Hey all,

As of late, I've been recording my fuel consumption levels. Sometimes putting in small amounts of fuel, sometimes putting in larger amounts. What i've noticed is, I'm getting very low km's compared to other 2nd gens to the amount of litres i'm putting in. the list is as follows:

29L- 240km
35L- 255km
11L- 82km
10L- 75km
50L- 384km
15L- 115km
11L- 68km
55L- 404km
29L- 160km

much of this has been driving in the suburbs, sometimes with traffic in the morning on the way to uni. Any clues as to what I can do to ease the pain?

My car DOES have yet another timing chain rattle, which I have a feeling plays a part in this. I don't think, however, that it's the only reason.

And no, I havn't been lead-footing it everywhere.

Thanks,

-Ian

Those figures are pretty much similar for my tr and i also have a slight timing chain rattle. I know that mine is coming up for service but i've just accepted that tr's were never good with fuel economy

Those figures are pretty much similar for my tr and i also have a slight timing chain rattle. I know that mine is coming up for service but i've just accepted that tr's were never good with fuel economy

I expected it to be a bit of a drinker, but never thought it'd be this bad. I mean, I couldnt get 450 km's on the freeway!!!!! I went to hoppers crossing in my car once and used half a tank of fuel to get there.

I expected it to be a bit of a drinker, but never thought it'd be this bad. I mean, I couldnt get 450 km's on the freeway!!!!! I went to hoppers crossing in my car once and used half a tank of fuel to get there.

adjust the chains for starters, that may help. theres a tensioner u can play with on the timing cover. need more detail jst ask. try injector clean to begin with, thinner oil, might have to look at exhaust or intake to let her breathe easier. done any mods?

adjust the chains for starters, that may help. theres a tensioner u can play with on the timing cover. need more detail jst ask. try injector clean to begin with, thinner oil, might have to look at exhaust or intake to let her breathe easier. done any mods?

I've got a pod and just a muffler (which doesnt do anything i dont think) About 5000km's ago, the car was sent in to get the timing chain kit replaced-me thinks the mech did a dodgy job, so it's going back there on monday. Hopefully this'll help it a bit. I'll try the injector cleaner etc. I'm struggling for ideas!

How's the temp sitting? If it doesn't sit on halfway after a couple of minutes, thermostat could be gone (cheap to replace), which would chew the fuel more.

From my understanding, if you are doing lots of small trips with the engine not warmed up, this could have a similar effect. Don't know if letting it run for a while first before setting off would provide any benefit, as it still uses up fuel sitting there, but it's not under load, so perhaps it might prove beneficial. Don't quote me on that though.

You seem to be getting around the 7-8km's / litre range, which is a bit on the poor side; should probably be getting at least 8-9km's / litre for that sort of driving.

How's the temp sitting? If it doesn't sit on halfway after a couple of minutes, thermostat could be gone (cheap to replace), which would chew the fuel more

The thermostat was replaced mid 06 when the head cracked due to over-heating. It could be that, i'll check it out, although temp is reached after about 3 minutes of driving and about 7-8 of idling.

I've heard that idling the car to warm it up actually causes damage? something about the movement aiding with lubrication. i don't know, read this somewhere on here.

Thanks for the ideas, keep them coming, i've been racking my brain to figure this out

-Ian

If fuel economy is what worries you then I'd recommend something with an engine size around half of what your TR has :nuts:

29L- 240km 12.0L/100kms
35L- 255km 13.7L/100kms
11L- 82km 13.4L/100kms
10L- 75km 13.3L/100kms
50L- 384km 13.0L/100kms
15L- 115km 13.0L/100kms
11L- 68km 16.1L/100kms
55L- 404km 13.6L/100kms
29L- 160km 18.1L/100kms

much of this has been driving in the suburbs, sometimes with traffic in the morning on the way to uni.

TOTAL AVERAGE: 14.02L/100kms

I wouldnt say anything is wrong?? my grandad has a 2.6 Astron TS and he gets no better... and he drives very slowly.. its also no better on a long run on the open highway..

its a known fact that those 4cyl engines werent the most frugal engines ever made.. 14L/100kms i think is normal for suburban driving with traffic..


Any clues as to what I can do to ease the pain?

Convert to gas?

Thats only a little bit more than my car. Im thinking of trying to replace the O2 sensors, im thinking they might just be getting old and worn out and hoping new ones will improve economy a bit.

Also, I plan to start researching and ringing around about a gas conversion :confused:

Ollie

Have you considered replacing the pod with the standard intake again?

Have you considered replacing the pod with the standard intake again?

+1 for removing the pod. im gettin 11L per 100k city driving on average so your drinking a fair bit. i took my pod off and noticed a diffrence in power and economy. nothing major but it was a difference.

what weight oil are u running? 15w-40 is recommended afaik.

+1 for removing the pod. im gettin 11L per 100k city driving on average so your drinking a fair bit. i took my pod off and noticed a diffrence in power and economy. nothing major but it was a difference.

what weight oil are u running? 15w-40 is recommended afaik.

i'm using 20W-50 because of the chain rattle. probably a bit thick, but it's to prolong the chain snapping again...

I'll try remove the pod and see how it goes, but for now, things look grim.

my V6 TS is even worse, average 300km per tank, and thats with granny-style driving, very slow acceleration, no lead foot at all.
I just finished a major service, new air/oil filter, new drive shaft, new brake pads, new belts, new spark plugs, and its exactly the same as before!! 300km per tank.:doubt:

so I went back to my mechanic and he told me could be the fuel injectors, and would cost me around 300 to clean all 6 of them. he actually adviced against it, told me not to spend anymore money on the car besides regular service, and said "all magnas have **** fuel economy, go buy a camry instead":bowrofl:

just yesterday I ordered a new O2 sensor and will replace it ASAP see how thats gonna change things as my car has done over 225,000km.

my V6 TS is even worse, average 300km per tank, and thats with granny-style driving, very slow acceleration, no lead foot at all.
I just finished a major service, new air/oil filter, new drive shaft, new brake pads, new belts, new spark plugs, and its exactly the same as before!! 300km per tank.:doubt:

so I went back to my mechanic and he told me could be the fuel injectors, and would cost me around 300 to clean all 6 of them. he actually adviced against it, told me not to spend anymore money on the car besides regular service, and said "all magnas have **** fuel economy, go buy a camry instead":bowrofl:

just yesterday I ordered a new O2 sensor and will replace it ASAP see how thats gonna change things as my car has done over 225,000km.

tell him he's a ****ing idiot
I would do that whole resetting the ECU thingy...disconnect the battery for well, i just leave it off for a few hours, reconnect it then go for a nice slow drive.
my fuel economy went up 2.5L/100k by doing that :)

my cars done 225K aswell, carrying lots of sound deadning, amps, subs, wheels, spoiler, my fat ass, leather, AND its auto, and im getting a pretty good 10.2L/100'ks out of it just normal driving mix of city and highway.

pretty damn good if you ask me :D

how the hell did you get such good fuel economy with a spoiler and 19" wheels AND auto??!!:shock:

just yesterday I ordered a new O2 sensor and will replace it ASAP see how thats gonna change things as my car has done over 225,000km.

Pleeeeeease let me know how this goes, its on my to do list to try the same thing. Hoping it might make economy a bit better. Here is hoping :cool:

Ollie

i get basically the same economy no matter what conditions i drive (country vs city) always around the 550 for a tank, running a 4cyl auto when i fill up usually takes bout 56/7 litres, as far as i know its a standard wagon that had the computer replaced bout twenty thousand kms ago in an attempt to fix the "shudder" (previous owner obviously wasnt a member)

so I went back to my mechanic and he told me could be the fuel injectors, and would cost me around 300 to clean all 6 of them. he actually adviced against it, told me not to spend anymore money on the car besides regular service, and said "all magnas have **** fuel economy, go buy a camry instead":bowrofl:

just yesterday I ordered a new O2 sensor and will replace it ASAP see how thats gonna change things as my car has done over 225,000km.

probably 225000k's and the injectors have never been cleaned.

Start maintaining your fuel system.

Ps 450k's off 50L and not much highway and alot of DOHC opening up. Happy with 10.9L/100, could easy take that under 10 as it's hot in brisbane and i like driving.

Pleeeeeease let me know how this goes, its on my to do list to try the same thing. Hoping it might make economy a bit better. Here is hoping :cool:

Ollie
replaced my O2 sensor today, took me 15 mins. will let you know the result :)
one thing i'v noticed is that my car runs a lot better now after the O2 sensor is replaced, no hesitation during 1st and 2nd gear.

Oh wow thats awesome, I was just thinkign about this the other day. did you replace both of them? (I think there are two???). Keenly waiting on the results, though since you have noticed an improvement already its a good sign.

Ollie

I've owned and maintained a four and six cylinder TS Magna. They are VERY sensitive to dirty air filters, our cars got new ones at every oil change (10k).
They are also at an age where a new O2 sensor will benefit greatly, we picked up 1.5l/100km on our four banger with just the O2 sensor.
The Astron will also tolerate some more ignition advance when stock, you can wind it on about another 4 degrees advanced and not run into ping, even on the worst days, on regular fuel. This will help low end torque a bit, and improve mileage. The six may ping with 5 degrees extra advance, but it'll be very light pinging, and only under alot of load on a hot day*
A new cam chain will also help a lot if yours is stretched, it retards cam timing as it stretches, it is quite a long chain.
Both these engines alst responded very well to long term use (a bottle every few months) of Nulon fuel system cleaner, picking up some mileage and power, plus smoother running

Regards, Andrew.

*timing may not suit your engine if it's totally shagged or has lots of carbon, however, both my engines were past 230k kms.....

Thanks, though wont help me much though coz I have a V6 with a pretty much brand new K&N panel filter. Also use a bottle of Nulon total fuel system cleaner at least every oil change which is every 5000km.

But hopefully O2 sensor is worthwhile, even at 175,000km

Ollie

I've owned and maintained a four and six cylinder TS Magna. They are VERY sensitive to dirty air filters, our cars got new ones at every oil change (10k).

I just fixed all my problems with a new air filter, perfect 800rpm idle again, no rich mixtures... so I can vouch for this. Then again, my old filter had been in there for about 4 years... lol

sorry to seem like a complete car moron but i am hahaha
are there o2 sensors in the 2.6L astrons and is it an easy home job that i could do if given some basic instructions? I'm on about 18-19L per 100kms at the moment and hoping if i change the o2 sensor(if i have one) and the air filter it'll bring it down bit. Also, what does that ecu reset thing that paula was talkin about do? Should i consider doing this too?Otherwise my carburetor is dead/dying hahaha,

cheers

~twiggy~

yep they have O2 sensors too. Economy sounds very high. Might wanna try some fuel system cleaner too, and the air filter like you said is a good idea. Then see how that goes.

Ollie

ok cheers, any tips/help as to where to buy an 02 sensor, if there's diff kinds what type and how i go about changing it? :p
cheers, will see how that all goes

~twiggy~

Apparently there are some on ebay, quite cheap, well compared to OEM parts anyway (around $30-40 from memory). Apparently they are also all the time, any O2 sensor will give the same output, and probably have the same mount, so I think any should do.

Ollie

just did a search and apparently on ebay i can get a genuine one with the wiring loom for 120 odd bucks or a universal one which does the same but i need to solder the wires on myself(same coloured wires as the genuine one though) for 50-60 delivered so yeh, might give that a go. Any idea where i can get some of that fuel cleaner? just a local auto shop like supercheap or autobahn?
cheers for all the help and sorry for hijacking the thread :p

~twiggy~

Anyone like supercheap or the like will have them. I like to use Nulon Total Fuel System Cleaner. Its about $20 though, but for less than $10 you can get Nulon Injector cleaner, if you dont want to spend too much.

Ollie

just had a talk to my dad about replacing the o2 sensor and he seems to think that the 2.6L carburetors don't have fuel sensors. Since they don't have e.f.i i would assume he's correct since the o2 sensor would have no electrics to adjust?
just checking, had a quick glance under my car and couldn't find anything that looked like the o2 sensor.
cheers

~twiggy~

I forgot that there were both carby and efi versions. I think your right, the carby would not have O2 sensors from the way it works.

Ollie

hahaha bugger
might just try replace the air filter and use that fuel cleany stuff
cheers for all the help folks

~twiggy~

Thanks, though wont help me much though coz I have a V6 with a pretty much brand new K&N panel filter. Also use a bottle of Nulon total fuel system cleaner at least every oil change which is every 5000km.

But hopefully O2 sensor is worthwhile, even at 175,000km

Ollie

O2 sensor is always worthwhile on any car with over 80k kms.......most service manuals for all early EFI cars I see recommend replacing O2 sensors around 100k kms. They live in a harsh environment. My Supra recommended 80k kms.
Your K&N filter could cause issues if over oiled (restrict air flow).

Regards, Andrew.

Wow really, had no idea O2 sensors were actually kinda considered consumables and were recommended to be changed every now and again. If I knew that I probably would have already done it. Think I will have to get around to doing it soon.

K&N is new so hasnt been cleaned/oiled, dont really know the process, but have never been looking forward to it. If its not right it eithers restricts flow or doesnt trap dirt :doubt:

Ollie

a good way step to take when cleaning and oiling your K&N is to once its done and oil (more is better than none but dont drown it) it to go for a drive, once you have followed the steps on ho wto clean it. Then return home and take out the AFM (easy) and spray the hot-wire with CO Contact Cleaner, no residue and the oxidising effect cleans residues off. Then about a week later do the same thing, this ensures that the K&N is adequately oils for filtration and that the oil mist injested by the engine (after oiling) isnt effecting the MAF sensor causing fuelling issues.

As for O2 sensors, the leaner the fuel mixture the longer they last, as they very slowly corrode, but the signals gets affected more by unburnt fuel (or carbon build) then from extreme heat (running lean) having said that you wouldnt want to be much leaner then 13.0:1 at full throttle with a 6g72, due to the high compression nature of the motor and the factory ignition advance.

I was always told a good time to change the O2 sensor was when you did a timing belt.

My 94 ts wagon reco 2.6 5spd with around 8000ks holds 71 litters I drove it until it stoped around city and in heavy traffic for 3 days and got 716ks out of it iam still blown away even my 2000 3.5 ts is only getting 660 I have had a lot of magnas and I know no one will beleve this but 100% true

I know no one will beleve this but 100% trueIt's not all that unbelievable, I try to aim for 10k's / litre, if I get that I'm happy, 716k's off say 70 odd litres (doubt you could ever utilise the entire 71litres) is well within the realms of possibility.
With freeway driving I used to get at least 550k's off 45litres, now i might be getting 480-500, think my dizzy and wiring are getting a bit too old for one thing. I probably should also do the O2 sensor one day...

my facts and figures (AVG) for the last 20 tanks of petrol

i fill up and record how many litres i put in, and use the same fuel each time from the same servo even. I then note my KMS and how many litres i put back in.

my average fill was 51.2L and my average kms were 412kms

i had a peak of 454kms with a refill of 53.3L and my smallest fill was 48.7L which i netted 381kms

normal speak, i am averaging ~8.05kms/L or 12.45L/100km in the new money

I am going to run 10 tanks with each change i make, using the same guide lines. the driving is roughly the same week in week out, i work the same hours, do the same things very regularly. If something changes i will record the kms/L but wont add it to my data (ie a trip to the coast and back 140km highway roundtrip)

Just running the last 2 tanks with an oil change and a timing check (it was retarded 4degrees from stock) my average is 438.5 for 50.8L (8.65km/L or 11.56L/100km) but thats not very conclusive.

My next round of things, is fuel additives of varying type, including the cost addition per tank due to the price of the additives.

at the amount of driving i do 10 tanks will take roughly 6weeks

Ill keep you posted.

at the amount of driving i do 10 tanks will take roughly 6weeks

Ill keep you posted.


and 3 months pay lol


ive been gettin 11L per 100km on average recently. has been re-ringed so theres a bit of tension there but shes moving along nicely. never been on the highway long enough to record it so dont have any figures for that.
my best city driving figures are 512km off 54L. pretty good for city driving imo.

Where is the O2 sensor on a V6 92 Verada? I have tried looking for mine but with no luck. A pic would be great if possible.

Where is the O2 sensor on a V6 92 Verada? I have tried looking for mine but with no luck. A pic would be great if possible.
Get your head under the car, Look at the cat converter, just in front

That's probably why I couldn't see it, I tried looking under the car but there was was not enough room to get a good look as the car's a tad low lol. Thanks for that at least I know where to look now

That's probably why I couldn't see it, I tried looking under the car but there was was not enough room to get a good look as the car's a tad low lol. Thanks for that at least I know where to look now
All good :)