hey everyone hows it goin

this is my first post in the "audio" section, so as you can tell im quite new to the audio world

anyway, i have two pioneer 6x9's(3-way) in the back, and two 6 inch(3-way) speakers in the front, my deck is a JVC MP3 deck (50x40watt).

the problem is that this set-up doesn't really deliver a high enough amount of bass, which i feel is necessary :) haha

does anyone know if i can just buy a two-channel amp and a sub (10 inch?), to compliment my already existing system ?

or will the sub dominate everything else in the car?

also, does anyone know of any good cheap subs and amps ?

im only chasing a bit more bass........ i not really after the boot-shaking-ear-bursting stuff......... just a bit more bass at an affordable price .....


all replies will be greatly appreciated

later 8)

Have you got a budget for your planned upgrade?

The optimum system we're aiming for in to have your front speakers and sub amplified (you're sitting at the front, facing forward). The rears should ultimately remian running off the head unit. Also remember the amp is not just to go louder - the system will run a lot cleaner and sound clearer with a larger external amplifier running the show. :)

Oh, and a word of warning regarding cheap components - they're exactly that. Have a good think about it before you begin shelling out money for risky components. :(

Cheap, good and reliable I'd recommend Jaycar stuff.

I know most people say "pfft Jaycar" but they havent heard them ;)


If you ran an amped sub, you'd *really* want to amp all your speakers, that way you can the most out of them, not necessarily volume wise (though you will get that too) but sound quality.

Oh, and a word of warning regarding cheap components - they're exactly that. Have a good think about it before you begin shelling out money for risky components. :(

That's not always true...but I'll admit there is a lot more crap cheap stuff than good cheap stuff.

It's a matter of 1stly budgeting, and then researching for stuff inside that budget.

Not that I know anything about car audio, but I reckon it comes down to your definition of cheap. Anyone else seen those "Avalanche" subs that Strathfield advertise? 12" sub for less than $50! Now that can't be good :lol: :roll:

Agreed!! lol

hey yeah and there was a $29 and $40 6x9s....

lol

godda love the Strathfield crew

lol
:p

Cheap, good and reliable I'd recommend Jaycar stuff.

I know most people say "pfft Jaycar" but they havent heard them ;)



Here is my Jaycar/Response contribution :)

I must say though, Jaycar have been bringing in some dodgy products lately, so buyers beware! ie. Don't get the Venom subs, they are crap, Response woofer drivers are good, and Vifa would have to be one of the best drivers in the world. Oh and Response amps are value for money and performance too :)

lol I actually have a venom sub..and for the money it'll blow anything else away in that price bracket.

Well i am definately a quailty over quantity audiophile. And sorry KB, the venom subs are loud, but the few i have heard sound absoloutely terrible. My opinion.

Benny, idealy, you'd wanna amplify all your speakers because:
A) An amp should give at least 40rms per speaker (your deck only gives approx. 15-22rms [they quote 50wx4 MAX])
B) Gain control is gods gift to bad speakers. You can turn the bass right down on your speakers and get the majority from your subs, or set it up any way you like.
C) Both of these will greatly reduce distortion from your speakers.

I would get a five channel amp, like the Fusion FE-505 (look it up at www.fusioncaraudio.co.nz) Its under products/encounter/amplifiers/FE-505. Its good for 40wrms x4 into 4ohms (most decent speaker) + 125 x1 into 4ohms.
This amplifier is a remote subwoofer gain control capable amp. That means you can have a control up the front of your car that allows you to turn your sub up and down as you please! I'm unsure of the cost of the amp, but Fusion is generally fairly cheap, especially the encounter series and i know a shop owner that swears by it (despite the fact that he used to have an all JL Audio system, which is top end gear) for budget bass.
With this you could run a 10" Fusion Encounter subwoofer, or look around for another.

This is an easy system to run and you have all the control you need. As you get more keen on car audio (as inevitabley happens), you will still be able to twist and change the system as you like because the amplifier can be changed to a 3-channel amp and run 3 subs or a powerful pair of splits and a sub.

Sorry about the long post but i think people generally overlook Fusion as it is a brand carried by Tonkins etc rather than Strathfield. In car audio, you get what you pay for, but sometimes you can cut a few corners with good bargaining and good research. :D

Hope i helped.

Cheers,
Cam.

P.S I don't pretend to be an expert, i just have some strong opinions :D No offence to you KB.

as a side note:
wrms is the CONTINUOUS power handling/output of a given speaker/amplifier. Most often quote for decks is the MAXIMUM power output, which is very misleading and i have known a lot of very smart people be confused by this simple thing
ohm is the resistance of the speaker. The less ohms of a speaker the less resistance. 2 ohm is less resistant than 4 ohm, which allows more power to the speaker.
If i'm wrong in my theory, feel free to educate me please! :D :D

cheers for all the replies :)

...so the basic idea is to run the speakers of an amp aswell as the sub ?

could this be done for under $500 ?

thanks for any replies 8)

i reckon about $500 for the amp and possibly $200 for the sub? maybe cheaper.
Its a good price for what you get.

If you want, you can have my kenwood 50wrmsx4 for $100. Its output is blown and i am told it is $150 for kenwood to repair. I'm not bothering because i am upgrading to a 80wrmsx4 or maybe a 100wrmsx4.

Well i am definately a quailty over quantity audiophile. And sorry KB, the venom subs are loud, but the few i have heard sound absoloutely terrible. My opinion.

No offence taken, everyone has their opinion.

Just realise the price bracket Im talking about though, I paid 80 dollars for mine. lol!!!

So you're looking at the bottom end of everything at that price, and it was the best one for that price. Still not that great when you add another 100 bucks in the mix I admit, I never claimed that. :D

But I was on a very tight budget when I got my system so I had to get the best for that budget I had, FYI My system cost me $614, so it was very budget.

I have all jaycar gear: Resposne kevlar 6.5" splits, 4x100 response amp, and the 12" venom in a sealed enclosure I built myself.

Not the most fantastic set up I'll agree...but it does the job for me. I will agree that the Venom isnt the greatest, but it's certainly not the worst ;) lol...there is some SHIT out there! hhaha

haha.. for $614 you did alright for yourself! For me, one of my subs is worth more than that ($750), tho i only paid $450.

$80 for one sub is pretty good. And i know that people love those response amps.. a lot of wrms cheap.

As far as worse brands, thats for sure. My brother bought a deck from a brand (forget the name, begins with an A) that had a 100% failure rating in their headunits. Every single unit they sold was sent back before the warranty was up!! And this is a "better" brand than sound4! pffft!

Anyway, like i said, quality over quantity and Fusion is good quality for the price you pay!

Cam.

My sub cost $90, and it is a pioneer 500w free air sub, best bargain I ever did buy, did'nt need a box either, put it in the rear parcel shelf, my amp is a avalanche 500w for $79 works a real treat but only running the sub, my head unit is a sony cdx-l490x with equalizer for $229 and sony flat speakers for the front doors which cost me $39 and akai 300w 6x9s in the rear which cost me $39 too, So I think I have the most budget system out there, Oh and my amp wiring kit I got half price too for $30.

All up, $506, now that's BUDGET with a capitol "B".

I got all my components at either half price or heavily reduced in a sale, all up I reckon I did alright.

You did well man!!! :D

Go the budget systems ! :lol:

very true KB about the Venom subs being a very a good bargain. I bought some 8" Venom subs for $30 a piece to play around with, it worked, but not to the degree I wanted, and I found there was more rubber seal then there was of a cone! But yeah it was damn cheap.


Anyway I guess I have to admit i'm part of the budget club too :P

Let me see....an old skool Alpine head unit with a cassette deck and CD Shuttle Controls (Ai-Net) I borrowed indefinitely from a friend.

An Alpine 6 disc cd stacker I found on eBay for $150 brand new :lol:
Two $9 super tweeters from Jaycar mounted in where my 4" speakers used to be (TR). They work really well! Though i've currently got no woofers in the front still....

And two err....Akai 4-way 6x9"s (*shudder*) each mounted in a 15L (?) box made of MDF. Don't know how much my speakers costed me, got it as a present from my parents. The boxes costed me about $25 to make.

Now i'm actually glad the 6x9's are not expensive gear, the amount of times its been knocked (look at the grill now!) around, since i've actually been using my wagon for practicality!

I admit it's nothing fancy, but it does produce some really nice sound for the cost!

Don't worry my sound gear at home is composed of rather expensive gear since I do a bit of sound production and mastering, and also the fact I know its secure.

ahh and what Cam was saying about running the amp on 2ohm impedence, well its all to do with the speaker, just as he said.

So if some salesperson tries to sell you an amp capable of doing 2ohms, you will still need to find a speaker driver that has 2ohms impedence as well.

And i can say there isn't that many out there. What it does mean is it will let you wire up say, two 4ohm speakers in parallel, which will cause the amp to think its running a 2ohm load. I know this gets much more technical, but you should know now that this is what the intended purpose should be of amps with a specified 2ohm rating.

Other than that, you may find some drivers with dual coils (I know some JL Audio subs have this) where you can wire the coils in parallel which will result in a 2ohm total impedence. This is true if each coil is are 4ohms.

Sorry if I mixed keywords, but essentially, resistence = impedence = load.

They just have different connotations (i think thats the right word).

good point tecoDaN. The only time you will have issues with putting speakers in parallel is if you want to balance left or right, you can't. But i keep mine dead centre anyway... Oh, and apparently you lose a little sound quailty, i don't know for sure because i have never done it. However, i hardly expect it to be noticeable?

Persoanlly, i would just try and match impedence (load/resistance ;) ) of the speaker with that of the amp, much easier :D :D

hey everyone, so if i got say a pioneer sub and maybe a response amp .............. my overall system should sound alright ?

i might just go down to a couple of sound/shops and get their opinions

you're gonna be hardpressed about the Response amp if you ask around about it.

They'll just try and persuade you to buy their stuff. But come back here and tell us what they tried to sell you so we can give our opinions on it.


If you are running within a budget, your main concern now with that setup would be the box. A well designed box will max out the efficiency of your sub. Oh and good tuning too.

Yeah be warned if you mention Jaycar stuff in any place other than Jaycar...they'll try to tell you they're just as bad as Sound 4 headunits :lol:

I havn't read all of the above posts so sorry if I repeat anything anyone has already covered. :D

If you want a good package for under $500, I highlly recomend Audio Line amps, there not the best performing but are very good value for money. I have a few mates with these amps and they can't kill them.

A good combo is a nice 12" Pioneer bullet sub teamed with a 4 channel AudioLine amp. One of my mates got this package for $380 (sub not in box) from JB-HiFi and they even threw in the wiring kit for free. And the low end bass reponse is amazing for such a low end sub, It is more than enough for most styles of music.