Recently fitted some ultimates to my 99th wagon, on my local track, before the pads, i could only get 3 to four corners before the pedal would go to the floor, discs were not very hot at all, pads just stopped working, now with the ultimates, i've found out i can do a full session at the track, which is about 40 corners, mostly downhill, and only get the tiniest bit of spongy pedal towards the end as the fluid boiled over, but no huge fade, still, i allowed a few minutes of cool down driving, and stopped for a quick look with phone cam at the ready, this is the result.

http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/5952/discql2.jpg

so obviously i need to get rid of some heat better, and i'll have to try some higher rated fluid too as i've done another 10 or so ks in the car and pedal feel hasn't really returned, fluid is easy, will do tomorrow, it looks like if money was no object ii at least update to some awd/ralliart or 380 discs and calipers, maybe even get some aftermarket rotors with extra cooling/ gas dispersion (slotted and drilled)and just grab the calipers from said cars? but this is rather exxy so i'd rather go a cheaper route, pads are almost certanly glazed, noticably noiser than pre track, can you get slotted rotors in the standard size, not awd size? this might reduce the glazing and if decent fluid reduces the boiling fluid/spongy pedal that may be enough as i don't get to the track often enough to warrant the expense of full upgrade and the car needs other work too...

Far out dude thats an awesome pic..... Would have loved to see it with a better quality camera

you could got for some slotted rotors to dissipate some of the heat..

but judging by the amount of heat that is shown in that picture I would be changing the whole brake system to either magna AWD/Ralliart or an aftermaket kit.

i have slotted rotors on the front of my te in standard size and they are awesome compared to regular. I am running bendix ultimates as well and have not had any fade issues and am still on the same set of pads that i put in with the rotors about 3 years ago. Mind you, i havent done any track days just mainly commuting, but it would have easily been about 70,000k's or so.

Chris

Just a thought, can a brake shop cross drill our existing rotors? Could we?:badgrin:

Just a thought, can a brake shop cross drill our existing rotors? Could we?:badgrin:

Yep, it could be done with a drill press. The only problem would be getting the pattern right.

I would hate to think if a rotor failed because you drilled it in the wrong spot.....:redface:

cross drilled rotors have a tendancy to get crack radiating out from the holes. Mainly due to the fact that the holes are drilled after manufacture.

There is a company, i'm not sure of the name, that actually casts the holes into the disc as part of the manufacturing process. Could be DBA i'm not sure.

Which track are you talking about?

3 things you need to know:

DBA4000 slotted rotors, Ferodo DS2500 pads, Motul RBF600 fluid.

I am running the above with evo4 aka ralliart/awd brakes, and have never encountered so much as a hint of fade or spongy pedal at Wakefield.

If you are going to get new rotors anyway, surely you can stretch the budget a bit and get some 380/evo4 calipers as well? And I'm guessing you need new pads anyway.

If you really wanto minimise cost, grab some proper high-temp fluid such as RBF600, and see how that goes, since fluid boiling seems be your main problem at the moment.

Ferodo DS2500 pads


how much are these roughly

how much are these roughly

Around $250 for the evo4/ralliart/awd calipers. May seem rather pricy for some brake pads, but for a streetable pad they are magic at the track - not just in terms of lack of fade, but the way they "bight" at temps that render most street pads useless, and ease of modulation due to that.

Also on the track they wear much better than the usual "good" street pads - each set of DS2500 I've had I've gotten 2 track days and plenty of daily driven kms of use. Once I went with EBC green, they were completely ****ed after one outing.

i am looking for some good pads... was going to get green stuff.... but now i think i'll get the ferodo


also looking at using this fluid as my old boss races v8's and this is what they use
AP Racing 600 Competition Brake & Clutch Fluid - CP3600

Can you get those pads and discs for the single piston caliper? or only the twin piston?i know i couldn't get green stuff pads for the single.

I'm upgrading to some 600 fluid next week hopefully so it shouldn't boil over again.

No offence is ment or given in this feedback, apologies if taken in this manner.

I love the track as much as the next racer, key is you have to remember....

your driving a family vehicle, if you wanna take it to the track and run fast laps you may need to save a bit and....

Upgrade to min 2piston callipers (AWD/Ralliart)
Upgrade to DBA/RDA slotted rotors
Get a set of Greenstuff even Blackstuff pads
Upgrade to braided lines
and finally but not any less important.....
run race brake fluid, we used motul in the past with good results.

I'm sorry but it seems so many people(not necessarily you, as you talking bout on the track) decide to get huge HP and 1/4 mile times from a car not engineered to do it, on the street.
I once got told, if your gonna make your car fast, do the slow bits and handling bits first.

No point having a quick/fast car if the bugger can't handle a roundabout doing less than 80km/h or stop within half a kilometre.......

Fastest magna i've had(owned 3 3rd gens) was a TH 3.5 sports manual with CAI, POD, extractors, exhaust and h/duty clutch, which was fine, but coming to a stop was another matter, scared the sit outta me till i upgraded to better rotors and pads. Even then it wasnt a fantastic braking car.

Food for thought at least.

Luke

No offence taken, the term "track" may have have been used loosely, as indicated by the 40 downhill corners over 10ks comment and the nightime pick.

anyway, it is a family vehicle, but i barely have the money to upgrade the brakes, let alone run a track focused car, not to mention keep my dirt bike, track bike, and commuter bike on the road and support the family on a single income. lol. every now and then i like to give the car a hard time when there's no one around, and am only intersted in handling and stopping, a 1500kg wagon is never going to be fast, but it can be made to be fun for cheap by replacing stock bits with better bits when maintanance is required, thankfully someone had already spent a bit of money on it before i got it, i run good tyres, suspension is ok but in need of new front shocks as they only work on smooth surfaces, lack rebound control, so looking at some kyb fronts as a minimum, maybe even the adjustable konis not looking to make it fast, but would like it to get around corners ok and stop when it needs to.

i just thought it was a cool pick and found it intresting that a pad that worked when cold still stopped a heavy car ok on a downhill when there's that much heat in it, also was digging for any info on cheap mods, so decent fluid will be first off to see if it stops boiling.