Just got some suspension work done, which involved:

1. King lows rear, and king superlow fronts

2. KYB shocks all round

3. rear swaybar, camber bolts and alignment and wheel balancing.

Car drives quite well, and suprisingly comfortable, however I think this might be part of the proble. At first, if cornering moderately hard, the front seems to reach the end of the suspension travel, and then any tiny bumps on the road come crashing through the car. I have noticed soemtimes even when going straight over bump or dips it does the same thing.

Has anyone here on superlow fronts had this problem??????

Im thinking, surely it cant be normal with this setup, and that maybe they used cylinder springs at front which are too soft (explaining the comfort)??

Or maybe something to do with the bumpstops not working or being there at all???

Any ideas or experiences would be great.

Cheers,

Ollie

are you sure it's not just the hardness of the superlows. My mates got superlows on his VR and every single bit of comfort he had went out the window, though his car sits alot flatter than it did before around corners.

I had lovell super lows on my car when i first got it. Didn't like them at all. Bottoming out all the time, scraping the front underside all the time, unable to park properly. The standard shocks wouldn't have helped either. The bumpstops on the front were pretty much non existant when i took them out.

Changed it to king lows all round with new shocks. So much better.

I got stage 2 sports ryders in the front and stage1 in the back, but the fronts are sitting on the bumpstops. so for me its normal to feel the bumps, so in this case its normal

mike

Cool, though like I said, its actually very comfortable suspension, its only when you hit tiny bump when cornering or large on a straight. It not like you feel the bumps really even then, it just makes a really loud crashing noise, doesnt sound to healthy.

I think I might need to investigate bump stops. Do the springs etc have to be taken out to replace them? Or can they just be popped in?

Ollie

same thing happened to my TS, changed the fronts to lows and problem sloved

yea, lol spose its looks or comfort eh...had that same prob, if turning a sharp'ish corner and theres a dip or bump you get a sharp bang of the shock bottoming...

I would suggest it is the superlows at the front causing the problem.
I have Lovell lows all round and it is a very comfortable ride and great on corners and doesn't bottom out at all

although if you had the work done by a suspension place they would have inspected the LCA bushes, if they didnt and these are shagged they are a good source or noise. These fail pretty quickly aswell when they are umpteenhundred thousand kms old and you suddently go to uprated shocks and springs.

Another palce for noise i noticed, is, on my stock springs there were rubbers aroiund the lower coils of the spring (i assume the ones most likely to make contact with each other) the kings SL i brought obviously didnt come with them, and i only had them on one side (my stocko's were rooted)

Lastly something that not many people notice,and a lot of places dont go to the effect of, is replacing the rubber gasket like thing that sits on the strut top-hat, between the hat and the strut tower mounting point. This item is to reduce vibration from the road and suspension transmitting to the car. Although i had super lows on the front, i didnt experience the problems you are experiencing, but i noticed a difference in my road noise by going to the effort of replcing these little rubber things.

The only time i get any noise/ vibration through my wheel is when im chuffing a wheel or 2.

Oh i forgot to mention, when you upgrade to stiffer springs the brake pedal also likes to bounce up and down and you wouldnt beleive how much it sounds like a LCA bush thats given way. So if you find a section of road that you consistantly hit and it makes the noise, go over it again, but with your left foot under the brake pedal holding it up. It really does sound like something in the wheel bay is loose.

Good luck

pics or ban:D

pics or ban who/what?

yea, spose its looks or comfort eh...had that same prob, if turning a sharp'ish corner and theres a dip or bump you get a sharp bang of the shock bottoming...

Thanks adam, thats what I wanted to hear, although now I so like the look of the superlows I dont know if i want to change to lows. How much difference in height did the change to normal lows make?

I think bumpstops might be able to fix that banging noise, however you dont really want the car sitting on the bumpstops when cornering, and it will mean the ride isnt as comfortable as there will be none or little travel before it begins to hit the bumpstop.



Another palce for noise i noticed, is, on my stock springs there were rubbers aroiund the lower coils of the spring (i assume the ones most likely to make contact with each other) the kings SL i brought obviously didnt come with them, and i only had them on one side (my stocko's were rooted)

Lastly something that not many people notice,and a lot of places dont go to the effect of, is replacing the rubber gasket like thing that sits on the strut top-hat, between the hat and the strut tower mounting point. This item is to reduce vibration from the road and suspension transmitting to the car. Although i had super lows on the front, i didnt experience the problems you are experiencing, but i noticed a difference in my road noise by going to the effort of replcing these little rubber things.

Oh i forgot to mention, when you upgrade to stiffer springs the brake pedal also likes to bounce up and down and you wouldnt beleive how much it sounds like a LCA bush thats given way. So if you find a section of road that you consistantly hit and it makes the noise, go over it again, but with your left foot under the brake pedal holding it up. It really does sound like something in the wheel bay is loose.


Thanks for the info, I was actually trying to find out the source of noise, as my suspension was making a kinda clunky noise before, and I told them to fix anything that might be making noises. not sure if the did anything specific, however all those noises are gone now.

The noise i am talking about now however, is definitely not a brake pedal bouncing, im talking a cringing 'that cant be healthy did that stuff up my wheel alignment' kinda very loud noise.



pics or ban


http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4654.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4655.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4657.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4659.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4660.jpg

Ollie

hi ive just ordered springs. lows for raer and supers for front. is it werth getting supers or should i change to lows all round.

I have a rada. so thats great to see how good they look..

Cheers Dean

hi ive just ordered springs. lows for raer and supers for front. is it werth getting supers or should i change to lows all round.

Your car will resemble a door wedge once they are in.
I would recommend getting the rears compressed to suit the front. no wheel arch gap AT ALL it looks HOT man.
With decent shocks it handles very well for an old car too.

hellll yeah, thats looking sweeeeet, cant wait to get my springs now, you cant really tell the difference in the height between the front and back.

']Your car will resemble a door wedge once they are in.
I would recommend getting the rears compressed to suit the front. no wheel arch gap AT ALL it looks HOT man.
With decent shocks it handles very well for an old car too.

the truble is i cant dump the rear any lower coz i wont get up the driver way as the rear bar will scrape.

In the second gen sedans, the best set up is the King Low fronts, King Low third gen springs rear (these have a better spring rate) , Koni adjustable dampers.

The KYB are a great unit but are way over gassed. This results in the damper recoiling way too fast and then the car will be off balance.

Superlow's are not for Magnas, you will have about an inch of suspension travel, look awsome but very dangerous if you intend to drive more than walking pace.

For the vic members who remember my rada, mm04 black spur, it handled like it was on rails.

the trouble is i cant dump the rear any lower cause' i wont get up the drive way as the rear bar will scrape.
I never scrape anything EVER.
My car sits lower then my mates EL falcon yet his still scrapes many driveways.
Never touched the rear bar..
Actually only touched the front bar once :)

Mine was generally ok, I left the towbar on with no tongue so if it scraped it had a scuff plate lol

Adelaide driveway scraped, then again, a hummer would have scraped there

In the second gen sedans, the best set up is the King Low fronts, King Low third gen springs rear (these have a better spring rate) , Koni adjustable dampers.


Agreed, I run Lows in front, with koni damper adjustables and they ROCK, I love them, will forever get them from now on.

NEVER bottom out, takes a thrashing and can corner hard as hell, so much it will throw me out of my seat pretty much.

But you already know this Ollie:P Koni Adjustables FTW

Agreed, I run Lows in front, with koni damper adjustables and they ROCK, I love them, will forever get them from now on.

NEVER bottom out, takes a thrashing and can corner hard as hell, so much it will throw me out of my seat pretty much.

But you already know this Ollie:P Koni Adjustables FTW

Wtf they make these for 2nd gens? Where did you get them from? and how much!!

Got them through pedders. 0% interest repayment plan :D I think I got all 4 adjustables plus bushes, camber kit and alignment for like 1200 all up? I freaking LOVE them, magna bouncin all over the road like its got coil-overs :bowrofl: Talk about go-kart? Wait till you rip around a corner with adjustables with 235 wide rubber = hold teh **** on:cool:

No doubt the koni's are VERY good, I did want to get them, but they were a fair bit more than the still pretty good (way better than anything like stock or monroe) KYB's, and with all the other work being done I was already stretching the budget.

Bit hard to say wether I would advise lows over superlows at the front because I dont know the ride height with lows, though looking at some pics of 86_Elite's car, it seems almost the same height. And with the issues im having bottoming out, it happens way to easily at the moment and something has to be done wether its bump stops or new springs, so I guess its probably best to avoid superlows unless you really want the looks and dont mind the bottoming out on big bumps or cornering hard.

I think the suspension guy actually tried lows in first, but then put superlows in for it to sit even, so im still a bit worried it will look crap with lows.

Would still like to know if bump stops can be fitted easily without taking apart the suspension???

86_elite, dunno if its the springs or shocks or both, but although the car is pretty firm, my car doesnt feel like go kart at all, im really impressed with the comfort, you feel the bumps a tad more and sometimes the short sharp road joins and things thump a bit more, but due to the better control over bigger bumps it actually feels better as it not wallowing around.

Ollie

Ollie

Got them through pedders. 0% interest repayment plan :D I think I got all 4 adjustables plus bushes, camber kit and alignment for like 1200 all up? I freaking LOVE them, magna bouncin all over the road like its got coil-overs :bowrofl: Talk about go-kart? Wait till you rip around a corner with adjustables with 235 wide rubber = hold teh **** on:cool:

Camber kit? im guessing for the front as the rear is a beam axle yes?

I think the suspension guy actually tried lows in first, but then put superlows in for it to sit even, so im still a bit worried it will look crap with lows.

Does this mean that when I get my springs done that to get the car level I'll need superlows on front and lows on back as well, or is Ollie's a one of case? I've asked this before and had differing answers. Some said lows all round would level it and others said superlows at front will level it. :confused:

Which one is it?

Does this mean that when I get my springs done that to get the car level I'll need superlows on front and lows on back as well, or is Ollie's a one of case? I've asked this before and had differing answers. Some said lows all round would level it and others said superlows at front will level it. :confused:

Which one is it?
+1 i need to know this as well, i dont want a car that looks like its in doggystyle position.

with just lows all round look od or does super/low combo look better.

My car might be different because its a wagon, although I would think that any differences would be in the back not the front. I will ring my suspension guy soon, and ask him some q's about the lows, what they looked like, coz I think he tried them, and will let you know.

Camber bolts are for the front yes, they said they were needed to get the camber they wanted at that ride height.

Ollie

Would still like to know if bump stops can be fitted easily without taking apart the suspension???
The strut has to be removed from the vehicle, the springs compressed and nut removed to release the insulator and seal, then you can slide the old bump stop out.
Assembly is the reverse and follow it up with a wheel alignment, not a hard job but compressing the springs can be dangerous if it lets go

I am running lows in the front and lovells in the rear which have been slightly compressed to give it an even look.

The camber bolts are for the front to bring the tyres under the arch cuz of the 235 rubber.

Good luck on sorting out the shocks Ollie. Like I said before, I think with the super low springs, the KYB arnt strong enough to support the lowered hight? If that makes sence? Which is why I ran with the Koni's for support.

I am running lows in the front and lovells in the rear which have been slightly compressed to give it an even look.

So did your back end sit up higher than the front end? 'Cos mine's completely the opposite. :confused:

Superlows front lows rear in a SEDAN Will make it look like a door wedge.

well ive changed the order to lows all round. itll be dropped 38mm all round.

']Superlows front lows rear in a SEDAN Will make it look like a door wedge.

Thanks for that mate. Anyone know what will happen to a wagon with a super/lows combo rather than a lows/lows combo?

No my car sits flat. Thats what I said, I had lows in the front and the lovells in the rear compressed to make her sit flat.:cool:

Sorry, didn't know yours was a wagon, thanks for the advice.

No, 86_Elite's car is a sedan NOT wagon.

Mine is a wagon with superlow front and low rear, so check out the pics to see how it sits. Looks good, but if it will look almost as good with lows, I would go with that. Unfortunately I dont know, though hopefully my suspension guy can shed some more info next week.

Ollie

superlows are roughly 10mm lower compared to lows.

']Superlows front lows rear in a SEDAN Will make it look like a door wedge.

This is true. Mine had lovell superlows in the front with lows in the back. It was wedge city.

No, 86_Elite's car is a sedan NOT wagon.

Mine is a wagon with superlow front and low rear, so check out the pics to see how it sits. Looks good, but if it will look almost as good with lows, I would go with that. Unfortunately I dont know, though hopefully my suspension guy can shed some more info next week.

Ollie

That's what I thought, I keep getting confused.

Anyways, I do like the way that yours sits and if it's only 10mm higher with lows then I'll probably just get lows all round. Still, I am keen to hear what your suspension guy has to say.

Thank you everyone for your help.

I'm getting custom springs made up by our local pedders suspension place, they cost about $50 more then lows and they make the car sit where you want, im gonna make it so the tires are just tucking, should have it done by this friday:D

I'm getting custom springs made up by our local pedders suspension place, they cost about $50 more then lows and they the car sit where you want, im gonna make it so the tires are just tucking, should have it done by this friday:D

Nice!
Will be good to see another dumped 2nd gen!

Hopefully mine will be done on Saturday, just waiting on a cousin of a friend of mine to tell me he's gonna be free to help me out. Can't wait to get it done!!!!

OK sorry for the delay guys, but after some calls it was decided I should bring my car back in and go for a test drive. He drove, and after the first knock sound was like :shock: :redface: thats terrible. He apologized and said that he always test them after work is done, but as he told me, he had soem broken ribs at the time and couldnt drive and to bring it back if for a test drive if I wanted to.

He said he was definitely not happy with the car, and after a quick check on the ramps, said he wasnt sure what the problem was, and to book it in for them too look at. So last monday it went back...

It was quite interesting, he said that the problem was that the strut that goes up into a cone shaped top was hitting against each other before hitting the bump stops or bottoming out, and had not seen that before. So they wacked some different bump stops (not sure if they were new or different types or both), but they also said that because of the new bumpstops, with the superlow springs and after it had settled a bit there was just no suspension travel. So they chucked some 'lows' springs in and re-did the alignment.

They spent a good half day on the car, replaced the springs that were ordered on urgent courier, put new bumpstops in and re-did the wheel alignment. Now I thought it might be costly, and wasnt too happy coz we did actually on agree on 'lows' at the start, but was hopign they might just charge me for the bumpstops and a little bit of labour. However after telling me all they did and how much better the car is now, and that he was so glad I took it back because it is so much improved now he gave me the keys and drove away paying NOTHING.

True testimony to Wheels World that they genuinely are interested in doing a good job and makign the customer happy, without making you bankrupt. And very friendly and helpful too.

So yeh it doesnt quite look as awesome as it did before, but it drives GREAT! Infinitely better road holding, sits much flatter and amazingly neutral handling, where before it was immediate pig understeer no matter what you did.

Also another thing, not sure if I mentioned it, but after getting the car back the first time, I had a bad shudder when accelerating. I thought it might be engine mounts or CV's or something, but wasnt sure so just mentioned it to them when I took it back, which they noticed also. Since putting the lows in, they said that with superlows the CV's are at an angle causing the shudder, and now they sit flat hence no nasty shudder.

So I really have to say, that unless you huge priority is only cosmetic, and are prepared to put up with a shudder, very poor comfort and im sure worse handling, then you will get a small improvement in looks. No way would I go back to superlows now. Will take some pics now it has settled if people are interested to see the comparison with lows and superlows.

Olliw

Fantastic post mate, and congrats on the good news. Any chance of getting some pics? Mine should be getting done this weekend as well as rear muffler.

Good to hear it is fixed.
Are you sure that they simply did not just put in the top plate in the wrong way round and it was hitting the inner strut tower, have seen this lots of times lol

As I said before, inless you are going to get custom struts made, you can not safely use super lows in a magna, too much engineering with control arms, strut length etc

Good to hear it is all well again now

Are you sure that they simply did not just put in the top plate in the wrong way round and it was hitting the inner strut tower, have seen this lots of times


You know it kinda sounds like it could have happened, I thought it was quite strange. However im confident these guys are quite good (from what ive heard and all the porshes that are there) and though I could understand they might stuff up, im sure the 2nd time round they would realise and fix it. I dont really know what the top hat is or looks like though I remember him mentioning it to me when we went for a test drive.

Oh by the way just realised I took a few pics of my car when I put the momo wheel in, not the best for now.... Ohh and also some pre-lowering pics for comparison.

Ollie

Pre-lowering

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/verada2_compressed.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_0084_small.jpg

With Super lows fronts, low rears,

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4659.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4654.jpg


With lows all round

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a365/opilot87/IMG_4672.jpg

Needs a side on view to get a better comparison.
But your car looks hot man.
I get that annoying shudder too you talk about.
But if my car was any higher it'd look more ridiculous then it already is..
My recommendation - get a rear swaybar... :cool:

']Needs a side on view to get a better comparison.
But your car looks hot man.
I get that annoying shudder too you talk about.
But if my car was any higher it'd look more ridiculous then it already is..
My recommendation - get a rear swaybar... :cool:

Cheers mate. Yeh its not the best pic but only pic ive got at the moment but will get a side-on and some other pics when its daylight another time.

It's just the design of the magna I suppposed, the gap in the wheel arch doesnt close until there is basically no travel. Now, although my side sills are even, there is a bigger gap in the wheel arch at the front then back.

Ohh, and you have already recommended me a rear swaybar which I have replied, and will reply again, I already got one fitted at the same time as the springs and shocks! Cant give a proper verdict as I did all the other stuff at the same time, but the car does handle infinitely better now, I think that may have been a big contributor to sorting out the understeer. Might keep my eyes open for a strut brace sometime in the the future too.

Ollie

For sure mate.
I agree whoeheartedly that the supers have crappy suspension travel too. Hitting small potholes/rises in the road makes for a god awful banging noise. - Gotta compromise sometimes though :(
The verada is looking sensational too.
I can tell you right now Id be trying to make some custom rear clear indicators from perspex if you wanted a very unqiue modification :cool: