I want to upgrade the front speakers in my new car (commodore). I recently went shopping with my mate to WOW, Autobarn ect to look for new speakers for his car. I found it extremely frustrating when asking the sales people to recommend a quality speaker with clarity in mind for a around $200 a find them instead recommend their most expensive set and go on to say everything else is rubbish.

Currently my car has only received a new head unit, this particular model for those playing at home (http://www.ryda.com.au/JVC-KD-R805-Car-MP3-Bluetooth-Ipod-Tuner-p/kdr805.htm).
Now to begin with I want to upgrade the fronts, then as money permits the rears and then a sub and amp later on.
In my magna I simply had 6inch 3 way pioneers in the front an similar 6x9 in the rears and found these suffcient. They went as loud as I would want to play without distortion, but if you did really crank them then you could tell they were limited. Later I added a fusion tube 12" Sub/Amp set up and it was much better than I expected.

Now my question is, when upgrading the fronts should I go splits or just a good set of coaxials?
My budget would be around $200, but if I can be convinced there is a benefit I could stretch to $300.
I listen to alot of rap/hip-hop/rnb and some techno and rock.
I have been told that i wont get alot of benefit out of splits unless I run an amp. Is this true?
Do all speakers benefit from an amp?

Sorry for the life story, feel free to post up some examples in that price bracket.

For me, I like splits, but I'm no expert.

Maybe speak with Joe. He's our Car Audio AMC Sponsor (Shopping Secure).
His threads are in the sponsor section... http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=75

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71806
http://www.shoppingsecure.com.au/

The speakers themselves aren't any different between coax/split setups.

The crossovers on the other hand are superior in a split configuration. They divide the frequencies appropriately and generally include a switch that allows you to vary the volume of the tweeter. For example, you can boost the tweeters output when you mount them in the kick panels, or dim them when mounted in the dash. Far more versatile, and that's where the sound quality is affected.

You will get a far better sound out of any speaker with an amplifier. The fact of the matter is your JVC is 400 retail, say 200 or so to manufacture and that cost needs to cover R&D, a CD mechanism, a radio tuner, an amplifier and manufacturing. Let's split the cost 5 ways for arguments sake and say $40 was spent on the internal amplifiers. Catch my drift?

As far as bang-for-buck speakers, you can't go past Kicker. On a scale of 10 I'd rate them 8 for volume and 7 for sound quality. Those scores can change depending on the tune I use :)

Hope all this helps.

What Model Commodore ??

Did a VR Recently with a set of Clarion Splits, Weren't to expensive either...
Biggest trouble is getting the rain protector off the Stock Door pods.. once they were gone 6.5 inchers bolted in nicely..

The only way I could recommend a set of Co-axials is if you can angle the Tweeter up towards the driver, as in mount the speakers on a slanted build out.. which takes
time and skill to get correct...
but if going under stock speaker covers and for the stealth look... a set of splits is the way to go ...

Your Deck will power the speakers sufficiently enough for every day listening but will benefit from an amp..

I run a set of splits in the magna straight off the deck..(CBF running wires everywhere) and yes, while an amp will make the sound louder and increase their frequency response , they sound just fine without one... No major drawback as I hardly have them above volume 20 on the deck anyway...

The speakers themselves aren't any different between coax/split setups.

The crossovers on the other hand are superior in a split configuration. They divide the frequencies appropriately and generally include a switch that allows you to vary the volume of the tweeter. For example, you can boost the tweeters output when you mount them in the kick panels, or dim them when mounted in the dash. Far more versatile, and that's where the sound quality is affected.

You will get a far better sound out of any speaker with an amplifier. The fact of the matter is your JVC is 400 retail, say 200 or so to manufacture and that cost needs to cover R&D, a CD mechanism, a radio tuner, an amplifier and manufacturing. Let's split the cost 5 ways for arguments sake and say $40 was spent on the internal amplifiers. Catch my drift?

As far as bang-for-buck speakers, you can't go past Kicker. On a scale of 10 I'd rate them 8 for volume and 7 for sound quality. Those scores can change depending on the tune I use :)

Hope all this helps.

Thanks for the reply mate, very helpful. As you suggested kicker would these be a suitable set http://www.ryda.com.au/Kicker-KS60-2-6-KS-Component-Speakers-p/ks602.htm and would these be ok to be run without an amp? Also if I go for an amp should I go for a two channel and just power the front?


What Model Commodore ??

Did a VR Recently with a set of Clarion Splits, Weren't to expensive either...
Biggest trouble is getting the rain protector off the Stock Door pods.. once they were gone 6.5 inchers bolted in nicely..

The only way I could recommend a set of Co-axials is if you can angle the Tweeter up towards the driver, as in mount the speakers on a slanted build out.. which takes
time and skill to get correct...
but if going under stock speaker covers and for the stealth look... a set of splits is the way to go ...

Your Deck will power the speakers sufficiently enough for every day listening but will benefit from an amp..

I run a set of splits in the magna straight off the deck..(CBF running wires everywhere) and yes, while an amp will make the sound louder and increase their frequency response , they sound just fine without one... No major drawback as I hardly have them above volume 20 on the deck anyway...

Its a 2001 VX HSV XU6, ive got a members ride thread for it there. I probably wont be installing these myself may get a friend or just pay depending, but if splits are fine without an amp to begin with il probably take that route.

The Kickers will run without an Amp but you wont be getting full Benefit from them... So I would run them off the Deck for now, but look at amping them up later...

Boston S60's are also in your $200 price range. Try to audition them before buying.

I would recommend spending the other $100 on Sound deadening to make them sound as good as possible.

As you suggested kicker would these be a suitable set http://www.ryda.com.au/Kicker-KS60-2-6-KS-Component-Speakers-p/ks602.htm and would these be ok to be run without an amp?

Exactly the ones I have.... I ran them without an amp for around a month...sounded fine but the amp really brought them to life. As I was mentioning with the cross overs, these ones allow adjustment in 6db increments (as in -6db, 0db, +6db) and also use far better quality components internally than you will find on any coaxial.

Here is a link to the amp I run them with - http://www.ryda.com.au/JVC-KS-AX3002-2-Channel-Amplifier-p/ksax3002.htm

being a vx they came factory with splits... just get a set with an rms value around 50-60wrms and they will run fine but then leaves room for a small amplifier in the future
my recomendation... Hertz deici series dsk165 http://www.hertzaudiovideo.com/default_en.htm
have put them into my parents car running off factory deck and it was such an improvement!

if you run high powered speakers off the deck you will ewnd up blowing them. It is more damaging to a speaker to under power them than over power. if you want to run for example 75Watt RMS speakers, you deck is probably putting out only about 8 RMS. If you thrash the speaker you will end up blowing the voice coil. Hence any good aftermarket speaker would benefit being amplified, for the sake of quality and life time.

if you run high powered speakers off the deck you will ewnd up blowing them. It is more damaging to a speaker to under power them than over power

Says who?

The potentially damaging distortion you hear when you 'pump' 8WRMS factory decks is coming from the amplifier being overdriven. Not the splits being unable to cope with the 'massive' power output...

Google electrical concepts 101 and come back.

I want to upgrade the front speakers in my new car (commodore). I recently went shopping with my mate to WOW, Autobarn ect to look for new speakers for his car. I found it extremely frustrating when asking the sales people to recommend a quality speaker with clarity in mind for a around $200 a find them instead recommend their most expensive set and go on to say everything else is rubbish.

Currently my car has only received a new head unit, this particular model for those playing at home (http://www.ryda.com.au/JVC-KD-R805-Car-MP3-Bluetooth-Ipod-Tuner-p/kdr805.htm).
Now to begin with I want to upgrade the fronts, then as money permits the rears and then a sub and amp later on.
In my magna I simply had 6inch 3 way pioneers in the front an similar 6x9 in the rears and found these suffcient. They went as loud as I would want to play without distortion, but if you did really crank them then you could tell they were limited. Later I added a fusion tube 12" Sub/Amp set up and it was much better than I expected.

Now my question is, when upgrading the fronts should I go splits or just a good set of coaxials? I say splits. Positioning the tweeter up high gives definite benefits to the clarity of the speaker.
My budget would be around $200, but if I can be convinced there is a benefit I could stretch to $300. If I were you I would skip the rears, put the money together, spend the $300 or even a little bit more on a set of splits (from my range I definitely suggest the AD6: http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73351) and still spend the $100 that Mr Charisma suggested on deadening.
I listen to alot of rap/hip-hop/rnb and some techno and rock.
I have been told that i wont get alot of benefit out of splits unless I run an amp. Is this true? Good quality splits such as my AD6s have a high sensitivity and thus have good midbass response and good volume even off factory head units. Amplified, however, the results are tremendous.
Do all speakers benefit from an amp? Yes

Sorry for the life story, feel free to post up some examples in that price bracket.

Here's a couple in the price bracket which I have gotten great feedback on but I would still just save a bit more and get the best up front since there wont be any regrets and you wont ever need to ask for more. Have a look at these as well:

http://www.shoppingsecure.com.au/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=4
http://www.shoppingsecure.com.au/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=77

Any questions? Just add me to MSN, reply here, or PM.

Says who?

The potentially damaging distortion you hear when you 'pump' 8WRMS factory decks is coming from the amplifier being overdriven. Not the splits being unable to cope with the 'massive' power output...

Google electrical concepts 101 and come back.

Says every car audio installer and company reps i've ever spoken to!

Go find another installer. Strathfield and Autobarn aren't installers, they are retailers and all they are doing is the hard sell.

Ok.. Lets settle down a little and look at things Technically..

Yes.. Underpowering a Speaker is a dangerous thing to do but... and here is the technicallity behind it..

A Clipped signal is what roasts coils..

So when you apply full bass boost or Full Bass enhancement on a factory deck with Moderate volume..The internal amp of the Head unit creates a Clipped signal..

Inlaymens terms it means your Headunits amplifier goes AAAAAAARRRRRGGGHHHH and then passes this signal onto your Speakers which in turn go ARRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH..

Now since there is little mechanical movement in an amp and is mostly electrical signals.. a clipped signal creates a DC or Direct current... this is bad Ju Ju.. This causes the thin wires in the voice coil to go POP.

So the way around getting a clipped signal is to use an amplifier which takes the original signal and boosts it.. but if you send a clipped signal through an Amp it is still gonna go pop..

So yes, you can run a set of Splits off a head unit without an Amp... but don't go using full bass boost and full volume...

Dial in enough Bass so the speakers do not distort and use a sensible enough amount of volume and you will be fine till you can get them amped up and re-adjusted so you can enjoy a fuller sound at a louder volume..
It also doesn't matter how much money you throw at a set of speakers, if they are poorly installed they will still sound crap...
A Decently installed set of Fusions will still sound better then a poorly installed set of Bostons...

It also doesn't matter how much money you throw at a set of speakers, if they are poorly installed they will still sound crap...
A Decently installed set of Fusions will still sound better then a poorly installed set of Bostons...

Never a truer word spoken.

Perhaps this is why I have never liked the way Alpine speakers sound lol....

Never a truer word spoken.

Perhaps this is why I have never liked the way Alpine speakers sound lol....

Yeah... I am not sure why, I also have never been an Alpine fan...

Go find another installer. Strathfield and Autobarn aren't installers, they are retailers and all they are doing is the hard sell.

Who said anything about strathfield, and mate, we dont have autobarn over here. I was talking about installers not retailers and when i said company reps i meant the reps from pioneer, clarion, soundstream, fusion, etc

Who said anything about strathfield, and mate, we dont have autobarn over here. I was talking about installers not retailers and when i said company reps i meant the reps from pioneer, clarion, soundstream, fusion, etc

As it has been explained already, the reason why they recommend you get an amp is so customers get to enjoy the full benefit of the maximum ability the speakers have...
It is not 100% essential to get an amp to power a set of splits..
Unlike a sub where an amp is essential..

Sure back in the day of 7x4Watt ( or 12W x2 if you bridged them) head units.. it was essential.. not now when decks have 52+w per channel.

Sure back in the day of 7x4Watt ( or 12W x2 if you bridged them) head units.. it was essential.. not now when decks have 52+w per channel.

You will probably find in most cases that the 52w x 4 is actually peak power not rms

You will probably find in most cases that the 52w x 4 is actually peak power not rms

yes but you mentioned about 8wrms...its more like 20-22wrms from the current mosfet amplifier moduals in most head units these days