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carcycle
04-03-2008, 05:56 PM
Seeing as i got my wiring sorted out on the GT wagon and everythings in order (thanks for the words of advice), i decided to jazz up one of my already reapaired magnas that ive had just sitting aorund for a while.

You may remember these photos ive posted on here before... TP, 171,000kms, beautiful!

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/Item2.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/Item.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1084.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1098.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1103.jpg

Well i decided to make it a 'special edition' by adding some purple pinstriping on the sides, bonnet and front nose cone as well as a few special edition decals.

I was hoping i could get some feedback as to if you think it looks better like this as i have another two in the pipeline to be lightly repaired and the same sort of stickerage...differing coulor stripes though. However one will have a front and rear spoiler also as well as different wheels... So i need to know if it makes it look more appealing! As sometimes stickers make a car look stupid.

Photos are in nest post as to keep with the limitations... a few minutes away as i have to upload them, so ill be back!!

Be Honest!

Alex.

carcycle
04-03-2008, 06:10 PM
The sun/camera lets it down a bit but anyway...

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_183411.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_182511.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_183211.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_183111.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_182711.jpg

Actually, you cant even really see them in these pics.... dammit, i think you can get the idea though

Aströn Boy
04-03-2008, 06:17 PM
and the specialty of that model is? lol

looks good.... fix the bonnet. :D

carcycle
04-03-2008, 06:22 PM
Oh yeah, should mention that hey...

Its has...

Special Stripes
Special Wheels
Special Custom Front (tn on a tp)
and is is eSpecially nice condition


:bowrofl:

hehe, just to make em look a bit nicer and maybe make something think twice before going "pfft just an old magna" if ya know what i mean:P

Aströn Boy
04-03-2008, 06:45 PM
hahaha you're a classic.lol

still a nice car though

I personally don't like TP grilles. First mod I did to my wagon was TN the front, I prefer it so much more.

Gemini
04-03-2008, 09:02 PM
I wish i was in your state i would love to visit your place and just fix stuff all day lol

EDIT: and id buy that Datsun 280ZX from ya too

LeGiOnAiR
05-03-2008, 08:14 AM
Very nice mate....i def like the front end and the strips along the bonnet bludge. Top work.

magna buff
06-03-2008, 09:00 AM
magna wagon a build date on the plate of mar 91 in ok condition

I am loosing my eye sight

I magnified the build date using paint

the 0 at the end looks more like a 1
any one want to comment ?:nuts:

floater05
06-03-2008, 09:44 AM
not sure if i like the purple colour, not sure about the bonnet stripes:S maybe if they followed the bonnet lines to the nose. oh and, ditch the front mudflaps, or put some on the back lol

coldamus
06-03-2008, 10:01 AM
magna wagon a build date on the plate of mar 91 in ok condition on ebay

I am loosing my eye sight

I magnified the build date using paint

the 0 at the end looks more like a 1
any one want to comment ?

Saw that one. Body looks nice and clean. Has some minor problems but would be nice once fixed.

I don't see any reason to doubt the build date. No way I can read it.

I think my wagon's even later than that. It was first registered in Dec 91. I'm driving the sedan today but will check the plate on the wagon when I get home.

There's also an SE wagon in Vic. It is listed as an Elite but definitely an SE. It is not as clean but looks like it would also come up well. Needs overdrive fixed so should go cheap.

PeteW
06-03-2008, 07:03 PM
debadge the front 3 diamonds :) might get some gold and do my bonnet breaks it up nice

carcycle
06-03-2008, 08:40 PM
Yeah, about the bonnet stripes, not sure if i did them too short or not. I noticed today i did them a lot longer when i put them on the GT's.

Remove the front badge? hmmm... its not in it in the first lot of pics (without stripes) i actually got that badge to put it in hehe, im not sure which is better to be honest.

That gold wagon... i dont think thats anything special... like a special model or something, is that what you meant? The GT wagon i have was built november 91. They were still making them up till then coz there was not yet a TR wagon so i think its just a "commoner" hehe. I think Safari wagons are 91 models also... but thats not one. Unless i totally didnt get what you were trying to say, that happens sometimes :nuts: hehe.

Unfortunately the pics dont show the real colour of the purple stripes i put on, they look great in my opinion... a bit girly maybe hehe but, different... in a tidy/removable way if needed.

Going to possibly buy a TP SE Wagon in the morning so we shall see how that progresses and let ya'll know.

coldamus
15-03-2008, 06:12 AM
That gold wagon... i dont think thats anything special... like a special model or something, is that what you meant? The GT wagon i have was built november 91. They were still making them up till then coz there was not yet a TR wagon so i think its just a "commoner" hehe. I think Safari wagons are 91 models also... but thats not one. Unless i totally didnt get what you were trying to say

I think magna buff only meant that it looked in very good clean condition. I can tell he's become a wagon addict like me.

Magna wagons are hard to find in good condition because they've usually been runabouts for families with more kids than money.

I know I'm late getting back to this thread but I finally remembered to check the build date on mine. It is 8/91.

regards, Coldamus

magna buff
15-03-2008, 12:08 PM
probably will change my ID to Wagna Buff

ever since owning magna wagons never wanted any thing else


Casper project is still under wraps .""Top secret"". ongoing :badgrin:

red_wagon_tp
15-03-2008, 03:25 PM
i would have to say i love the look of the magna wagon ........ i was asked last week down the coast if it was a import as there was now badge's on the car at all

carcycle
15-03-2008, 04:25 PM
ohhh i see!

No worries, im with it now.

I ended up buying the damaged tp se wagon i mentioned earlier on in this thread... i think? its an 7/91 model hehe!

GT wagons are 11/91.

But yea, youre right about the good condition thing, they are hind to find... but i guess most magnas of 1st gen 'status' on the roads these days are actually getting of a higher standard as all the bad ones have been crushed! Theres still plenty of icky ones around but yeah, im starting to see a lot more old people in ones theyve had from new and things like that...

A couple of days ago i went to move the first gt magna i ever bought and i noticed a big dent in the front left guard... i guess someone has put their leg through teh car yard fence and kicked it? but thats really dissappointing. If anyone who has been to elizabeth u pull it recently is reading this... is that white TP GT still there (the one thats photo'd in my GT thread hehe) and can anyone recall if the left guard on that had the stripes and was ok? teh pic i took of it was from the right unfortunately!!!

And just while im here... may i just say how great i think it is to be able to come on here and look at other ppls magnas and discuss things and sort out problems etc... what a great forum and great people on it :)

I have about 15 damaged magnas that ive bought out of the obsession and im starting to wonder what i should do with them... theyre not really harming anyone sitting where they are... yet, but when they do start to, what do people think i should do with them??

1. scrap them
2. advertise as wrecking and let people buy bits off of them
or
3.????

I also bought a 2002 TJII the other day which needs very minor rear work of which should be happening very soon and also got a KR Verada with mags, tint, spolier, exhaust etc... so yeah... im not just limited to the first gens :P

Alex.

Magna91
15-03-2008, 05:31 PM
I have about 15 damaged magnas that ive bought out of the obsession and im starting to wonder what i should do with them... theyre not really harming anyone sitting where they are... yet, but when they do start to, what do people think i should do with them??

Define "damaged". lol I love the first gens and have been considering getting one at some point. Depends on a number of factors but if the opportunity came up... *ahem* :P May be interested in one depending on if/what parts are missing, body condition, etc.

Aströn Boy
15-03-2008, 06:54 PM
I have about 15 damaged magnas that ive bought out of the obsession and im starting to wonder what i should do with them... theyre not really harming anyone sitting where they are... yet, but when they do start to, what do people think i should do with them??

1. scrap them
2. advertise as wrecking and let people buy bits off of them
or
3.????
Was discussing with my fiance what I am to do with all my cars today.
As it is I have 7 in total, I love cars and everything about them, and I grow attached very quickly.
I know my Magnas will reach there limit, which sucks.
But I will never get rid of them.
As it is, I have stock piles of first gen parts, cause I know 1 day these will become uncommon cars, just like Valiant safaris and the like. As time passes everything becomes harder to get.
Yes the Magna was a common car...... but people do not keep these cars, they find there breaking point, then scrap em.

Currently I'm thinking of replacing my wagon once it is finished with a Legnum, and replacing my sedan with a Mercedes.
Sports wagons and luxury sedans is my world, always has been.

In regards to my Magnas and other cars, I'm currently looking for a storage space, basically a vacant property which will become a garage for all my 'will become' off the road cars. Who knows, might be my future nest egg.

smooth2
16-03-2008, 02:36 AM
[QUOTE=carcycle]ohhh i see!


I have about 15 damaged magnas that ive bought out of the obsession and im starting to wonder what i should do with them...

you could sell me a parts car if the one buffy is looking at for me isn't what i need:D

Beachy
16-03-2008, 08:19 AM
Hey Carcycle, Looks real nice. I just bought my second first Gen a 1990 TP wagon. Apart from some small patches of rust in the lower doors, it is a very sound car. I think it must be an elite or something as it has a two tone paint, blue upper and silver lower, a very plush interior, digital dash, climate control and central locking to name a few of the good points. On the offside, it has rust as I mentioned and it was damaged in the front left guard by another vehicle, which leads me to my question, do you have a spare front left guard in blue or silver, in good nick that you might want to sell? I have tried locally up here in Adelaide hills, but nothing that is worth getting, and this weather has me none to keen to drive down to U pull it on my days off at the moment :cry:
Now we have an 88 TN GLX, a 1990 TP (elite ??) and a 1996 TS SE and they all wagons.
Anyhow, must get to and clean a bit more up before the next scorcher sets in.
Cheers,
Beachy

floater05
17-03-2008, 10:48 AM
I have about 15 damaged magnas that ive bought out of the obsession and im starting to wonder what i should do with them...

im sure you would have no trouble selling parts on this forum or you could sell them as parts cars.

it would be a shame to see all those parts crushed without people having the opportunity to get parts they are after.

Beachy
17-03-2008, 01:17 PM
Hey Carcycle, tried to PM you, but it says your over PM limit :cry:

carcycle
17-03-2008, 06:13 PM
Hey!! yea i guess when i get around to taking bits off them ill let everyone on here know first!

Sorry bout my pm box full, first time thats happened, sorted now. I had a look at your other post and the photos in it... unfortunately no, i dont have any non-going so to speak magnas in that colour. Thats one of my favourite colours that blue. I got a boot off one at u pull it elizabeth so i know there was one there in that colour... whether it still is or not??? And believe it or not i dont have any silver ones either. Sorry, that sound sso useless i have all these wrecking ones and not one the right colour... typical:redface: I know what you mean bout the weather... for those of you who aint in adelaide... today was the last day of the countries longest heat wave of days over 35 degrees!! its hard enough to go out and look what colours my wrecks are let-alone want to go and start huntinga round wreckers for bits... so i totally know where youre coming from!!

As for parts, what do people suggest as the most wanted part of normal tp/tn's? so i can create a stock pile to put on here for you all :P

ALex.

smooth2
18-03-2008, 01:04 AM
so does my question get answered carcycle???:cry:

carcycle
18-03-2008, 08:26 AM
so does my question get answered carcycle???:cry:

Heres a special one just for you :D

hehe

well i could but it might be a bit hard... youre in qld and im in sa!!!

You can feel free to buy one though, not sure what youd do with it... leave it here and just order parts off it when you need em to be sent up! hehe

ANythings possible, but i think it could be a bit to expensive...?

Sorry i didnt reply before :P

magna buff
18-03-2008, 09:37 AM
smooth
nothing back about the TP sedan as yet :nuts:

coldamus
18-03-2008, 06:41 PM
As for parts, what do people suggest as the most wanted part of normal tp/tn's? so i can create a stock pile to put on here for you all :P

ALex.

I'm not sure whether you include Elites and Elantes as "normal" tp/tn's, but let's see:

Elante Mags
TN Elite mags
(I think GT mags are the same except gold instead of silver)
Elite seats
Digital Dash preferably with matching wiring plugs, speed sensor, fuel sender and I think oil pressure sender (not sure about the latter)

I'm not necessarily saying I'd buy any or all of the above at any particular time but they are on my wish list.

I'm sure there'd be plenty of people wanting elante/GT body kit parts - not me though.

Headlights and tail lights are always in demand.
Doors and panels?
I reckon there's quite a market for complete engines as well as auto and manual transmissions. I see lots of 1st gens for sale with good engine and busted auto or with good transmission and cooked motor.
There has to be an opprtunity there!

regards
Coldamus

Magna91
18-03-2008, 06:50 PM
These wrecked first gens, are they wrecked as in they won't start and run or wrecked as in missing bumpers and what not. Sorry to sound like a moron but i'm curious... lol

Could make for an interesting project. I am starting to study automotive as a career choice so it may be handy to have something to work with, something I can't do to the TR as i'm not the only driver and it needs to be out on the road fairly regularly.

Anyway, just curious. :)

smooth2
18-03-2008, 08:14 PM
one of the hardest parts to come by and also one of the most common to break is the rear demister switch for the executives. went on a 7500klm road trip last year . i stopped at every wreckers along the way that stocked magna's and no one had one:nuts:
good nick roof linings are hard to come by as well. also the refective panel between the rear light that has not fallen apart is hard to get.
and straight reo bars for the front and rear bumpers aren't easy to find either. engine mounts that haven't fallen apart (but still good for diy solid mounts).
probably alot more i missed like the boot rusting through were it has been bonded from the factory is common and the seams at the rear outside of the doors (must be the sealer between the door skins of lack there of).
oh and one more the little white plastic part behind the steering wheel to turn off the indicators tend to snap in half making it work only sometimes (couldn't get a rwc without it working cos it turns off indicators automaticlly from the factory)

carcycle
18-03-2008, 08:48 PM
yeah, by normal i mean anything but GT & Elante... theyre sacred to me hehe... well by that i mean the wheels and kits... i have two full sets of elante seats TP.

i have a tp elite, great seats, digi dash, mags, power windows, cruise, climate control and all that jazz which i guess would be pretty popular.

By damaged i mean smashed up. Ive been buying em from wreck auctions... fixed 4 or 5 (nothing too hard) but the ones that are too hard are just bundling up. Theres still a good 3 odd that i wanna fix up yet.

Other problem is i wouldnt want to pull them to bits... as in, do the dirty work :P

i could have a u pull it/pick a part type thing where you bring what you need and take what you need at a predetermined price... presumably cheap!

coz no matter how i look at it, its just plain silly for me to have all these wrecks just hanging around for no real reason... but the good thing is they all have good motors and gbox!

I know what you mean about the demister switch!! just about every 'going' magna i have that has that style switch is broken and all the damaged ones are ok!

I think im going to TRY stop buying dmaaged ones... unless its a special thing... and buy TJ's!! theres a black solara on thurs im interested in... no need to mention that in here tho hey!

In the damaged section i have

2 x TP Elante
1 x TP GT
1 x TP Elite
1 X TN SE
1 X TM Elite
2 X TP Exec
1 X TN Exec

On the 'still to be repaired' side we have...

1 X TP SE Wagon
3 X TP Exec

But please dont start sending me messages wanting this n that now coz like i said i dont want to take bits off.

If youre in adelaide though, if i get interest, you may be able to take some parts soon.

Oh yeah... seeing as this thread is called to special edition i guess i should mention that my... tp special edition went to a new home today!

Also got rid of a cheapie the other day... still got toooooo many

Gosh i dont wanna add up how many others i have now... maybe i should for the heck of it... next time maybe haha

Alex

Magna91
18-03-2008, 10:19 PM
Ahh I see, initially I thought they were cars used for wrecking, but dawned on me about 8 seconds after the post they were physically wrecked. D'oh! lol

carcycle
28-03-2008, 09:13 AM
Just bought two more tp magnas...

not much damage, should be fixed up very soon and into new "special edition" models :P

couple of early pics...

will let everyone know more when i get them here later today :)

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/Item2-2.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/Item-2.jpg


both autos and paid way too much but seeing as theyre easy fix... hopefully ill get them done and make them worth while

carcycle
28-03-2008, 09:15 AM
actually maybe i shouldnt post the damaged pics in future as it degrades them hehe? what do ya think?

They always look a lot yuckier than what they are... although i havent even seem them, just going by the pics! Have to 'see' potential...

or... is it good to see the transformation ?

smooth2
28-03-2008, 09:32 AM
that makes me want to cry:cry: here i need a parts car to keep my magna on the road and do you think i could find any for sale up here noooo but you seem to never have a shortage down there:D
keep up the good work from saving them from the crusher.

floater05
28-03-2008, 02:08 PM
actually maybe i shouldnt post the damaged pics in future as it degrades them hehe? what do ya think?

They always look a lot yuckier than what they are... although i havent even seem them, just going by the pics! Have to 'see' potential...

or... is it good to see the transformation ?

post before and after pics. i find it interesting to see work and effort you put into them:D

carcycle
28-03-2008, 07:58 PM
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2000.jpg
Here They Come!!!

Well, seems as though they arent as nice as i wanted. One, below, has dual fuel, fitted 13 months ago, receipt for $2000 in the glovebox for that which is a bonus.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2001.jpg

I dunno how much effort ill put into them as theyre not beauties... but get em looking nice atleast. Have a new bar put on the one above now and will put the plastic bar over teh top tomorrow... chuck a set of alloys, polish and detail... a few stripes and special edition stickers and she'll be right!

of course i couldnt see the dent in the guard in the auctions pics... looks terrible in that pic, i dont intend on changing that at this stage... depends how i feel, stripes over it might cover it up a bit... i need the good guard i have for the other one which has that part totally wrecked!

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1985.jpg
I was driving this red (abandoned and defected) magna on thursday with a booster pack on the battery and the bonnet come up and smashed the window on me :cry: oh well, bitta fun! no intention of doing anything with it!

Let the fun begin!! again

carcycle
29-03-2008, 02:47 PM
OK i still need to give it a good polish and touch up!!

And also throw some wheels on it, what do you think would suite it best... TP Elite, TN Elite or GT ?

Like i said in the last post, not that great so just still pretty average. just showing what ive been able to finish today is all...

This is the dual fueler.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2010.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2011.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2012.jpg

what do you think of the yellow hehe? stands out... "Hey Look at My Magna!"

Itll look a heck of a lot better after polishing and with the wheels but yea, im tired now, another day :)

Alex.

floater05
29-03-2008, 03:43 PM
i really like the yellow. get the bonnet strips on there and that will finish it off nicely i think

ash
29-03-2008, 10:39 PM
nice! :cool:

Magna91
30-03-2008, 05:32 PM
That duel fuel Magna looks better already from the pics, excellent work as usual. Seems every time you post up a before and after shot the car always ends up looking brand new afterward. :)

Shame about the other one though, otherwise looked like an alright car. Any ideas what will be done with it by chance? Looks like it could almost certainly be repaired with some motivation and elbow grease. :think:

carcycle
11-04-2008, 09:18 AM
Well as you are aware, TP Special Edition One... Has been sold.

TP Special Edition Two is all yellow striped up and i put a set of TP SE wheels on it so it looks quite handsome... still needs a polish... but its raining today so doubt that will be happening just yet.

TP special edition Three is my 107,000km magna. It’s got a GT front bar and rear spoiler and has some Mazda wheels that look TN Elant’e like. It’s finally fixed!! Don’t know how to do the stickers yet maybe an aqua. But it’s looking really good, so if the rain breaks ill do a bit more on that and maybe get some pics.

Anyway, I just bought a TP Elite, damaged in the rear, dunno if that’s easily (pull-out-able) fixable yet, wait and see when it gets here later on.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/1-1.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/2-1.jpg

Still that majorly smashed up one to come and another plain white one... don’t really want them though.

Alex.

carcycle
12-04-2008, 01:15 PM
Well the TP elit isnt that great, dunno what ill do with it yet... luckily i have one just the same with front damage so if i need to cahnge anything i have the match.

Anyway, im about to put up another bundle of photos.

TP Special Edition Three Is finished! well apart from the stripes (which im not sure about yet... ill hold a vote, stripes or not!!??)

So yeah, this one is the 107km one. Start off with the before photos... which were taken in November last year! Cant believe its been here for so long doing nothing!

It did have a lot of mechanical work needed though... like strut, cv/shaft, wishbone thing, steering rack etc were all damaged!

BEFORE

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1361.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1362.jpg

DURING
Here its got the guard and doors replaced...

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_1433.jpg

Nearly there... A couple of days ago

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2153.jpg

carcycle
12-04-2008, 01:18 PM
AFTER

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2154.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2155.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2156.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2157.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2160.jpg

Please take special note of the Elant'e added plastic bit on the bit that goes between the windows on the rear door and the back window... whatever the heck theyre for i dont know but thought id add them, looks a bit different, if you notice it hehe.

Shes got 205 tyres atm so its sits up a bit and looks tough! But they do rub every now and again, more than they should.

So, stripes or no stripes!?!

Alex.

magna buff
12-04-2008, 01:38 PM
you sure are edit: restoring a lot of first gens

stripes yes

magna people would be happy with them in as original condition as possible

doesnt matter about the KMs

intresting mags are they a pepperpot clone ?

carcycle
12-04-2008, 02:13 PM
Im not sure if "rebirthing" is the right word, that sounds like something illegal!!

Just so everyone is clear... they are not stolen, nor even written off cars, and ill im doing is tidying them/fixing them up :D But yeah, i enjoy nice magna's... ive gotta try and stop buying them though, theres too many!!

Unfortunately kilo's do matter... people are so unrealistic sometimes, the other day someone rang up about a $1200 magna advertised and once they were told it had 240k's the said thats to many and hung up... I know, and yes youre completely right, they DO NOT matter in realism... if its still around the place it must be reasonable and if its done a lot of kilomteres and looked after it can often be better than a lower km one... which are probably wound back.. high kms are atleast honest!!

But, when youve got one with low kms, youve gotta say it :P hehe.

Sorry, i totally contradicted myself there... final answer, they dont matter!! Its just people out there are so stupid!
(when trying to sell something)

They do look a bit like those wheels, i tried putting them on my GSR sigma but they wouldnt fit... grr! It needs a set! These wheels are off a mazda 626 i think, so nah theyre not a copy of them, just similar.

I have a set of white side skirts but dunno if i should put em on? Maybe one day when ive got nothing else at all to do!

carcycle
13-04-2008, 10:14 PM
cmon people wheres all my feedback haha!!

Thanks magnabuff. I consider you a bit of an expert on these so i appreciate your input :)

This car and wheels combo etc is really growing on me and i reckon it looks fantastic! it looks better in real life than in pics.

im really proud of this one.


This is the yellow colour stripe combo... special edition number two, (it still hasnt been properly cleaned or polished/touched up yet!!)
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b313/ahsilvershadow/IMG_2188.jpg

still havent chosen a colour or decided if im gonna put some on yet.