Hey guys,

Please keep the laughter to a miminum... I am in the market to replace the factory RF woofer in the Lancer. After having some decent woofers - Boston 12.5lf / G5, Hertz HXS300, Oz Audio Me 12.2 - I am somewhat not impressed :ninja:

Now the replacement woofer has to be a 10inch shallow mount as it is required to fit in the factory box, by orders of the boss and can not be mounted **** out. This means that it needs to be about 120mm deep max and suit a 0.75cuft sealed enclosure. Now I know I am not going to get similar performance to a G5 and co - but anything will be better. Power will be 300-400WRMS.

I have found the Pioneer TS-SW1041D, Polk MM1040 and Hertz ES250 that fit the bill. If anyone have has / listened to would love to hear your opinions. I can't get down to audition them so just thought I would ask. :D

Urgh.....shallow mount......

I cant vote on this, just blah....though, I'd go the polk (yes yes im a fan of polk gear now)....

That is what I was thinking to start with, just looked for other options and this was all I could find besides the Kicker but it needs a bigger box.

Never done shallow with a 10inch.... are well first time for everything.

You also have Soundstream which do shallow mounts, as do RF obviously.

Crap I'd nearly go with an 8" full depth sub, rather than shallow.

You need that sub Sam has.

You need that sub Sam has.

What one is that?

Hmmm was thinking of a Vibe Space 8 and making the box ported... but other than that, the Polk is the best looking spec wise... but we all know not to trust that to the letter.

I've heard those Pioneers in a few cars, none of them really impress greatly. They are quite boomy and seem to lack the responsiveness required for a fast beat. Would make a good sub for R&B, Hip Hop etc, but I haven't found them quick enough to handle the faster beats you find in trance, dance, some rock etc.

Can't comment on the other two, haven't heard them.


What one is that?
Sam (MGNTZD) is running a RE Audio XXX 15". No way in hell you'll fit that in the factory RF box! :bowrofl:

Edit: If you were to follow Ers idea of a 8" sub, you could look at something like a Utopia BE 21WX, pricey but a brilliant SQ sub, which is what I'm presuming your going for?

what has got you upset about the stock RF ??? I mean there an OK sub
I would save money and just leave it as is as the enclosures are tuned to suite that sub so I am not sure you would be gaining to much in changing just the sub alone...

I have to go with Hertz if anything..

I've heard those Pioneers in a few cars, none of them really impress greatly. They are quite boomy and seem to lack the responsiveness required for a fast beat. Would make a good sub for R&B, Hip Hop etc, but I haven't found them quick enough to handle the faster beats you find in trance, dance, some rock etc.

Can't comment on the other two, haven't heard them.


Sam (MGNTZD) is running a RE Audio XXX 15". No way in hell you'll fit that in the factory RF box! :bowrofl:

Edit: If you were to follow Ers idea of a 8" sub, you could look at something like a Utopia BE 21WX, pricey but a brilliant SQ sub, which is what I'm presuming your going for?

Yeah Pioneer are very open in terms of recommended box sizes. Of the 3 the pioneer is probably my least favorite.

Yeah I have a feeling that the XXX may no fit, only just. Don't think 400WRMS would even make that move either.

Am trying to keep the cost of the woofer under $300 - it's not a car I drive much.

what has got you upset about the stock RF ??? I mean there an OK sub
I would save money and just leave it as is as the enclosures are tuned to suite that sub so I am not sure you would be gaining to much in changing just the sub alone...

I have to go with Hertz if anything..

Umm the factory RF sub is crap. It is a series below their normal entry level so it is a dual 1.1ohm 75W ( max ) per coil - or of course 150W max. It has no excurison and can not keep up with the Boston SL-60's in the front - probably to do with the amp as well - but taking the chance to upgrade both sub and amp - which means the new woofer will have more power as well.

both the mm and hertz hammer with a decent amp, i'd suggest something at least double the rms of the sub, we have a demo car at work running the es250 off an EP1D hertz mono and the thing smashes

both the mm and hertz hammer with a decent amp, i'd suggest something at least double the rms of the sub, we have a demo car at work running the es250 off an EP1D hertz mono and the thing smashes

Yeah that was my intention with the DVC versions which have nominal power ratings of 270 and 250WRMS. I have got a 400WRMS mono lined up to run it. Thanks for the input!

Umm the factory RF sub is crap. It is a series below their normal entry level so it is a dual 1.1ohm 75W ( max ) per coil - or of course 150W max. It has no excurison and can not keep up with the Boston SL-60's in the front - probably to do with the amp as well - but taking the chance to upgrade both sub and amp - which means the new woofer will have more power as well.

Ah You didn't mention you had upgraded the fronts.... only your intentions on replacing the Sub.. So Yeah I will still say go the Hertz....

Ah You didn't mention you had upgraded the fronts.... only your intentions on replacing the Sub.. So Yeah I will still say go the Hertz....

Sorry yeah I was a little basic just to get sub ideas.

In minor detail:
Factory RF unit - will stay - will add Alpine EX-10 for Ipod as unit has RCA AUX inputs.
RF splits - Mids have been replaced with Boston Splits, added Boston tweeters in kicks, RF tweeters in A pillar
RF 8 ch amp - remains, 2ch for mids, 2ch for boston tweeters, 2ch for rear and RF tweeters ( wired in series - inline cap for RF tweeters ) 2ch for sub will cease to run sub and used as signal for new Sub amp which is likely to be a Pioneer GM-D7400 due to size, no remote turn on wire, efficiency, price.
RF coaxials rear doors - will remain, due to both these and tweeters actually being 2ohm, wired in series to match the Boston set so the amp will be more efficient with only having 4ohm loads. Being digital the output wont be much different either being around 35-45WRMS / ch @ 4ohm but high damping / efficiency.
Sub- as mentioned factory RF unit is 150W Max, time to go.

I am very restricted in what I can do due to the "boss"......

Well thats a pretty comprehensive Stock System to begin with Would love to see the Pics of the Factory Sub install

Yeah will have to take some ( been a bit lazy sorry lol ).

Ok so finally got a chance to install all the gear.

Now the Lancer runs:
Factory RF headunit
Boston SL60 Mids in deadened doors, dynazorb pads.
Boston tweeters in kicks
Factory RF tweeters in factory A pillar, inline cap added, wired in series with rears
Factory RF co-axials in rear doors
Factory RF 8 channel amp now running at 4ohm / channel for speakers.
Pioneer 7400 mono with signal input from sub channels of factory amp
Polk MM 1040 DVC woofer in factory box

Boston Xovers are mounted under the passenger seat next to the factory amp.

Sounds heaps better, very surprised with the output and rumble of the little 10. Added Polyfill in the box to attempt to lower the F3 a bit and hopefully the car response will do the rest but so far so good. Will be tuned up on Friday when I get a chance as have to test phase / gain / xover etc. Amp mount needs to be fixed but it does the stealth job for now. :D

Sub did not fit in the factory box due to a crap insert, added a 18mm MDF ring and fit no drama ( only really needed a 6-9mm but the factory grill wouldn't have fit anyways to tried to get a bit more volume out of the box! ). Sorry nothing was cleaned once I took the photos sorry, plus the silicone hadn't dryed clear yet lol. You get the idea though.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/4056/p1010145f.jpg
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/9479/p6130061.jpg
http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/4842/p8230211.jpg
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/4514/p5300034.jpg
http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/1989/p8230215.jpg
http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/2098/p8230217.jpg

Now that looks tidy... Just becareful of that exposed sub Cone with Objects in the boot

Nice work mate, looking tidy - love the rubber on the polk, looks damn nice :D

Yeah gunna do a tune, fix the amp mount and hopefully clean the car tomorrow. We shall see :D

Cone is very tough, checked that when I got it, if there are any problems ill invest in some towel racks lol.

... are you using speaker level input with electrical screw blocks into rca?:nuts:

A very useless post. Perhaps you should look at how the amp can receive a signal before posting. You will also notice the absence of a remote turn on wire and lack of hi level speaker inputs... starting to get the picture... Do some research before posting please.

Charisma!

Hows the sub going now mate?


... are you using speaker level input with electrical screw blocks into rca?:nuts:

a) Mr Charisma knows what he's doing.
b) its clean, it works

Charisma!

Hows the sub going now mate?



I walked away with a slight smile on my face. The woofer is really good. Not concerned about SPL which is ok, but it rumbles really nicely. Little slim has some balls I must admit. Very impressed for the $250 price tag.

Struck a problem, the factory amp as mentioned with the protect feature on the sub channels is not load rated but adjusted by volume as it is tied in with the Can-bus unit. This means that I still have the same problem ( sub doesn't get louder after X volume ). Amp uses only left and right speaker inputs from headunit which when not connected to the amp adjust normally via the volume knob. Once connected to the amp this is all bypassed in the Can bus so it is only full volume and the rest ( Volume / Fade / Sub control / Bass / Mid / Treble etc ) are all done via the amp.

So I am now thinking of just running my Audison for the front splits and the sub amp and sub. Wont have sub control but hey, may change the headunit or get the 3sixty or bitone :think:

It never ends....

You could have gotten a good sub-amp with the remote volume adjuster......

I hear focal have those :P

All those problems are reasons why I would not last 2 minutes doing an install and trying to intergrate it into the factory systems - makes my head hurt just thinking about it.

You could have gotten a good sub-amp with the remote volume adjuster......

I hear focal have those :P

All those problems are reasons why I would not last 2 minutes doing an install and trying to intergrate it into the factory systems - makes my head hurt just thinking about it.

Thought I wuld give it a go. I secretly ran all the wires as if to fail anyway so just need to find the time to hook it all back up lol . I wanted to put the Audison in from the start with some resistance from the boss, now I think ill just do it anyway as she has approved already of the woofer upgrade. :ninja:

... are you using speaker level input with electrical screw blocks into rca?:nuts:

I can see where sheep is comming from... to a novice going from High input to RCA may look a little odd but I too would have a Question of IS the High input is it higher then the Voltage the Amp can take on the RCA input line ???

I mean usually an Amp has High input and RCA input for a reason.. Tolerance of Voltage could be an issue in future ...

i would go the Polk MM 1040. good power output and overall looks great

I can see where sheep is comming from... to a novice going from High input to RCA may look a little odd but I too would have a Question of IS the High input is it higher then the Voltage the Amp can take on the RCA input line ???

I mean usually an Amp has High input and RCA input for a reason.. Tolerance of Voltage could be an issue in future ...

This is why I told him to do research before posting. The amp accepts both high and low level input - but there are no speaker inputs. This is because there is a switch near the RCA which alters the resistance. If you choose speaker input it uses 90kohm resistance where if you switch to RCA it uses 22kohm resistance. They supply the RCA cables you see in the picture.

Once on speaker input, the amp has an auto sensing on so hence the absence of a remote turn on wire with this set up. If you use normal RCA input the amp functions like a normal amp and needs a remote trigger.

Yes it is a bad idea to run high level speaker into normal RCA - but before posting perhaps people should ASK or check themselves before pointing the finger....

i would go the Polk MM 1040. good power output and overall looks great

Yeah went that way, waiting for everything to get run in properly before I post a decent review. So far so good though :D

Thats a Cool feature to have on an amp... handy too...

The amp accepts both high and low level input - but there are no speaker inputs. This is because there is a switch near the RCA which alters the resistance. If you choose speaker input it uses 90kohm resistance where if you switch to RCA it uses 22kohm resistance. They supply the RCA cables you see in the picture.

that wasnt the issue... heard of a soldering iron?

that wasnt the issue... heard of a soldering iron?

What's that? I have this solder stuff though....

Seriously dude, it's not fully fixed while I'm testing different inputs otherwise I would be cutting the barstard everytime I try something else....

The factory amp is gone, put an Audison in. Now I need to do more tuning dam it.

that wasnt the issue... heard of a soldering iron?

:iough:

If you can tell me what is technically wrong with how Charmisma has done his setup, then I'll give you a cookie.

Until then please refrain from well, being a douche.

:iough:

If you can tell me what is technically wrong with how Charmisma has done his setup, then I'll give you a cookie.

Until then please refrain from well, being a douche.

hold up.... im guessing you think scotch locks are ok then as well. im just saying for the audio "guru" on here i thought he must have done something a little more reliable

Yeah I have used those terminals for several easy removal purposes, never had a problem at all.

They are handy for 2 main things:

Tweeters mounted in kicks, when you need to take it out to access things, you would need to cut the wire everytime. Not good.

Removal of sub boxes - some need to be able to be taken out. If the speaker wire is the only wire to box ( i.e. you amp in not mounted on it ) I don't use the box terminals but rather drill a hole, feed the speaker wire through and silicone around. If it needs to be removed, ill add one of those connects. I have never had a problem with them in 7 years, why stop using them now??

I am not a guru.