Greetings, time for a bit of a rant.

Basically I had the clutch replaced in my TS V6 in September 2007. Original clutch had lasted well for 12 years and 192,000km. Was beginning to shudder (flat spots) and the mechanic reckoned he could just get it to slip (I couldn't).

So they did the clutch replacement. Took 3 days and cost nearly $1000. This was a "highly regarded" mechanic by a few of my colleagues --> Or so I thought at the time.

When I picked up the car, I noticed the clutch pedal was really light. I didn't drive off, but went back to tell the mechanic. He reckoned it was normal and that 90% of people would stall their cars after they have replacement clutches installed.

So I (stupidly) took his word and drove home. I could not believe how light the clutch was. Basically, you could use finger pressure to press the clutch. The pedal was still coming back up, just. The clutch takeup action was also very abrupt, which I didn't like. Couldn't shift smoothly, car clunked especially on 1-2 and 2-3 shifts.

The next morning, when I was going to back the car out of the garage, I noticed that the clutch didn't spring back up. Obviously something was wrong. So I had to flick the clutch pedal up, start the car and bunnyhop out of the garage, stall it in order to stop, select 3rd (figured 3rd was most suitable), and hop all the 12km back to the mechanic. Not impressed. Didn't take highway, stayed in 60-70km/h zones and prayed very hard not to get too many red lights.

I got there, and there was no apology or anything. They just said it was a vacuum leak and bled the system. Clutch came still a bit light, but within normal expectations.

That's not all - I soon noticed a bearing noise, most noticeable at idle, without the clutch depressed. Turns out the input shaft bearing (I'm told it's not the throwout bearing as someone else said) needed replacement. Took it back to the mechanic. Mechanic said it was just normal noise, "it's just the gearbox spinning". Refused to think that anything was wrong.

I also mentioned how the clutch was very abrupt which caused harsh jerky shifting. I like to think that I'm capable of driving very smoothly, to reduce mechanical wear & tear on all components, but it was just not possible. Once again, mechanic said the clutch action was normal and refused to even take a look at it. Not even after 4 visits.

So I just thought to myself, ah well, I don't really want to pay $800-$1000 for another clutch + installation, so just live with it.

I was also getting pretty bad shuddering at the friction point, just as the clutch engages, the whole car would shake violently. When I told the (original) mechanic the clutch had been replaced, he just said it was the engine mounts, and I've had a few replaced. More money. However the shaking returned and was worse then ever, hence I've got another mechanic now, for obvious reasons.

Lived with it for 16 months and 29,000km. Was never happy with the clutch action, shuddering, nor the clunking during engagement. Today got the car to new mechanic to have the bearing replaced and clutch inspected & adjusted. He soon rings me to say that the entire clutch disc is collapsed and that I need a new clutch.

I tell him the car is always driven very gently (well as best as I can, given the abrupt clutch action), but certainly it's still gentler than your average driver. Surely the clutch couldn't self-destruct in 29,000km when the original clutch lasted 12 years & 192,000km......

Hence my question is -- Could the installation have played a part in the lack of longevity of the clutch? It's been too long (16 months & 29,000km) to go back to the original mechanic and complain - and neither do I want to deal with them again anyway. I'm told it's a Daikin clutch as per factory specifications.

Also, I saw 2 apprentices on duty that day the original clutch replacement was done. I have no problem with apprentices carrying out the work, as long as a qualified staff member checks off and approves it before it goes out the door! All of us start out in our respective fields as apprentices and we need to be given a go in order to learn the ropes. BUt quality control should never fall in any case.

So let's hope they get it RIGHT this time.

Interesting post!

I'm going through the same clutch disaster/trauma, a manual 2.6L TS.
Clutch started to slip badly at 217,000Km, pulled the gearbox myself and installed a new clutch.
On reassembly the clutch pedal was very light, and would not depress all the way to the floor.
I stopped at this point - checked with a few people and got these answers:
(1) Mitsu - both Magna and Lancers - have a very short clutch throw out of about 6 mm due to the compactness of the bell housing. 6mm is the distance the clutch plate moves when you push in the clutch. As the clutch wears, the plate gets thinner (5mm on the old one, the new plate was 9.5 mm thick) but the pivot ball and socket in the release lever also wear and the two wear points cancel each other out. When a new plate is put in, the geometry of the clutch and wear on the ball/lever means the lever now hits the inside of the gearbox housing before the clutch releases. Sounds like this was your problem, as the bunnyhopping etc is a sign the clutch isn't releasing fully.
The aftermarket clutch I installed had written information with it suggesting that:
- the ball and pivot socket in the clutch release lever be inspected for wear. (Bit hard to tell if you don't have a new one to compare it to). Replace the worn parts ($290 for the lever, $20 for the ball, Mitsu prices). An alternative is to place a 2mm spacer (washer) under the ball where it threads into the gearbox to compensate for wear.
(2) Another posibility is that the release lever is cracked and flexes when you use the clutch. Alloy levers c an do this, but I think the Magna lever is cast iron.

My tasks now are:
(a) Remove the gearbox again.
(b) Remove the lever and ball, clean and carefully check for cracks and wear.
(c) Depending on what I find, either buy new parts or use the shim trick.
(d) Reassemble and test.

Note: The gearbox removal/clutch replacement is a B_I_T_C_H of a job on a Magna. I'm not surprised the original mechanic lost interest.

Print this out and give it to your new mechanic. He needs to know that there is a "trick" to the job if this is his first Magna clutch job. He also needs to remove accumulated clutch dust from the inside of the bell housing, as this has nowhere to go normally and can interfere with normal clutch action.


Personal note - This job has done my back in and the weather is too hot. I'm going to leave the car as is for a few weeks. Just as well I have a spare Magna!

Hey MadMax, thanks for your info, yes, that's exactly the symptoms.

My new mechanic has got the car ready now, just spoke to him on the phone. He reckons it's driving very well now. Well let's see, I cannot actually recall the clutch action working properly anymore after 29,000km of clunking and banging every gearchange.

I will print your write-up for Adam to read, he's a fair dinkum bloke and will appreciate the info, (ie. not take offence that we're doubting his competence)

Thanks again -- Good luck with your clutch install and hope your back gets better too

Cheers
Justin

mate, if your clutch kit is only 29,000kms old and all thats is worn is your clutch plate.. then i might be able to help you.. i have a brand new geniune TR/TS clutch plate at home. if its of any help to you let me know...

JZT: Glad to be of help.

Can you ask your mechanic what he thinks the problem was, and how he fixed it?
Could be very informative for me when I get around to doing mine!

Mate,
There are many things that the "mechanic" may have done wrong.

First of all, input shaft noise is common but if it was not there prior to the clutch being done, I would say he had cleaned the bell housing area and not prevented water and grime being forced past the front seal into the bearing.

The shudder so soon would indicate that he did not have the flywheel machined either

YEs, you do need to check the pivot height and yes a lot of after market clutch kits are very light in the pedal but no, they do not get stuck, no they do not grab and no they do not shudder either.

$1000 for a clutch in a second Gen, wow, the basic kit is only about $200 max then labour perhaps $200 max, flywheel and gear oil $80 bucks

Looks like you know who NOT to take the car to again

Mate,
There are many things that the "mechanic" may have done wrong.

First of all, input shaft noise is common but if it was not there prior to the clutch being done, I would say he had cleaned the bell housing area and not prevented water and grime being forced past the front seal into the bearing.

The shudder so soon would indicate that he did not have the flywheel machined either

YEs, you do need to check the pivot height and yes a lot of after market clutch kits are very light in the pedal but no, they do not get stuck, no they do not grab and no they do not shudder either.

$1000 for a clutch in a second Gen, wow, the basic kit is only about $200 max then labour perhaps $200 max, flywheel and gear oil $80 bucks

Looks like you know who NOT to take the car to again


How specifically do you check the pivot height? What measurement should it be?

Measurement I would have to look up as I do not do these that often

I use a depth guage, is most accurate and then a shim to make up the height

Could you look it up please? Actual height is not mentioned in any manual I've looked at. (I could be wrong, I will check.)

Got the car back. New clutch is the same Daikin as the previous (buggered) one, but the whole transmission action feels tighter with no banging or looseness every time you change gear.

I should have mentioned too (the mechanic re-iterated this to me today) that there was no freeplay at all in the clutch travel, therefore he was saying that because there was no freeplay at all, pressure was being exerted all the time, which is no good. He also said that the old clutch had been adjusted (or maybe it was never adjusted!) so that the clutch would start to engage whilst the pedal was still 70%-80% depressed, which makes it hard to drive smoothly, as I have said in my original post.

The clutch now engages further up....I would guess, say, maybe almost halfway up the travel. I find it much easier to control and drive normally/smoothly. My 1-2 and 2-3 shifts in normal driving (2000rpm approx) are pretty much jerk free now. I was never able to do this before.


MadMax, the mechanic today told me that he thinks the clutch was fitted without proper care, that the installers were too rough and caused damage. He showed me the clutch plate, you know how there's the hole in the middle of it, which has a lot of little grooves round the circumference. He tells me that it has to line up exactly prior to fitment, but he thinks it wasn't lined up properly and the fitters just forced the gearbox back in, thus causing the damage. All the springs were also loose and there was much movement, he showed me. The springs also had bits shaved off them and one spring was "collapsed" he said. (Remedy - replaced entire clutch kit, new gearbox oil, labour to remove and refit)

MadMagna, I checked my $1000 clutch replacement invoice from September 2007 and it states that the flywheel WAS indeed machined. Well, in that case, they mustn't have done it very well (or done it at all). So much for highly regarded mechanics that others recommend to you. Far out man. And whether they cleaned it out when fitting the clutch, my (new) mechanic said it was incredibly dirty/dusty everywhere when he opened the gearbox up and he is quite sure that was never even cleaned when they fitted the last clutch in September 2007. Once again, far out man.

Oh, talking about input shaft bearing noise, now there is hardly any noise at all. FINALLY. With the car idling normally (750-850rpm), in neutral, if I let the clutch out, I can j-u-s-t hear a slight whirring. It is very slight. Is this acceptable? I've never known the TS V6 to be so quiet at idle! I'm assuming that because there are moving parts, we can allow for some very soft sounds from the parts moving . It is much softer than the rattle that it used to be.
We've got a 2008 Holden Epica 2.0 manual (only done 700km) which also has a very soft similar noise.

Good to hear - sounds like its fixed! You must be real happy : lol

Oh thank goodness, indeed I am so relieved.

Nearly to the point where I was almost happy to surrender the $610 for the job.

It's just irritating to be driving around with a dodgily-installed clutch for 18 months, and it's finally over.