantly improved (however, the Powerchip provided plenty of that). Teamed with a panel filter and Powerchip, it makes for a fast machine. Only wish I'd bought the manual now!!

Guys im unsure on how the magna ecu works. But after installing anything like extractors, cold air intakes and such I would recomend resetting the ECU. On fords I know this makes a huge differance and everthing relearns with the new mods straight away. Its usally reset overnight with the battery disconnected on the fords.

Also extractors on fords also seem to kill oxy sensors, mine went on my EB and my AU after around 10,000 km.

You should also notice the exhaust note change over the next few weeks. it's just the extractors setting in. Also what type of gasket did they use on them some people decide to use gaskets that are slightly oversized and of course that actually will restrict flow out of the exhaust and also cause pre mature gasket trouble.

Have you got an exhaust done to this car if so whats the exact size and is it mandrel or press bent, is it also stainless or just normal steel.

Hope some of this info can help you guys out. If you have any questions feel free to ask.

Have you got an exhaust done to this car if so whats the exact size and is it mandrel or press bent, is it also stainless or just normal steel.



Wasn't sure if this was directed at me or not? But yes, my car has a Cat back system, not the best, it's press bent, and just normal steel, the quality of the welds are poor and the more i talk about it the more i want to get rid of it .. HAHA...

Also extractors on fords also seem to kill oxy sensors, mine went on my EB and my AU after around 10,000 km.


Yep. my oxy died after about 10,000k's. it was great... i actually think its starting to die again......

I also had the oxy sensor die a week after I had Wildcat extractors fitted on my 98 3.0, this happened when I first took it for a good hammer because i wanted to find out if there was any top end gain, as there was no gain in bottom end or midrange I could see. Mine also starts to pull hard from after 3'000 but I think there is a loss compared to stock from straight off the line.
Be careful of getting no error code from the oxy sensor and thinking its ok. Mitsubishi tested mine and said nothing wrong with anything including the Oxy sensor, however when I disconnected it the problem stopped.

800 ouch!

Not for pacemakers.

Im getting fully custom made extractors for my dohc for 800 bucks!

I was quoted $850 from Australias Best :shock: :shock: Has anybody in Sydney had them installed and where did you get it done?

what do i look out for when the oxy sensor dies?

it will not be able to compare the Oxygen that's coming out from your engine to that of the outside and it should give an error code to the ECU (this is assuming the oxy sensor is already clogged or failed working), and your ECU will always be in open loop rather than closed loop, it will look up the static table for the amount of Fuel to use instead of using the data that the oxy sensor gives it.

But if your oxy is about to die, your ECU will always think that you're using more the Oxygen than that you are, and it will reduce the amount of fuel, and it will keep doing this to the point where your car will run really lean and eventually lead to damage in the engine, you should feel rough idles and poor response if your oxy is dead.

my problem was a surging below 3'000 rpm on acceleration especially noticable under load, up hills and with aircon on, like fuel cutting in and out in a cycling pattern, eventually traced to the oxy sensor.

How would fitting extractors make a difference? does it alter the temp or add some noxious gasses from the newly installed pipes to damage the sensor or something?

It shortens the length of time the spent exhaust gases have to travel, and makes it a more efficient run too. It also increases the efficiency of how those gases are scavenged from the engine.

I have heard that the silicone if its not "neutral" used around the gaskets when heated can burn and foul the sensor,
also the mechanic that picked up the problem on mine said the sensor could not cycle fast enough with the extractors on, so was probably constantly trying to set back the fuel injection to closed loop mode every few seconds, closed loop mode is a leaner air fuel mixture meant for cruising at constant speeds to increase economy and decrease emissions. with the decreased back pressure of the extractors the sensor felt like it was cruising even though it was under acceleration, so kept cutting back the fuel pulses.

so would our counter measure be to reset the ECU? and let it start again?

would be worth a try I guess althouigh noone suggested it at the time. I was going to replace mine with a broad-band sensor, that is meant to be the way to go when you start developing the engine performancegenerally, these cost around 500$, I had mine replaced with an ordinary one at RPW for about 120$ and works ok. Auto-masters had picked up the problem and said they can get around it on hi-po exhausts by putting in 2 sensors, so even if one is stuffed 2 new ones for about 250$ would be better than $500 for a broad-band.

Ok all, just so you all know it is not the fact there are extractors that kill them it is 2 other external factors.

1/ the paint used to coat them can have an effect
2/ as prev said in this thread the sealant.

On both Liquidhotmagna's and Whitedevils car we used the correct sealant for o2 sensors and cats.

Broad band oxygen sensors are really only for rough tuning an engine - they have a wider response range to mixtures, but this is only necessary for detecting when you are *way* out - when properly tuned you shouldn't pass the limits of a normal oxy sensor.

That said, broadband sensors have a much shorter life - in the region of 30-40,000 Klms apparently. Ouch.

Cheers
Heath Young