Well, not my first passion is almost satisfied (car audio), its time to move onto some real mechanical aspects of the car.

Just a qucik run down, car has jused under 95,000 on it, so its fairly new. 2000 TJ sports, Manual. Since I got the car, oil has been changed with fully Syn every 5,000k with filter. Most servicing has been done at home, following the book, plus more.

Now, im getting some prices for timing belts, water pump, sparkies etc, to be replaced withing a week or two.

Next, is the need for some mods. Need to stay NA for insurance reasons, but basically, most other mods are nice. Cat back is allready taken car off at the moment, with a high flow muffler, and 2.5inch cat back, mandrel bent.

I need some advice on what to go for next, and more importantly, ball parks on prices. I was thinking, strictly for enging, something similar to this.

Extractors
Throttle body
Cam, + pistons
Ecu
Maybe headwork

Does that sound about right ? Any suggestions, and ball park figures on prices.

Brakes and suspension are also in the process of being done, so this thread will be strictly mechanical please :)

Regards guys
Rob

almost the same situation maybe this thread (http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55517) could help

Extractors around the 650 mark
Throttle body - $1100 an up
Cam, + pistons - $1000 an up for the cam, $1500 an up for pistons an rings
Ecu piggyback - $1200 an up, standlone R2200 an up
headwork port polish and a shave around $1000

this only a quide line. thats around what i have spend so far

I have done similar mods, and working on some mods in the future as the same as you. here are some results.

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54788

Ive been reading both threads, and the information is very, very good, and interesting. Lenda, I hope you dont mind a few pms for advice ? lol.

How about labour costs for the more advanced stuff. Things like the cams, and pistons installed ?

Next, is the need for some mods. Need to stay NA for insurance reasons, but basically, most other mods are nice. Cat back is allready taken car off at the moment, with a high flow muffler, and 2.5inch cat back, mandrel bent.


If you were worried about insurance why did you remove the cat? thats a $10,000 if the epa find out, not to mention insurance wont get paid out because the car is unroadworthy

Sorry, was a typo. Was ment to say cat back is taken "Care" off. I would never remove the cat.

Sorry, was a typo. Was ment to say cat back is taken "Care" off. I would never remove the cat.
that clears it up then :P

Well get yourself some nice extractors [ala pacemaker] & EZBY manafold +TB..

Then when you are getting your timing belt done get your heads port/polished/shaved & port matched. Top it off with a Haltech interceptor or Unichip..


Pacemaker Extractors @ $650 installed
Manafold & Throttlebody @ $1000 installed [by yourself or by engine builder]
Headwork + Timing Belt Service + Labour @ $1600 ~ $2000
Piggyback @ $1200 ~ $1400 [fitted and tuned to 95 or 98 RON fuel]EST. TOTAL COST = $4500 ~ $5000

With the above setup you would only be looking at aroound 140~155kw at the wheels...A set of cams would open it up alot. I think a potential 145~160kw at the wheels is possible with ralliart cams... Mind you this would be a quite torquy set up and very fun on the street...


If you have a spare $300 to spare... Throw some ralliart cams in there AT LEAST. Custom cams will cost at least $1000... If you do cams dont forget valve springs!!

Hope this helps?

Regards
Alex

Ralliart Cams do not fit in a 6G72 24valve do they?

Definately the Headers, maybe from Pacemaker or RPW, Over-Sized Throttle Body and Cold Air In-Take System with a UNICHIP will give you power gains...

And for all these mods you can spend no more than around 3.5-4 G's these days...

Seems like ill be going Extractors and throttle body quite soon. Might save up, and get a piggyback and a retune.

The slowly slowey, new manifold, some headwork, up the compression and add cam.

Hopefully should net around 150kw atw.

Small update for you guys.

Engine mods had a slight delay as the car got lowered, and I splurged on some 20inch rims.
I recently bought a second hand (never used, brand new) set of Pacemakers for a fantastic price. They are waiting to be installed when I have a chance to take it somewhere. Dam me for always being at work.

Small update for you guys.

Engine mods had a slight delay as the car got lowered, and I splurged on some 20inch rims.
I recently bought a second hand (never used, brand new) set of Pacemakers for a fantastic price. They are waiting to be installed when I have a chance to take it somewhere. Dam me for always being at work.

I don't understand why would get 20" rims when you are chasing better performance. You've just gone back one step, 20" rims are very heavy.

There are plenty of threads around here to search. The bottom line is if you want significant power gains, bolt-on mods won't do it, you need more agressive cams with the appropriate mods to suit. This means proper research and lots of $$$.

To give you an idea, these are my plans:

-Custom cam profile (around 265-270 deg duration)
-Head port/polish/deck (Have 2nd set of heads to keep downtime to a minimum)
-10:1 Pajero ACL cast pistons (plus a bit of head shaving to give a tad more CR). This includes new bearings.
-Stiffer valve springs
-Adjustable FPR
-Adjustable Cam gears.
-Tune my Greddy Emanage to suit

I also have a "maybe" list, to meet greater flow requirements and revs, If I end up wanting to build around a "bigger" cam than above.

-Upsize to larger TB, custom intake tract.
-Fit ARP rod bolts
-Shotpeen/balance rods
-Haltech E6X.
-Full 3" exhaust
-Aftermarket fuel pump

I already have a full 2.5" exhaust and a greddy emanage sitting around. To do everything on the first list, I'd expect to spend around $5k all up, and be expecting to make about 170fwkw, or a bit more depending on cam profile chosen. The limiting factor here is I don't wanto be revving too high without strengthening the bottom end, reliability is a must.

With the "maybe" list i'd be expecting 200fwkw+, potentially a fair whack above that depending on chosen cam profile (at the cost of increasing loss of low-rpm driveability).

i agree...bigger wheels do slow you down. $$$money is def. the limiting or unlimiting factor. You need to spend a minimum of $5k to have some decent gains. I have spent around that on stage 1 cams, full zorst system..which i might add was a waste of money other than the extractors( hi flowing enough), emanage, etc. I have recently aquired an RPW plenum which i intend to fit very shortly and will have the car retuned shortly after. i think that will be my limit as i purchased this plenum about two days before finding out my missus is up the duff again:redface: if you have the opportunity esp. with an auto...do the intake plenum first. The cat and catback i fitted gained me no better times than the factory sports system down the 1/4.

I was always looking at a set of wheels. Initially was looking at a set of 18s, however the 20s came up for a good price, suit the car, and look horn.

Ill say this now, the 20s are for street use only, for any track outings, the 16s go back. For a car that spends most of its time on the street, the looks are quite important to me personally.

Interesting some havnt found a differene in the exhaust. I found a positive increase in the mid to upper rpm range when I fitted my 2.5inch cat back. Pacies are sitting in my garage, havnt been install yet, but will very soon

I was always looking at a set of wheels. Initially was looking at a set of 18s, however the 20s came up for a good price, suit the car, and look horn.

Ill say this now, the 20s are for street use only, for any track outings, the 16s go back. For a car that spends most of its time on the street, the looks are quite important to me personally.

Interesting some havnt found a differene in the exhaust. I found a positive increase in the mid to upper rpm range when I fitted my 2.5inch cat back. Pacies are sitting in my garage, havnt been install yet, but will very soon

I thought you had a sports..... I did notice a little bit of placebo affect like that too, but after taking it to the track it was just a little bit of a diff sound, but not any faster, even with a hi flow cat.

I do have a sports. I believe the stock system is a 2.25inch press bent, i replaced it with a 2.5inch mandrel bent.

There is a increase in power, however, it may be in part due to running no muffler aswell.

before any of this, do a manual conversion. There really isnt much point in doing all that to an auto... because you will spend heaps and only be as fast as a stock manual 3.5l :doubt:

I do have a sports. I believe the stock system is a 2.25inch press bent, i replaced it with a 2.5inch mandrel bent.

There is a increase in power, however, it may be in part due to running no muffler aswell.

Perhaps????...With the small amount of mods you have the exhaust would pose no restriction at 2.25 inch vs 2.5. It will come in handy enlarging for future serious mods, which i am glad i have done it now for having since put in cams. I guess i was dissapointed at the time, but it seems worth it now.

I agree, the increase in power was very small, but alas, it was still there. I mainly done it for the exhaust note, but really, it was only a few hundred spent for such a nice tone, I simply love it.

Oh, and ye, I do have a manual :D

I agree, the increase in power was very small, but alas, it was still there. I mainly done it for the exhaust note, but really, it was only a few hundred spent for such a nice tone, I simply love it.

Oh, and ye, I do have a manual :D

i missed that in your first post, but when giving advice on 'what should you do' most people will look at your user details...and find auto in your list...maybe update to help people out.

Ok done, profile updated.

Pacies have just been installed, as for an imporvment, there seems to be more meat in the middle of the rpm range, but, I havnt really given them a full test.

Interesting some of the mods you guys have sugested. One question. My setup atm consits of Headers, and 2.5inch cat back, muffler has been removed. If I was to get a piggyback, and a retune now, do you think it would be worth it ? What power increase would i get as a rough guess.

Secondly, some of the NA setups pulling 170fwkw, what quarter mile times do these pull ?

Im changing insurance companies, and the new company will not increase my premium at all if I go the Supercharged route. With a second hand Sprintex kit for sale, ive been seriously considring it, but alas, how does the Supercharged route compare with the NA route.

Ok done, profile updated.

Pacies have just been installed, as for an imporvment, there seems to be more meat in the middle of the rpm range, but, I havnt really given them a full test.

Interesting some of the mods you guys have sugested. One question. My setup atm consits of Headers, and 2.5inch cat back, muffler has been removed. If I was to get a piggyback, and a retune now, do you think it would be worth it ? What power increase would i get as a rough guess.

Secondly, some of the NA setups pulling 170fwkw, what quarter mile times do these pull ?

Im changing insurance companies, and the new company will not increase my premium at all if I go the Supercharged route. With a second hand Sprintex kit for sale, ive been seriously considring it, but alas, how does the Supercharged route compare with the NA route.

A piggyback with mods will net you anywhere between 6kw and 11kw ath wheels. Different dynos conditions....etc With all of my mods minus the plenum i gained around 8kwatw(auto) with emanage

The 170kwatw n/a guys are few and far between. Maybe p.m them. but expect alot $$$$ to get where they are.

A supercharger (2nd hand) will be a way better price /KW. I havn't spent quite as much as a new one but not far from it for less gain:doubt:

A piggyback with mods will net you anywhere between 6kw and 11kw ath wheels. Different dynos conditions....etc With all of my mods minus the plenum i gained around 8kwatw(auto) with emanage

The 170kwatw n/a guys are few and far between. Maybe p.m them. but expect alot $$$$ to get where they are.

A supercharger (2nd hand) will be a way better price /KW. I havn't spent quite as much as a new one but not far from it for less gain:doubt:

Seems like a fairly good gain. Either way, if I go NA, or forced induction, ill need a piggyback. May be better off doing it now, rather than after.

Seems like a fairly good gain. Either way, if I go NA, or forced induction, ill need a piggyback. May be better off doing it now, rather than after.

maybe get but not fit it until you have saved up and fitted a few more mods. that way you aren't wasting your money getting a dyno tune done at $150/hour each time you add a mod. I for example have to do that tomorrow after i installed an RPW plenum last weekend. i think it will be my last go faster mod tho:doubt:

So guys. I need some help to make a decision. I have two paths to follow, and need to make a decision quite soon.

Choice 1:

Second hand Sprintex Supercharger, plus aftermarket piggyback and retune. Going of past numbers of others, looks like it will net somewhere between 180-200fwkw.

All up, looking at about 8g, including install and custom tune.

Downsides is alot of people have negative things to say about the sprintex kit, and others say its a fast way to destroy a motor. Then again, imagine a rebuilt engine, running a proper cam grind that suits the supercharger, and 10pounds of boost. Expensive, but, in the longterm, should be a weapon of a car, maybe even reach 250fwkw.

Choice 2:

Stay Na. Get a Stage 2 or so cam, new manifold, headwork, high comp pistons and tune. Might net about 170fwkw, however engine will be stronger, and less likely to brake. Engine pretty much at its limit.

Im liking Choice 1 for now, but guys, any advice ?

Ok done, profile updated.

Pacies have just been installed, as for an imporvment, there seems to be more meat in the middle of the rpm range, but, I havnt really given them a full test.

Interesting some of the mods you guys have sugested. One question. My setup atm consits of Headers, and 2.5inch cat back, muffler has been removed. If I was to get a piggyback, and a retune now, do you think it would be worth it ? What power increase would i get as a rough guess.

Secondly, some of the NA setups pulling 170fwkw, what quarter mile times do these pull ?
Im changing insurance companies, and the new company will not increase my premium at all if I go the Supercharged route. With a second hand Sprintex kit for sale, ive been seriously considring it, but alas, how does the Supercharged route compare with the NA route.


Back in 2003 with one of my first modded 3.5L engines in my TH, i did a 14.001@106Mph with 171.2Kws@wheels. Since then i havnt run my car at the drags with any of the newer engines but that will all be changing once my latest built NA engine is in the car and run in.

Choice 2:

Stay Na. Get a Stage 2 or so cam, new manifold, headwork, high comp pistons and tune. Might net about 170fwkw, however engine will be stronger, and less likely to brake. Engine pretty much at its limit.



What limit? Jasons VRX's last motor made 240fwkw and 302 flywheel kw on an engine dyno. In NA form. Brendan (Ctulhu) had 207fwkw NA.

PLENTY of power to be had in NA form, as long as you go about it the right way. The result comes down to what sort of cam profile you wanto build around. Of course if you want make
200fwkw+ NA driveabilty will suffer, but managable with a manual.

For the cost of a brand new Sprintex or similar kit, you can actually make more power with an NA build. Where the blowers win out is convenience and driveability.


Back in 2003 with one of my first modded 3.5L engines in my TH, i did a 14.001@106Mph with 171.2Kws@wheels. Since then i havnt run my car at the drags with any of the newer engines but that will all be changing once my latest built NA engine is in the car and run in.

Jason with 106mph trapspeed from a magna I'm sure you could have run quicker than 14.0, more like mid-low 13's with an LSD and good driving/conditions IMO. Pity you never ran a 1/4 with your 240fwkw motor, eagerly awaiting what you do with your new build!

So Chisholm, say you had 8g to play with, that includes a computer and retune, what would you do to the car, and how much power you think you could get out of it NA ?

Its a tough decision Sprintex vs NA, but, I have budgeted about 8g for the sprintex kit to be installed, tunned, and running 100%.

Is Na a better call ?

Well put it this way, Ctulhu's 207fwkw build could probably be done for around 8k, if everything is done in one stage and nothing goes wrong.

The only issue is on that budget you'll likely run out of money to do any strengthening/balancing work. I'm not sure I'd feel comfortable making peak power at ~6500rpm on the stock bottom end (and therefore probably revving close to 7k). At this stage I'd be wanting to at least get the rods shotpeened with ARP rodbolts fitted, and aftermarket bearings. No point in building a motor if you can't have faith in it's reliability, making a 200fwkw+ build 100% reliable would blow out the 8k budget.

Though keep in mind my car sees tracktime, so I'm not willing to take any risks on reliability, even minor ones.

The NA build I have in mind (though actually recently I've been sidetracked by the possibility of buying a second-hand blower kit) was to make around 170fwkw with 260-270deg cams. That way you don't have to trade off driveability, keep the revs at a reasonable enough level to not need strengthening work, can keep the factory TB etc.

On top of the exhaust and second-hand piggyback and spare heads I already have, I would expect to spend around 5k to do this, assuming everything goes fairly smoothly. That's paying a workshop to do it, with free/cheap labour the cost comes down quite alot.

So Chisholm, say you had 8g to play with, that includes a computer and retune, what would you do to the car, and how much power you think you could get out of it NA ?

Its a tough decision Sprintex vs NA, but, I have budgeted about 8g for the sprintex kit to be installed, tunned, and running 100%.

Is Na a better call ?

remember if you do go NA and rebuild the motor and whatnot the car will be off the road for a number of weeks/months wheres a S/C kit aka sprintex is only a couple of days at the most. Other then that supercharger noise > all

Well put it this way, Ctulhu's 207fwkw build could probably be done for around 8k, if everything is done in one stage and nothing goes wrong.

I concur.

I concur.

Ah Brendan you're still lurking here after all :P

Well put it this way, Ctulhu's 207fwkw build could probably be done for around 8k, if everything is done in one stage and nothing goes wrong.

The only issue is on that budget you'll likely run out of money to do any strengthening/balancing work. I'm not sure I'd feel comfortable making peak power at ~6500rpm on the stock bottom end (and therefore probably revving close to 7k). At this stage I'd be wanting to at least get the rods shotpeened with ARP rodbolts fitted, and aftermarket bearings. No point in building a motor if you can't have faith in it's reliability, making a 200fwkw+ build 100% reliable would blow out the 8k budget.

It can be done for cheaper than 8K if ya can do the spanner work yaself

Example: ARP rod bolt set cost me just over $90, fitting the bolts costs nothing but ya do have to relieve the rod "caps" 1-2mm (on 3.5L engines) to allow the theaded ends of the bolts to protrude further thru the caps (i wont go into detail here on why and what that means but the relieving can be stuffed up really easily). Shotpeening costs nothing if ya have access to a good bead blaster (which i do) and i get conrods resized for $8 per rod.

So all up fit ARP bolts, shotpeen and resize a set of 3.5 rods for around the $140 mark but as ive said this is because of doing the work myself and thru getting parts at very good prices.

At the end of the day, if ya have the knowledge, time and resources anything can be done for minimal outlay in money.

Ah Brendan you're still lurking here after all :P

Yeah, I lurk (:lurk:) randomly in NA performance thread.. it's like the Bat Signal for me ;) lol

After testing the EZ manifold over the last few days it would be hands down one of the best mods to start off an N/A build and would really help if you have done other serious mods the increases through the rev range is great and so smooth. put a big smile on me face and it has a great sound when you boot it.

The manifold will get the air to the valves. The rest is out of my hands ;)

ever since i "apparently" upgraded my exhaust, i believed an upgraded manifold would be a better option, especially on auto magnas. Having said that I now have an rpw manifold which i wish i bought in place of the exhaust. I would think EZY's would be even better with the work involved in producing it. Although alot people say it is not needed, a 3" cat is beneficial over 21/2" as well.

Alot of thinking has been going into what I plan to do in the future. Sprintex kit. NA now a decent manifold has been created.

I then went looking at other cars aswell, an Evo, WRX, but it seems an R32 GTR has cought me eye.

Still no idea what to do, but in my thinking, but the time I get the Magna to a mid 13second pass, its going to cost me money in engine mods (mind you, no LSD either in my car), and brake mods aswell. With the money I get by selling my Magna, then adding the money spent in moding the Magna, I can get a car that is stock quick, and have a better bass to work off.

Magna is different, cheaper to insure and overall, a very nice car to drive.

A GTR (or EVO/WRX), is done more often, but will be quicker in a straight line, and round the twisties.

Decisions, decisions.

Alot of thinking has been going into what I plan to do in the future. Sprintex kit. NA now a decent manifold has been created.

I then went looking at other cars aswell, an Evo, WRX, but it seems an R32 GTR has cought me eye.

Still no idea what to do, but in my thinking, but the time I get the Magna to a mid 13second pass, its going to cost me money in engine mods (mind you, no LSD either in my car), and brake mods aswell. With the money I get by selling my Magna, then adding the money spent in moding the Magna, I can get a car that is stock quick, and have a better bass to work off.

Magna is different, cheaper to insure and overall, a very nice car to drive.

A GTR (or EVO/WRX), is done more often, but will be quicker in a straight line, and round the twisties.

Decisions, decisions.

just keep in mind that GTR's Evo's Wrx's will attract a higher premium on your insurance not to mention the boys in blue will notice you more and theifs will target you more in one of those, that and you wont be as unique.

just keep in mind that GTR's Evo's Wrx's will attract a higher premium on your insurance not to mention the boys in blue will notice you more and theifs will target you more in one of those, that and you wont be as unique.

Yes yes and yes.

Agree with everything, ive got some insurance quotes, and, even considering ive lost my license for speeding, the above cars arnt to expensive, considering what they are. Premium is a bit more, its the excess where they seem to get me, ie, the performance cars have an excess for theft (magna does not), and the excess is about 1,000more for the above cars.

Your also right about the boys in blue, but, if tasfully done, and mods done legally, I shouldnt have to many issues. That said, the boys in blue seem to be allright when your sensible and have a good attitude. Pulling into RBTs with a hell loud exhaust, and car lowered on 20s, nobody has ever sad a thing. So, alot of the time tis the driver, not the car :D.

However, as I said. Its not a definite thing, but ive been doing alot of hard thinking the last few days. I love the way the Magna drives, love the motor, love the car. But I cant stop thinking

Magna - mid 13s
Skyline - 12 second pass.

Both cars with the same initial outlay. Then, the Skyline is going to handle to much better, and, have so much more potential

But unlike the EVO, WRX and Skyline you can't test drive a Magna on the Playstation so your first drive probably got you excited enuf to buy it. Now you've realised its gunna cost $$$. That said it's cool watching a commodore owners eyes widen as you pull away from him at 160kph :naughty:

But unlike the EVO, WRX and Skyline you can't test drive a Magna on the Playstation so your first drive probably got you excited enuf to buy it. Now you've realised its gunna cost $$$. That said it's cool watching a commodore owners eyes widen as you pull away from him at 160kph :naughty:

:bowrofl: and to think soon we all we will be pulling away from them even faster once everyone has your manifold!

:bowrofl: and to think soon we all we will be pulling away from them even faster once everyone has your manifold!

Excatly, lol.

I just want to get one thing straight. I am in not way dissin the Magna. Love the car.

Should be heading down to the strip this coming week anyway, to see what my car pulls down the quarter will be interesting.

Mods are pacemakers, and 2.5inch cat back, however, remember, im running no muffler. The car feels so much faster than another mates TJ Manual sports. Ive also had an ex VRX owner say my car picks up quicker than his did, and pulls so much cleaner in second, third.

No idea what the quarter holds however.

Yes yes and yes.

Agree with everything, ive got some insurance quotes, and, even considering ive lost my license for speeding, the above cars arnt to expensive, considering what they are. Premium is a bit more, its the excess where they seem to get me, ie, the performance cars have an excess for theft (magna does not), and the excess is about 1,000more for the above cars.

Your also right about the boys in blue, but, if tasfully done, and mods done legally, I shouldnt have to many issues. That said, the boys in blue seem to be allright when your sensible and have a good attitude. Pulling into RBTs with a hell loud exhaust, and car lowered on 20s, nobody has ever sad a thing. So, alot of the time tis the driver, not the car :D.

However, as I said. Its not a definite thing, but ive been doing alot of hard thinking the last few days. I love the way the Magna drives, love the motor, love the car. But I cant stop thinking

Magna - mid 13s
Skyline - 12 second pass.

Both cars with the same initial outlay. Then, the Skyline is going to handle to much better, and, have so much more potential


Skylines (GTSt's) are like clits every ***** has one. :bowrofl:

Na seriously moding a magna may not give the same overall outcome as the above (but a nice mechanically modded 3.5 manual magna can sure as hell shock the pants off some of them), me id rather have something different, instead of being a sheep like other people and just follow the crowd.

In all honesty each to there own, ya have do do what you want and not let others influence you, if we did we would all drive and mod the same cars and wouldnt that be boring....lol

GTS' are done to bits, but, GTRs are not very common.

Not many people can pick the difference however. Thankfully, most of the time I can.

Many people have been amazed in trafic light drags, even passangers go, wow, what are you running. These things keep draging my back to the Magna, and doing some serious work to it.

Does anyone know any prices on a set of Forged pistions for my car. Keeping the stock compression.

Does anyone know any prices on a set of Forged pistions for my car. Keeping the stock compression.

Change from a $1000 US from CP. The compression is actually reduced with these pistons which is a good idea given we don't have knock sensors.

Does anyone know any prices on a set of Forged pistions for my car. Keeping the stock compression.

shoot tzaboy a PM as well he got forgies made up for his car when he cooked his last set.

Does anyone know any prices on a set of Forged pistions for my car. Keeping the stock compression.


pajero pistons FTW. Slightly higher compression.

Change from a $1000 US from CP. The compression is actually reduced with these pistons which is a good idea given we don't have knock sensors.

CP also have a 11.0:1 set of pistons that will fit the 6G74 as well :D

Oh and the 6G74 DOHC NJ/NK 10:1 comp pajero pistons will set you back around $400 (well that the price i get them for here in SA) a set with rings, that is for the ACL/Mahle brand.

CP also have a 11.0:1 set of pistons that will fit the 6G74 as well :D

Oh and the 6G74 DOHC NJ/NK 10:1 comp pajero pistons will set you back around $400 (well that the price i get them for here in SA) a set with rings, that is for the ACL/Mahle brand.

What are the CPs worth with rings mate?

Im going down the Supercharger route guys, so really, if anything I need lower compression.

Stock compression should be fine aswell.

Im going down the Supercharger route guys, so really, if anything I need lower compression.

Stock compression should be fine aswell.

CP forgies thru Tearstone or CP direct in the US if they'll sell to you. Good decision btw ;)

What are the CPs worth with rings mate?

Mine set me back a little over 1k, the expensive parts for me where the H beam forged rods

Edie: My compression will be a little higher than the stock 9:1

Mine set me back a little over 1k, the expensive parts for me where the H beam forged rods

Edie: My compression will be a little higher than the stock 9:1

Aren't forged rods rather expensive overkill for 10psi? AFAIK the RPW magna runs factory rods (though shotpeened and aftermarket rod bolts) with around 500 wheel hp and never had any issues with them.

Aren't forged rods rather expensive overkill for 10psi? AFAIK the RPW magna runs factory rods (though shotpeened and aftermarket rod bolts) with around 500 wheel hp and never had any issues with them.


Pfft 10psi, that's nuttin :D
Original rods would have to me shotpeened and machined to accept ARP rod bolts, they may be strong enough for the 500hp RPW machine but the 3.5's are also supposed to be able to handle 7psi easily to.....................
Mine's gonna be revving it tit's off, be pumping a boost number somewhere above 10psi and I'm not gonna have it bend a rod, snap a rod stretch a rod or anything bad to happen to the factory rods and have to get the bloody thing pulled down, new bearings, rods, bolts, custom head gaskets, seals and other gaskets.

Fair enough, if in doubt always better to play it safe :)

Fair enough, if in doubt always better to play it safe :)

That's what thouse health adverts say :P

son do you know what the word malignant means?

CP also have a 11.0:1 set of pistons that will fit the 6G74 as well :D


worth the cash you reckon? and who are CP?

Ok. Advice needed somemore guys.

After alot of thinking, tossing up between many differnt cars (GTRs, GTIRs, EVOs, 200s, Commodores, Falcons, WRXs) I have decided to stick with the Magna. Its just to good a car to get rid of. Handles well, looks good, goes good, good ability to install a decent stereo.

I then almost bought a second-hand Sprintex Supercharger, but unfortunality, lost in a bidding war.
Now, the decision is to go NA 100%. The goal, 190fwkw or higher, and a 13second pass.

Im picking up a spare set of heads tomorrow in order to keep downtime to a minimum. They are going to be sent off to a well recomended mechanic as to port them. Pretty much the same work will be done to my heads, as was done to TZABOYs.

Im also after some rough approx prices for items, and labour. I can ask workshops, but at the end of the day, without a bass price, anyprice sounds ok to me.

I need the rods shortpeened and balanced with ARP bolts fitted. (what excatly shortpeening is, I have no idea).

Pistons, I can either go the Pajero pistions with a 10.1 ratio, or CP pistons with a 11.1 Ratio. CP is about twice the price. Is there going to be a large performance increase going the CP over the Pajero pistions?

Next is the cam. From what those have said, even an agressive cam is quite ok on the street with a manual. Im looking somwhere between 280degress of duration, and above.

The offcourse cam gears, and stiffer valve springs are needed. New piggyback, and retune. Eyes are also open to Ez manifold results.

So guys, have I missed anything much ? At this power, I might be looking at a new fuel pump, and maybe injectors aswell.

Prices on headwork I allready know. Prices on pistions, and cams I know aswell. Its the labour side of things im worried about, especially to do with the rods.

Ok. Advice needed somemore guys.

After alot of thinking, tossing up between many differnt cars (GTRs, GTIRs, EVOs, 200s, Commodores, Falcons, WRXs) I have decided to stick with the Magna. Its just to good a car to get rid of. Handles well, looks good, goes good, good ability to install a decent stereo.

I then almost bought a second-hand Sprintex Supercharger, but unfortunality, lost in a bidding war.
Now, the decision is to go NA 100%. The goal, 190fwkw or higher, and a 13second pass.

Im picking up a spare set of heads tomorrow in order to keep downtime to a minimum. They are going to be sent off to a well recomended mechanic as to port them. Pretty much the same work will be done to my heads, as was done to TZABOYs.

Im also after some rough approx prices for items, and labour. I can ask workshops, but at the end of the day, without a bass price, anyprice sounds ok to me.

I need the rods shortpeened and balanced with ARP bolts fitted. (what excatly shortpeening is, I have no idea).

Pistons, I can either go the Pajero pistions with a 10.1 ratio, or CP pistons with a 11.1 Ratio. CP is about twice the price. Is there going to be a large performance increase going the CP over the Pajero pistions?

Next is the cam. From what those have said, even an agressive cam is quite ok on the street with a manual. Im looking somwhere between 280degress of duration, and above.

The offcourse cam gears, and stiffer valve springs are needed. New piggyback, and retune. Eyes are also open to Ez manifold results.

So guys, have I missed anything much ? At this power, I might be looking at a new fuel pump, and maybe injectors aswell.

Prices on headwork I allready know. Prices on pistions, and cams I know aswell. Its the labour side of things im worried about, especially to do with the rods.

from memory shotpeening rods is where they view the rod under a special light or xray to see if there is any stress in the material, then they balance them and so on, i can ask my uncle he rebuilds plane motors for a living and does this regularly so he will know exactly, as for a complete rebuild including pistons etc budget around 5-6k for the labour alone, that hopefully will give you some headroom if something doesnt go to plan.

from memory shotpeening rods is where they view the rod under a special light or xray to see if there is any stress in the material, then they balance them and so on, i can ask my uncle he rebuilds plane motors for a living and does this regularly so he will know exactly, as for a complete rebuild including pistons etc budget around 5-6k for the labour alone, that hopefully will give you some headroom if something doesnt go to plan.

That makes sense, thankyou :).

What do they don in balancing however, lol. Bit of a newb with the technical side of engines.

Also, I didnt think labour would be that expensive. Considering the head will be ported elsewhere. All the mechanic needs to do is the shortpeen, balance, and ARP bolt the rods, add the pistions heads and cam. I was told, its a fairly simple job :S. Perhaps I was told wrong.

That makes sense, thankyou :).

What do they don in balancing however, lol. Bit of a newb with the technical side of engines.

Also, I didnt think labour would be that expensive. Considering the head will be ported elsewhere. All the mechanic needs to do is the shortpeen, balance, and ARP bolt the rods, add the pistions heads and cam. I was told, its a fairly simple job :S. Perhaps I was told wrong.

as i said budget for that much incase there is a problem for a bottom end rebuild you should get out of it for under 1500 depending on if they will bore it out and acid dip it etc, also depends if the bloke has done this motor or not before as well can make a difference. 5k should including your heads as well

Sounds better then. Bit closer to what I budgeted, lol.

Hopefully the bottom end can hold up to the task. Suppose ill see soon enough. Just so you all know, this motor wont be finished for a lonnggg time me thinks. I have to save up somemore, by the parts, find someone I trust to install them, get the car tunned etc.

I tend not to rush many things that I do.

Sounds better then. Bit closer to what I budgeted, lol.

Hopefully the bottom end can hold up to the task. Suppose ill see soon enough. Just so you all know, this motor wont be finished for a lonnggg time me thinks. I have to save up somemore, by the parts, find someone I trust to install them, get the car tunned etc.

I tend not to rush many things that I do.

yeah should hold up alright so long as its done properly the first time, the rods and crank are more then up to the task of 200kw or so ATW only thing i would be worried about is the standard diff/clutch

from memory shotpeening rods is where they view the rod under a special light or xray to see if there is any stress in the material

shotpeeing is where they bombard the rod with shot to create deformations that strengthen the metal.

I was under the impression you could swap to aftermarket cams and keep existing springs + gears. If so what's the cheapest 11:1 pistons?

It sounds like cams + pistons + ecu + exhaust could be done under 5k for a fairly unreliable and powerful build.

I was under the impression you could swap to aftermarket cams and keep existing springs + gears. If so what's the cheapest 11:1 pistons?

It sounds like cams + pistons + ecu + exhaust could be done under 5k for a fairly unreliable and powerful build.

When changing cams, most say to change the Valve springs while your at it. Cost isnt much more, and the engine is much more reliable. I think CP are the only mob who make the 11.1 pistions, are prices are about $1,000. The wilder you go with cams, the more important high compression becomes.

Apparantly RPW stage 1 cams have the same power as stage 2 cams on stock compression. With new pistons however, its a different story.


EDIT: What do you guys think of ARP studs for the crank. Worth doing while the engine is apart ?

from memory shotpeening rods is where they view the rod under a special light or xray to see if there is any stress in the material, then they balance them and so on, i can ask my uncle he rebuilds plane motors for a living and does this regularly so he will know exactly, as for a complete rebuild including pistons etc budget around 5-6k for the labour alone, that hopefully will give you some headroom if something doesnt go to plan.

X-raying is sometimes done as well, but is not the same thing as shotpeening. Shotpeening is basically blasting an object with small metal balls at high speed.

I would expect to pay around $1000 labour to have new pistons fitted, fresh bearings and heads pulled off and put back on.

Not sure what shotpeening a set of rods costs, but I would guess a few hundred bucks.

5-6k on labour? I doubt that even with a huge amount of prep work (e.g deburring block, re-boring etc), ful balance and blueprint etc..Basically the type of build for a very high-hp race engine..hardly irrelevent to what we are talking about here.

Say one wanted a fairly reliable streetable car, good for thrashing in a straight line occasionally or twisties very rarely that will never see the track... would the following be reasonable

-$1k forged high comp pistons
-leave rods, bearings + bolts alone, try not to break them
-crazy cams direct from Tighe, ~$1k?
-aftermarket piggyback + tune (possibly second hand) $1k
-exhaust + filter $500
-labour, big ??? here, $1k again?
-manifold perhaps, if/when EZ has a final version $850

All seem fairly reasonable, main question is will injectors be maxed out? Injectors + FPR + ext pump will all cost more again...

Basically the cheap/fast/reliable conundrum, fast being the main goal with slight reliability sacrifice.

Say one wanted a fairly reliable streetable car, good for thrashing in a straight line occasionally or twisties very rarely that will never see the track... would the following be reasonable

-$1k forged high comp pistons
-leave rods, bearings + bolts alone, try not to break them
-crazy cams direct from Tighe, ~$1k?
-aftermarket piggyback + tune (possibly second hand) $1k
-exhaust + filter $500
-labour, big ??? here, $1k again?
-manifold perhaps, if/when EZ has a final version $850

All seem fairly reasonable, main question is will injectors be maxed out? Injectors + FPR + ext pump will all cost more again...

Basically the cheap/fast/reliable conundrum, fast being the main goal with slight reliability sacrifice.

In all honesty forged pistons are over the top UNLESS you are planning on turbo/supercharging the engine or constantly running more than a 100hp shot of nitrous.

You have more chance of the stock bottom end going bang in NA form cos of the crap stock rod bolts which when combined with big revs can equal disaster.

People have asked why have i used forged pistons in my new NA engine, the reason is i plan to run at least a 100hp shot of nitrous and the bottom end has been built to rev to 7500rpm allday comfortably. I also needed at least 11:1 compression pistons for all this to work (as i want to be able to run the car hard without nitrous as well), be reliable and the only way to get that was with custom high comp units.

The cast ACL/Mahle 10:1 DOHC pistons are a great piston for people who want to build a nice strong street engine that will run easily on 95octane fuel with no issues and do it for a reasonably good price.

Say one wanted a fairly reliable streetable car, good for thrashing in a straight line occasionally or twisties very rarely that will never see the track... would the following be reasonable

-$1k forged high comp pistons
-leave rods, bearings + bolts alone, try not to break them
-crazy cams direct from Tighe, ~$1k?
-aftermarket piggyback + tune (possibly second hand) $1k
-exhaust + filter $500
-labour, big ??? here, $1k again?
-manifold perhaps, if/when EZ has a final version $850

All seem fairly reasonable, main question is will injectors be maxed out? Injectors + FPR + ext pump will all cost more again...

Basically the cheap/fast/reliable conundrum, fast being the main goal with slight reliability sacrifice.

I agree here with Jason VRX. The rod bolts will be much more important to change than to get Forged pistions. Hell, the stock pistions can take 7psi and not to do bad. With no boost, there going to be fine.