I want to change my oil & filter as part of the Supercharger install, what oil & grade do you 3rd Gen guys use?

I was thinking maybe going to fully synthetic Valvoline SynPower, what do you think?

I want to change my oil & filter as part of the Supercharger install, what oil & grade do you 3rd Gen guys use?

I was thinking maybe going to fully synthetic Valvoline SynPower, what do you think?
HPR5

5w-40 its what sprintex reccomends, dont use anything else but that

Use something good and in range of specified requirement, change it often, high quality filters are good - from K&N, PUROLATOR, BOSCH are surefire.

What did they recommend you for spark plugs??

HPR5

5w-40 its what sprintex reccomends, dont use anything else but that
What brand is HPR5? The Sprintex manual I got with the charger mentions a few different grades but no brand in particular.

Use something good and in range of specified requirement, change it often, high quality filters are good - from K&N, PUROLATOR, BOSCH are surefire.

What did they recommend you for spark plugs??
They supplied 6 new IriWay 7 plugs with the kit.

What brand is HPR5? The Sprintex manual I got with the charger mentions a few different grades but no brand in particular.

Penrite

Its a Semi Syn, it was factory fill for all sprintex'ed magnas and the TMR's as well, plugs the IRIWAY7 again the same as the magna kit

Also known as a BKR7EIX

Penrite

Its a Semi Syn, it was factory fill for all sprintex'ed magnas and the TMR's as well, plugs the IRIWAY7 again the same as the magna kit

Also known as a BKR7EIX
Ok cool I'll check it out.

I would be using a fully synthetic oil. Personally for a supercharged vehicle I would use Penrite SYN 10W-70 which is what I use in my EVO. It provides extreme protection at very high temps which is what forced induction vehicles can experience.

I would be using a fully synthetic oil. Personally for a supercharged vehicle I would use Penrite SYN 10W-70 which is what I use in my EVO. It provides extreme protection at very high temps which is what forced induction vehicles can experience.

Ill have to disagree here, Evos =/= Magna, now the reason being the bearings in the sprintex are roller style not ball bearing like the evo turbo's also the magna 1: doesnt rev anywhere near as hard, 2: hasnt got anywhere near the heat of a turbocharger

Not to mention the cross hatching on the bores doesnt like high rate oil, and also the bottom end bearings.

Personally stick with what sprintex reccomend, ive used it since i got mine, done about 35k on it so far with no issue (unless that ticking noise that magically dissappeared is something bad)

How isn't a higher grade (70) oil better for an engine regardless? Overkill, maybe, but it offers the same cold temp protection as a 10W-40 oil, but offers far superior high temp protection. I'm curious to your thinking. Also, surely you would use a fully synthetic oil regardless, no?

Yeah,i like Penrite as well,but to be honests any decent branded oil (apart from Castrol and Penzoil IMO,and this is purely my opinion) in the recommended viscosity rating should be ok,semi syth or full synth would be recommended as it would have a better shear rate and not break down as easily at the higher temps that can be found in turboed or huffer driven engines i gather,Also check out Fuchs oil

You will find there are very few lubricants that will stand the test of a supercharged engine in spite of all the hype.

A few do it really well, the rest are maggot dead by 5000km instead of offering solid protection right up to 5000km

You will find there are very few lubricants that will stand the test of a supercharged engine in spite of all the hype.

A few do it really well, the rest are maggot dead by 5000km instead of offering solid protection right up to 5000km

do tell squire!

HPR5

5w-40 its what sprintex reccomends, dont use anything else but that
I looked at the Penrite website & from what they say I can't see why you couldn't use their fully synthetic equivelent in the 5w-40? Seems fully synthetic is better than a blend?

How isn't a higher grade (70) oil better for an engine regardless? Overkill, maybe, but it offers the same cold temp protection as a 10W-40 oil, but offers far superior high temp protection. I'm curious to your thinking. Also, surely you would use a fully synthetic oil regardless, no?

Penrite is a 60/40 blend of synthetic enhanced additives to Base mineral oil, Now fully synthetic oils usually have a ratio of about 90/10 or there abouts, most of these additives are a telfon based additive designed to place a coating over parts to protect against wear, sounds good right?

Wrong, they are helpful to a point, you want some kind of wear to happen espically in the bore and ring area, helps keep it all sealed to maintain maximum compression, theres also more maths to it but i have a headache and cant remember the rest. Its mainly the reason why rebuilt motors and whatnot go for a mineral grade oil.

Also the 70 part is the thickness at operating temperature (120 degrees C) which is very thick once its hot, now this has a 2 fold effect as well, 1 its good for sealing the motor and seals, 2 its bad for bottom end bearings as it might not be able to flow fast enough through the oil passages and you could have starvation on your hands, and this can lead to cooked bearings, its the same deal with thin oil as well, great at cold startups, but can breakdown at high temps, (by low i mean like a 0w-20 like they use in england in winter)

Stick with the HPR5 5w-40, its what they reccomend its what i have used for ages, its what Mohit uses from memory, hell Jase uses it as well, and Brad will be once i tell him to go buy it.

Also remember that the sprintex is high pressure inlet low pressure outlet as well

Also if your going to use Castrol dont use 5w-30 or 0w-40
And Fuch dont use there titan series

Nulon is a good bet as well seen good results out of TRD's with those (when they did the product comparisons when i used to work at super****)

Oh yeah forgot to add, Penrites warranty that if it does cook a bottom end etc and oil is found to be the problem they will redeem the cost in parts and repairs as well, castrol will as well but they can be a hell of a lot more picky and look for any excuse to get away from it

Personally, even for a normal Magna, I love Penrite HPR5.

It seriously felt like a different car, I thought the chick at Repco was a little full of it. I gave it a go anyway as she gives me trade discount on all my parts.

She was right - Penrite HPR5 is a great oil.

http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html

Penrite is a 60/40 blend of synthetic enhanced additives to Base mineral oil, Now fully synthetic oils usually have a ratio of about 90/10 or there abouts, most of these additives are a telfon based additive designed to place a coating over parts to protect against wear, sounds good right?

Wrong, they are helpful to a point, you want some kind of wear to happen espically in the bore and ring area, helps keep it all sealed to maintain maximum compression, theres also more maths to it but i have a headache and cant remember the rest. Its mainly the reason why rebuilt motors and whatnot go for a mineral grade oil.

Also the 70 part is the thickness at operating temperature (120 degrees C) which is very thick once its hot, now this has a 2 fold effect as well, 1 its good for sealing the motor and seals, 2 its bad for bottom end bearings as it might not be able to flow fast enough through the oil passages and you could have starvation on your hands, and this can lead to cooked bearings, its the same deal with thin oil as well, great at cold startups, but can breakdown at high temps, (by low i mean like a 0w-20 like they use in england in winter)

Stick with the HPR5 5w-40, its what they reccomend its what i have used for ages, its what Mohit uses from memory, hell Jase uses it as well, and Brad will be once i tell him to go buy it.

Also remember that the sprintex is high pressure inlet low pressure outlet as well

Also if your going to use Castrol dont use 5w-30 or 0w-40
And Fuch dont use there titan series

Nulon is a good bet as well seen good results out of TRD's with those (when they did the product comparisons when i used to work at super****)

Oh yeah forgot to add, Penrites warranty that if it does cook a bottom end etc and oil is found to be the problem they will redeem the cost in parts and repairs as well, castrol will as well but they can be a hell of a lot more picky and look for any excuse to get away from it

Ok. I understand what you're saying, I just cannot agree. For mine, a fully synthetic oil will offer better protection and not break down as much at above normal temps.

Oils are always heavily opinionated discussions. Find something you like and stick to it.

Oils are always heavily opinionated discussions. Find something you like and stick to it.
Ok clear as mud! Glad I started this thread lol

I like the idea of full synthetic, might just run it past Sprintex though to be sure.

Magna00,

Are you sure fully synthetics have teflon based additives in them?,,I thought this would be a big no no TBH as even the teflon maker said it was never designed to be used inside a engine at all!,and i to thought a fully synth oil would offer better heat and shear protection than a semi aswell,but im no oil guru

Steve

I read the tech specs on the penrite & also the valvoline & neither mentioned teflon.

Fooz, use a full synthetic 5W-40 oil. As mentioned, 5W-40 is recommended by Sprintex as it's used for the blower (in your kit you will see oil supply and return lines for the blower).

Change the oil and filter every 5,000 km. I personally use Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 but there are other 5W-40 full synthetics like Valvoline, Motul, etc. Use whatever you like best.

Fooz, use a full synthetic 5W-40 oil. As mentioned, 5W-40 is recommended by Sprintex as it's used for the blower (in your kit you will see oil supply and return lines for the blower).

Change the oil and filter every 5,000 km. I personally use Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 but there are other 5W-40 full synthetics like Valvoline, Motul, etc. Use whatever you like best.
Thanks mate, I think I might give the Valvoline SynPower 5W-40 a go as I run it in my CRD Pajero & seems to work well.

Thanks mate, I think I might give the Valvoline SynPower 5W-40 a go as I run it in my CRD Pajero & seems to work well.

that's what I use. haven't had an oil related problem... except if you count when the oil feed to the blower was blocked! lol

it's about $50 at supercheap/autobarn.

cheers,
.wook

that's what I use. haven't had an oil related problem... except if you count when the oil feed to the blower was blocked! lol

it's about $50 at supercheap/autobarn.

cheers,
.wook
Awesome well it's a definate then, thanks guys for all your help :)

Magna00,

Are you sure fully synthetics have teflon based additives in them?,,I thought this would be a big no no TBH as even the teflon maker said it was never designed to be used inside a engine at all!,and i to thought a fully synth oil would offer better heat and shear protection than a semi aswell,but im no oil guru

Steve

They do offer the better heat protection to a point, however people need to remember that a magna is not a race car, most oil tends to start breaking down at about 130C, synthetics can push this out further because of the additives contained as well as the blending procedure.

The "telfon" style additive is called Molybdenum, the polymer chain is exactly the same as teflon, also performs the same job, as a antifriction agent on metallic surfaces, this isnt a hugely bad thing, but again really depends on the motor in question

heres a link http://www.mrw.interscience.wiley.com/emrw/9780471238966/kirk/article/lubrboos.a01/current/abstract
Explains a little more about synthetic oils.

Just me personally even with the gauge on, with the car on the dyno we never saw my oil temp go over 120c, post blower installation, and that was with HPR5, every oil change the oil comes out resonably golden in colour, and could probably go another 2500k's with relative ease (btw i do my changes at 7500)

im not saying go out and buy any joe blow mineral oil, but a semi syn will do the job just as good as a full synthetic in this case, also it is australian made.

Also the additives found in full synthetics aside from Four point depressants

They do offer the better heat protection to a point, however people need to remember that a magna is not a race car, most oil tends to start breaking down at about 130C, synthetics can push this out further because of the additives contained as well as the blending procedure.

The "telfon" style additive is called Molybdenum, the polymer chain is exactly the same as teflon, also performs the same job, as a antifriction agent on metallic surfaces, this isnt a hugely bad thing, but again really depends on the motor in question

heres a link http://www.mrw.interscience.wiley.com/emrw/9780471238966/kirk/article/lubrboos.a01/current/abstract
Explains a little more about synthetic oils.

Just me personally even with the gauge on, with the car on the dyno we never saw my oil temp go over 120c, post blower installation, and that was with HPR5, every oil change the oil comes out resonably golden in colour, and could probably go another 2500k's with relative ease (btw i do my changes at 7500)

im not saying go out and buy any joe blow mineral oil, but a semi syn will do the job just as good as a full synthetic in this case, also it is australian made.

Also the additives found in full synthetics aside from Four point depressants

cheers,good enough for me fella!

Years ago they started using Teflon in some oils, the FAA banned them in aviation as at high tempst he Teflon was coming out of solution and then causing engines to seize.

Molybdenum is very similar to Teflon but will not solidify under heat the same way as Teflon will and thus is a much safer solution. Again AFAIK the FAA still ban any and all additives for general and commercial aviation although this may have changed in recent years.

As for oils, I do not use Castrol as it turns to water even with the smallest amount of heat. Penziol used to be great 15 years ago but I have had recent bad experiences with lash adjusters getting noisy and the oil breaking down very fast. My KR was the last car I used Penziol in, after about 2000k I started losing oil pressure

Back to the OP, I would use the semi synth Penrite, SPrintex recommend it and I used to use this in my turbo Rotaries with no issues or breakdown at all.

I would use MOTUL 300V 10-40w(other weights available), its a genuine full synthetic oil and comes highly recomended (i have used it for 4 years in my cefiro also, maintains the same oil pressure after 4000kms+one drift day). It is expensive however (4lt and a 1lt bottle from autobarn costs around $130 all up).

Mate i use Castrol Edge 5-30w and it made a noticible difference. stays clean even after 7000ks and my car doesnt use a drop, litterally. it hasnt used any since the change., and its still golden even with 243,000 on the clock. my bonnet label says use mitsi fully syn, so i would never use a semi syn. just me tho. plus testing showed the castrol edge 0-40w and another grade to increase power and protection. go to the site and have a browse.

Mate i use Castrol Edge 5-30w and it made a noticible difference. stays clean even after 7000ks and my car doesnt use a drop, litterally. it hasnt used any since the change., and its still golden even with 243,000 on the clock. my bonnet label says use mitsi fully syn, so i would never use a semi syn. just me tho. plus testing showed the castrol edge 0-40w and another grade to increase power and protection. go to the site and have a browse.

Heres the lowdown on Edge, it doesnt increase power, there marketing focuses on peak power and being able to run it 45% longer at that point, its pretty cunning ploy but hey points for thinking laterally.

I used to be a castrol dealer, and also have been to the Castrol (its actually owned by BP go figure) Distillation facility in Sydney and have seen exactly how oil is made, personally after the 3 payouts castrol had to do because cars threw bottom end bearings due to edge 5w-30 im not so keen on it.

But hey if you want to believe there marketing by all means go for it.

Years ago they started using Teflon in some oils, the FAA banned them in aviation as at high tempst he Teflon was coming out of solution and then causing engines to seize.

Molybdenum is very similar to Teflon but will not solidify under heat the same way as Teflon will and thus is a much safer solution. Again AFAIK the FAA still ban any and all additives for general and commercial aviation although this may have changed in recent years.

As for oils, I do not use Castrol as it turns to water even with the smallest amount of heat. Penziol used to be great 15 years ago but I have had recent bad experiences with lash adjusters getting noisy and the oil breaking down very fast. My KR was the last car I used Penziol in, after about 2000k I started losing oil pressure

Back to the OP, I would use the semi synth Penrite, SPrintex recommend it and I used to use this in my turbo Rotaries with no issues or breakdown at all.

Yes Mal, however aviation oil comes under a different classification then regular motor oil for private and light commerical use, Molyb is as you say extremely similar (only one carbon atom different in the polymer string) and has been proven to around 1900C where the chain broke, and the oil boiled out.

What vehicles did the bottom ends fail in using Edge 5-30w? was it a case of using synthetic where it was not recommended? and if it can indeed keep an engine running 45% longer at peak power then their doing something right!! anyway, its been good to me but everyone has their favorite for various reasons. as a side note the edge smells like golden syrup almost-its funny.

Well, I use Castrol Edge in my Commodore Ecotec V6 with 11psi boost, in my Falcon AU with 9.5psi boost and in my super lightly build Subaru Ej25 NA with 10:1 compression and 5psi boost. Subaru bottom ends are flimsy, and with a total flogging with Edge in the motor its been rot free totally and the motor never ran so quiet as it does now. Previously the Subaru was on Valvoline (non synthetic) which simply makes it clatter like a buggered postie bike.


Like it or not, so far all good (all charged NA engines). I would imagine if there had been issues Castrol would have quickly gotten sick of that and fixed the product ....... as anyone would otherwise on going issues or maybe I am just lucky :D

Well, I use Castrol Edge in my Commodore Ecotec V6 with 11psi boost, in my Falcon AU with 9.5psi boost and in my super lightly build Subaru Ej25 NA with 10:1 compression and 5psi boost. Subaru bottom ends are flimsy, and with a total flogging with Edge in the motor its been rot free totally and the motor never ran so quiet as it does now. Previously the Subaru was on Valvoline (non synthetic) which simply makes it clatter like a buggered postie bike.


Like it or not, so far all good (all charged NA engines). I would imagine if there had been issues Castrol would have quickly gotten sick of that and fixed the product ....... as anyone would otherwise on going issues or maybe I am just lucky :D

We dont know for certain but Ezboys had Castrol edge in it when it let go, also i had a xr6t stock that ripped through an oil pump and a KJ laser with a burnt out set of rings due to no oil, castrol did do testing on the returned batches of oil (except ians as he didnt send it back) and i got an email the day after returning it back for testing saying that they will fix everything free of charge.

Im not saying its hugely bad oil, just be wary of what they say vs what it is supposed to do

What vehicles did the bottom ends fail in using Edge 5-30w? was it a case of using synthetic where it was not recommended? and if it can indeed keep an engine running 45% longer at peak power then their doing something right!! anyway, its been good to me but everyone has their favorite for various reasons. as a side note the edge smells like golden syrup almost-its funny.

There's certain lubricants used when a rotary is put together for the first time, which when you coat every moving part - you technically can run without oil for 1-2minutes.

Doesnt mean its a great oil.

45% longer at peak power - as far as im concerned, that means 2 tenths of bugger all for real world situations.

Since I started this thread, just for the record I bought 5 litres of the Valvoline SynPower 5w-40 today as recommended by Wookiee. $57.45 at Supercheap.

Since I started this thread, just for the record I bought 5 litres of the Valvoline SynPower 5w-40 today as recommended by Mohit. $57.45 at Supercheap.
Eh?


I personally use Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 but there are other 5W-40 full synthetics like Valvoline, Motul, etc.

:nuts:

Eh?



:nuts:

Just looks like he just went for the shiney bottle on the shelf, will see what it will do in the end, espically against those nice new blower casing bearings.

Wookiee sorry, Mohit uses full synthetic but different brand ...... fixed post :redface:

Just looks like he just went for the shiney bottle on the shelf, will see what it will do in the end, espically against those nice new blower casing bearings.
Yep we all like the shiney bottles, me, wookiee & mohit all running full synthetic so we can destroy the blower bearings :doubt: :gtfo:

Yep we all like the shiney bottles, me, wookiee & mohit all running full synthetic so we can destroy the blower bearings :doubt: :gtfo:
Sounds neat.

But seriously, it will be fine. Keep us up to date with your blower install!

Yes Mal, however aviation oil comes under a different classification then regular motor oil for private and light commerical use, Molyb is as you say extremely similar (only one carbon atom different in the polymer string) and has been proven to around 1900C where the chain broke, and the oil boiled out.

Understand that aviation is very different but I am talking std piston engines such as piper and cessna, not gas turbine.

What I was basically saying is that teflon is bad news, there were also issues in car engines in its hey day as well but with the molyb it does not have the same problem thus why some oils have it as an additive. Why, I do not know, I am not a chemist, but either way molyb is fine to use in an engine. As you stated the semi synth should be fine.

Tradewind, I was referring more to turbo rotaries running very high boost, they use the oil to cool the rotors which run very hot and I always found that the castrol was no good. Perhaps has changed these days but for many years my personal prefrence has been Penrite. As many here know, a few years ago I got a series of Oils tested and the Penrite came up miles ahead of the Castrol.

I guess what it comes down to is what you pay for one product, you may need to pay a lot more for an equivelant of another brand


There's certain lubricants used when a rotary is put together for the first time, which when you coat every moving part - you technically can run without oil for 1-2minutes.

Doesnt mean its a great oil.



Not really sure of your point here as when you build a Rotary engine properly, you do not use any more or less oil than that of a piston engine. If you ran a new Rotary for 2 mins with no oil say good bye to bedding in your oil control rings. Yes I used to build these for race and rally cars so I have had the experience.

Not sure really of what your point was with that. Anyone building any motor will prime the oil system before first start anyway so there will not be dry spots anywhere

From a man in the know: "Basically for most hot climate engines Mobil 1 5W/50 is the way to go. It gives good wear and oxidation protection, doesn't evaporate, gives near best HP possible and near best fuel economy."

interesting read...

http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf

Mobil 1 doesn't fare too well at all.

interesting read...

http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf

Mobil 1 doesn't fare too well at all.
I'm not sure how biased that test is, but it shows I'm using the right stuff with the fully synthetic Penrite 10W-70. One of their best performers was the fully synthetic Penrite 5W-60.