PDA

View Full Version : Terrible Noise on cold start ts 95 4cl wagaon



pippy63
08-06-2009, 10:33 AM
Hi Everybody,
This is my first post on just about any forum ,though I read a lot posts hoping to find answers, but this problem has me stumped, so I hope someone can point me in the right direction for a fix, so here is basically what is happening:

1. Has a horrible noise for about 20 secs on cold start (overnight) , has got worse lately goes a bit longer now, about 1 minute.

2. Mechanic thinks it not timing chain maybe lifters or something, he told me to drop both belts that being aircon , alternator belts to check if a bearing is culprit, did this ,still noise.

3. Car purchased about 6 years ago ,had just had a reco engine in at the time, had done 100,000 km. I have done 65,000 since then , it has now 165000 on clock.

4. For the first 10 /15 minutes of driving after noise has stopped,(engine not quit warmed up), it seems to have no power, sort of like there is a lack of fuel or something, engine sort of "woos", like its getting petrol the not getting petrol, after this period of time of 15 minutes, it returns to normal, when temp gauge sits in the middle between hot/cold and never fluctuates from that position.

5. It has had new spark plugs,a replaced voltage regulator that was playing up, a new water pump, an oil change + filter and Nulon lifter tune up add to new oil and a new thermostat, the old one was stuck open, the noise existed about a month before I had done the little jobs, so basically it still there and last a little longer now before it idles out.

I be thankful if someone can help me with a diagnosis of the the problem, I think the mechanic said its a big job and expensive if it lifters or timing chain, more that whats the car is worth, just ditch car he said, but I like my car, I still think and hope I can get a couple more years out of it , even if I have to spend a $1000 or a bit more to rectify problem:pray:

ps.
I have recorded noise in .wav format, 0.5mb in size, I can email to someone if they wish to listen, or is there another way so all can listen to it in this post?

regards pippy63

cuzman
08-06-2009, 01:19 PM
Got to love cars lol, send me the file, justinlinton@hotmail.com

The big problem is it will be hard to sell with the noise but fixing it will be the cost of the car...cant win really. been there, still am.

If you can eliminate the motor hang on bits and are handy you could always get the motor or head if that's the case recoed. Labour is always the big killer.

cheers.

BiG 4 CyL
08-06-2009, 01:23 PM
try a thinner oil, what r u running now? a 5w or 10w may help

pippy63
08-06-2009, 01:57 PM
Hi,
I have always run Valvoline premium 20/50, I know its a bit thick to what is recommended , but every time before this NOISE appeared , the new oil quietened down the engine quit a bit until a few weekes of running, the engine has always had like a tick noise, which would go away with new oil change for a couple of weekes, so sorta stuck with the 20/50 type for this reason, Could this have levitated the problem you think?

cuzman
08-06-2009, 02:34 PM
Hi could'nt get the wav to play with sound...no sound would come out?

A good oil is always recommended.As the noise is there with different oils you still may have an issue.

Get a large screw driver and place on the motor where you think the sound is coming from and your ear on the end, it works like a doctors thingy.

will help find the area the noise is from, be carfule as the motor is running and you may rip your ear off is you slip.lol

As far as the power goes try cleaning the aircleaner. AFM and T/B, also check the the temp sensors in a bucket of hot water with a muti meter.
Go over all plugs related to the ECU on the engine such as TPS etc with some good electrical cleaning solvent.

cuzman
08-06-2009, 03:44 PM
Well i got the file.

Sounds like a problem with the valve train.

pippy63
08-06-2009, 05:09 PM
The valve train, is this easy/expensive to fix? something I could do myself with the help of the workshop manual that I got from this site, I tried the screw driver trick before, but noise lasted only 15 secs, now it goes longer so I should be able to listen in a few more place before it stops.

One more thought, could, the noise possibly be related to the auto transmission, as I checked the fluid level this morning, alas it was cold, but dipstick had heaps of oil on it way pass the full mark. Does all the oil drain to the pan when sitting overnight? I don't know much about autos, but I would have thought some of the oil would remain inside unit?

Does the torque converter retain some oil? and the cold mark on dipstick is below the hot mark on dipstick, so why was my oil like well above the hot mark when cold? :confused::confused:

cuzman
08-06-2009, 05:47 PM
the auto must be checked warm, i cant remember the exaxt way at the moment. The car has to be running.

i'll have to look into the valve train setup as im not an expert on the 4 cylinder.

i have heard the 4 can make a bit of noise and still go for quite a while.

im sure some other members here will be able to help a bit more.

cuzman
09-06-2009, 02:16 PM
Had a think about the sound file, no conclusion. looks like your in the hands of your mechanic.

That noise could be the result of valve train or cam chain or the tensioner not working right. your mechanic was right at the start. with out pulling bits off its almost impossible to trace the problem.
Option A : just drive with the stereo on
Option B : If your handy check timing chain free play and move to valve clearance checking.
Option C : Just bite the bullet and get it fixed by the mechanic
Option D : Get a recoed motor installed by a reputable engine reco place for under $1000.00 plus labour depending on your skills.Not recommended.
Option E : Remove the head and have recoed for about 200-300 and reinstall. if you know how and use new timing chain and tensioner, plus head gasket.
All up the price on a new head job would be around 500+ any way but as yor moter has low k's it should be a good option

Any way thats my veiw

good luck.

PS mechanic can work faster than most home users and get the job done cheaper..so if you have a good honest mech go that way.

pippy63
09-06-2009, 03:18 PM
I'm going to put it up on some ramps this weekend and listen underneath the vehicle with screwdriver & try & pin point actually which side the noise is generating from , I cant pick up any unusual strange noise from placing screwdriver on top of motor and all around the areas under hood, sound must be generating from below somewhere which indicates what i thinking being hydraulic tensioner, taken its time to tension, it getting embarrassing in in the car park at work in the afternoon with this noise with everyone leaving ,I actual left work today 10 minutes late as nobody would be around to hear it.
I will try and find noise & I will take to one of the other mechs ,tell them were noise is( if I find it),leave car overnight so they can listen themselves ,get their diagnosis/quote and take it from there.

Thanks for you input cuzman ,I don't think I could tackle any of those mechanical options you mentioned, I had enough trouble getting those belts off/on, there's no room at all down the side of motor were timing chain is, so Ill leave it to the guys who do this all the time for a living if its not to expensive, thanks again.

cuzman
09-06-2009, 03:40 PM
yer good call sorry i couldn't help more.

Best of luck!