Hi

I have virtually no experience with audio. 3 years ago when I got my Magna I changed the stock head unit to a Clarion DZX 946 MP and loved every minute of it - despite keeping the standard 6 speakers.

Now (finally) I want to upgrade so that I can listen to classical music without the tweeters clipping and listen to bass without it clipping.

I have been having a look at the thread with audio installs and some of them are beautiful!

I wouldn't mind a sub but I don't want to lose a lot of boot space - are there any "smallish" subs out there or another place to mount them?

Also, what else do I need to get to start a decent audio system - i.e something that can be cranked up without distortion. I don't need it to look beautiful or win comps - just for my enjoyment - I am going to hook it up to the carputer so I can have whatever song I want at my fingertips :)

Any suggestions would be appreciated!

the bug has bitten :P

For classical music and something with a bit of bass... Here we go...

FRONT
Some 6" or 6.5" splits

REAR
I prefer nothing, but if you want something, some 6x9 2 ways

SUB
I would recommend a nice 8" or 10" sub in a sealed box for accuracy, it wont get that much of a pounding. Unless you listen to pipe organ stuff. Would also mean you could put it in a pretty small box and not loose your boot space.

AMP
4 channel. 2 channels for the front and bridge the other 2 for the sub. Don't amp the rears, run them off the headunit.

Priority... I would spend most of your money on the front splits and the amp. With classical music that will make all the difference.

Now what's your budget so I can suggest brands/costs?

You know you're a stereotypical Magna driver when you listen to classical music lol

Pioneer make a sub that is designed for tight spaces ie. utes.
Try them as the help if you don't want to eat up boot space.

Thanks for the help so far. I am looking to keep my existing Clarion head unit and spend about $500 - $1000.


You know you're a stereotypical Magna driver when you listen to classical music lol

Yes - but I like the option of wearing a cardigan and listening to classical music - it annoys me when I can't listen to it cos it sounds like a bee has got into the tweeter lol

Ok revised with prices which should fit within your budget:

FRONT
Response 6.5" Splits CS2329 $149.95

REAR
Response 6x9 CS2378 $129.95

SUB
Response 10" 250Wrms CS2352 $199
Response 12" 300Wrms CS2354 $249

SUB BOX
Bigs makes a custom one for a 12" which fits very nicely (I have one) and takes up virtually no boot space. All for $200
http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56169
manson_307 also can do them but you might need to send him a PM. He can do 10" or 12"
http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58300

AMP
4 channel. 2 channels for the front and bridge the other 2 for the sub. Don't amp the rears, run them off the headunit.
Response AA0426 $299
Power / channel @ 4ohm 14.4V: 130WRMS x 4
Power / bridged @ 4ohm 14.4V: 380WRMS x 2

Now that would sound nice for almost smack on $1000. You would need to buy cabling/fuses etc.

Once thing I could suggest for classical, is drop the sub and upgrade the front and rear speakers, amping them all. 6x9s would produce enough bass for most classical.
Then for the fronts you could get something like Hertz, Boston, Morel etc entry level splits.

Pete

Oh and Jaycar has a couple of those things on special right now... like the 6.5" splits.

You know you're a stereotypical Magna driver when you listen to classical music lol
You know you're a stereotypical AMC poster when you spam threads with pointless posts:D

Thanks very much Poita - that was really useful - time to go shopping!

Would I need to upgrade the alternator and install soundproofing with this kind of setup?

Thanks very much Poita - that was really useful - time to go shopping!

Would I need to upgrade the alternator and install soundproofing with this kind of setup?

No alternator is fine.
Some sound deadening would be useful on the front doors, but for the boot, unless you listen to a lot of doof I wouldn't bother, just secure the number plate from rattling. Oh and don't buy the Jaycar deadening, look for Stinger Roadkill or Dynamat. Most decent car audio places have it (even JB HIFI has Stinger). The Jaycar stuff looses its stickiness in summer and slides down.

Also dont buy the sub till you check to see whether either of those guys can get a box done for you otherwise it will cost you a mint from a custom car audio place. :D

Just out of interest, if I get splits for the front (I presume I put that in the front door?), what do I do with the stock tweeters?

Is it better to have separate tweeters and front speakers rather than splits?

Splits = separate woofer and tweeter :)

Splits are better than coaxials (tweeter and woofer together). If you already have tweeters, the easiest install option would just be to place them in the factory mounts on the top of the doors.

Splits = separate woofer and tweeter :)

Splits are better than coaxials (tweeter and woofer together). If you already have tweeters, the easiest install option would just be to place them in the factory mounts on the top of the doors.

:redface: Oops - yes - I got confused between splits and coaxials - see what I mean by being an audio noob- OK I'll stop asking questions now!

for classical music, your budget is tough, but doable. first of all, lose the rear speakers all together. Classical music comes from a stage that is entirely in front of the crowd, reproduction should mimick such a setup.

While my preference would go to Morel Elates or Hertz Mille splits, these are around $500-600 so a tiny bit out of budget unless you could stretch it.

Budgeting for $1000 without installation costs I would highly recommend a budget sub over nothing at all, otherwise you are honestly losing 50% of the dynamics from your music.

Boston SL60's have fair reproduction, only really dulling in lower midrange frequencies, and slightly peaky on top end. The are full of life speakers that would suit your requirements nicely. At around $350 they are well priced.

For subbass duties you are very limited, but as i said, any sub is better than no sub, granted it can keep up with the front speakers to a reasonable listening level. For this the cheapest and most effective thing i could think of is a Pioneer 257C, which can be had for around $90, and sounds surprisingly smooth in a small sealed box.

An amplifier really doesnt need to be as powerful as a lot of people seem to think. given the situation and budget, a small 4x50W RMS or so amp would be ideal, and power the system quite satisfactorily. As much as I dont usually recommend them, the cheapest and most effective they come would be a Response amp for around $200, or $160 if you haggle.

Cabling should total about $60 if you shop around for either a 4 channel 8 gauge wiring kit or buy the bits seperately.

A slim 10" box you should be able to get made for $120 to suit the sub.

Totaling around $800, this leaves you with either $200 towards the ~$250 installation, or an upgrade to the front speakers to a set of Hertz Mille splits for around $550 with a bit of haggling.

Thanks Woob!

Has anyone had anyone experience with the "Peerless Resolution" brand of speakers. Apparently a Danish brand. There are some specials going around but I have never heard of this brand before.

Anyone know of them / have them?

Peerless is the cheaper side of the ex-DST (Danish Sound Technology?) audio company. They also produce Vifa and Scanspeak, all which are considered great gear within each price bracket. What exactly are you eyeing off from Peerless?

ive always been keen to hear resolution stuff, never really had the chance.

I would be fairly confident in saying that you would love the Peerless speakers. they are generally quite clinical speakers, very good reproduction, for the price i would expect them to trump the Bostons i earlier recommended. Peerless is however renound for, as so many European speaker manufacturers are, having very lacking midbass. Though with this said, with some playing you could certainly get it to an acceptable level.

The subwoofer however I cannot speak for at all, The only Peerless subwoofer I have experience with is the VDO HPS series, which are a fantastic sounding budget subwoofer, but lack the ability to play low enough.

Ill give the thumbs up for the Boston SL-60's. Try and stretch the budget to get a better amp than a Jaycar to run them. I have mine running off an Audison SRx2 and they work fine. Hertz and Focal have release a new range of entry level amps to that will suit your needs well. Perhaps you could also look at the Oz Audio Vectors another possible set.

Treo make a nice sounding entry level sub for only $199 I think in a 12inch.

With car audio, do it once, do it right. If you can't afford a decent sub, just get the fronts sorted and wait a few weeks.

As I posted in the other thread, I did a bit of listening to speakers today - I got to listen to:

MB Quart Resolution
Boston SL60
Focal VR

I listened to Michael Buble's "Everything" - that type of "jazzy" or whatever music is what I like to hear clearly from my speakers most... although I do listen to classical music and also stuff like "Get Low - Lil Jon & The Eastside Boyz " (Need for Speed soundtrack)... hehe let the flaming begin...



I liked how it sounded most with the MB Quart - by a long shot actually.

Anyway, I got a quote including installation for:

MB Quart Resolution 6" splits
Alpine amp - MRP F300
Rockford Fosgate P1 & custom sub box
for $1600

or without a sub and 6x9 Mb Quart Discus for $1500.

What do you guys think about that price? Any recommendations for a better amp or sub?
I think I'll let the professionals install it - maybe if I need to do small modifications I can do it - but I am not game to do an entire install...

Also, it seems the Oz Audio Vortex splits are going for about $200 - anyone know stores in Melbourne that demo these and/or Treo?

I feel like I am getting somewhere thanks to all the help!

Good to see you can stretch the budget for some higher end gear! You will be much happier!

Even if you get the splits and the amp now and get the sub and 6x9s (if you insist on getting them) later to ease the shock on the bank.

Just wondering if anyone has / has listened to Oz Audio Vectors splits (V650S3)?
Are they "sharper" like Focals or more "rounded" like the MB Quarts...

These seem to be selling for about $200.

How do they compare with MB Quarts Reference or Boston SLs?

Does anyone know where I can listen to these in Melbourne? I couldn't find anyone stocking them :(

Typically, the SL's have a much harsher tweeter than most ( what I love about them ) which is similar to most Focals. The Bostons seem to have more kick in similar sets over the focals. I have only heard the Oz ME splits in the 2 way and they are kinda like the upper end Morel gear but the tweeters are very different. Couldn't put my foot on it.

You seem to like the MB's very much so I would just go with them... safe bet :D

Just an update - if anyone cares :D

I found some Oz Audio Vectors - at Autobarn in Epping - they sound very nice. In fact, I like them better than the MB Quarts references (or even the premium). But it is so hard to compare when it is a different place, different head unit and settings... I am not a fan of the Oz Audio styling though - how do you get THAT behind a grille?!

I am finding the MB Quart is awesome for R&B but the Oz Audio is better (or at least as good) for stuff with a lot of guitar etc. Maybe I need my ears and head checked - how could the entry range Oz Audios sound better than a medium range or high range MB Quart?

I listened to some Focals and found them too dominated by the high range for my liking. My next task is to listen to the Bostons again and also listen to some Crescendo speakers - has anyone had any experience with these?

Also if I buy the parts separately, what would an approximate install cost be for front splits and amp and a sub (enclosure provided)?

I picked up an amp (second hand) for $350 - a SoundStream VanGogh 320.4 - so that's one thing out of the way :D

Yeah the Oz gear is really good for the money. Personally I think my Oz Me 12.2 sounds a lot better and louder under the same conditions as the Boston G5 I had... and at a lot less money.

You must remember, how long would you spend looking at your speakers compared to actually listening to them.

Bostons will be harsh up top as well but are usually more balanced in the transition between mid and tweeter than the Focals. This makes the Focals a little harder to mount, but they will sound awesome if you get the staging right. Usually mounting the tweeters off axis helps. This is partually the problem with sound boards.

Make sure you spend the $$$ on deadening the fronts doors properly, otherwise you are wasting your time.

I was lucky to pick up a near new 12 inch Soundstream Reference sub RFW-12 in a box for $120. Rated at 600 RMS and 87 dB sensitivity. Dual 2-Layer, 4 Ohm Voice Coils.

Will I need a separate sub amp to power this given the RMS for ths is 600W. The Soundstream Van Gogh I have is rated as:
4 X 80 RMS 4 Ohm
4 X 160 RMS 2 Ohm
2 X 320 RMS 4 Ohm
I am planning to run the front splits of it and bridge two channels for the sub...

So will this be enough or am I better off running a separate sub amp?

I was lucky to pick up a near new 12 inch Soundstream Reference sub RFW-12 in a box for $120. Rated at 600 RMS and 87 dB sensitivity. Dual 2-Layer, 4 Ohm Voice Coils.

Will I need a separate sub amp to power this given the RMS for ths is 600W. The Soundstream Van Gogh I have is rated as:
4 X 80 RMS 4 Ohm
4 X 160 RMS 2 Ohm
2 X 320 RMS 4 Ohm
I am planning to run the front splits of it and bridge two channels for the sub...

So will this be enough or am I better off running a separate sub amp?

There are only 2 ways you will be able to use that amp. First is by leaving it as 4ch. This will means that you fronts will get a healthy 80W and each coil of the sub will get 80w as well for a total of 160w ( woot ). Or as you said you could bridge your amp however this will have the same output of about 160-200w @ 8ohm as you could not bridge the amp and run it @ 2ohm on this model.

If you like, best thing to you really is:
Use the 4ch you have to run your front stage actively or run front and rears
Get a mono to run your sub. Even the $399 Jaycar is a decent starting point with DD, Focal, Earthquake, Hertz etc all making really good mono's for under $600 that will suit you perfectly.
:D

There are only 2 ways you will be able to use that amp. First is by leaving it as 4ch. This will means that you fronts will get a healthy 80W and each coil of the sub will get 80w as well for a total of 160w ( woot ). Or as you said you could bridge your amp however this will have the same output of about 160-200w @ 8ohm as you could not bridge the amp and run it @ 2ohm on this model.

If you like, best thing to you really is:
Use the 4ch you have to run your front stage actively or run front and rears
Get a mono to run your sub. Even the $399 Jaycar is a decent starting point with DD, Focal, Earthquake, Hertz etc all making really good mono's for under $600 that will suit you perfectly.
:D

I will get a mono then, sounds like the way to go - lol @ initial budget of $1000... though it's not too bad! Revised budget - $350 for 4ch amp, $120 for sub, $400 (or less) for mono and since I am going to the US in September I might pick up a set of Boston SPZ60s for about $600 if they sound bassy enough - after listening to more MB Quarts and Bostons, I do like the clarity of the Bostons for guitar music (over the MBQs) and if they had a bit more mid bass I would get that - also having the coaxial configuration sounds good. So when I go over to the States I'll have a listen and get them if they sound good - SPZ60s are going for around $600 there - unbelievable!

So total cost for parts is about $1500 - guess that's not too bad... Now to decide whether to attempt an install!

Thanks very much for all the help - will let you know how it all goes.

OK - Got my bits and pieces now:

$350 Soundstream VanGogh 320.4 4ch amp
$200 Orion 1200D mono amp
$120 Soundstream Reference RWF12 subwoofer + box
$420 Oz Audio Matrix Elites 6.5" splits (I got to listen to a pair of these and really liked it!)

$1090 so far. I might get some Oz Audio Vectors (2 ways) for rear fill later.

I am half tempted to attempt the install, but given that there are so many things to install at once I think I would rather get it done professionally and if I need to tweak something I could do that down the track.

Could someone give me a rough idea of how much would it cost for a professional installation (including cables etc). I want to keep it looking stock / stealth.

I was planning to get it done at Stylyn in Moorabin because they have been the most helpful (had sound boards that I could listen to and explained stuff to me) to me so far. Has anyone had an install done by them or recommend anyone else? Anywhere in Melbourne is OK but closer to Kew would be a bonus!

Install should cost around $300+ depending on what you really sit down and get done.

I'm more interested to know where you got those Oz Me's for $420 :shock:

Install should cost around $300+ depending on what you really sit down and get done.

I'm more interested to know where you got those Oz Me's for $420 :shock:

I got lucky on ebay - off a US car / audio shop that has an internet arm... (USD 350 + 60 postage) - actually all my gear was bought off ebay :D

I will let you know when it arrives whether I have been ripped off :P I couldn't find any reports of fake Oz Audios so I presume this is real - they were running out for even less before (one site had then advertised / sold out at $299)

I found them hard to find around Melbourne to have a listen to - but a friend of a friend had some and kindly let me listen - I was sold - it had the right mix of roundness and clarity for me!

Thanks again for helping me decide what to get!