Hi all,

Has anyone ever looked at putting Ralliart Magna Cams into a normal 3.5L ?
I know RPW sell stage 1 cams for $1100. But The Ralliart cams are half the price.

Firstly - Will they fit into the stock head?
Secondly - How much difference is there in terms of lift/duration between the Ralliart ones and the RPW Stage 1 cams.

Ralliart say there cams provide 10% more lift over the stock magna ones.

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Greetings All.

Definatly go the RPW ones. They are alot better then the ralliart ones. Sorry Dude.

Cheers,
--Tonba
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Yeah, the Ralliart ones aren't that great. Heard from an Adelaide tech once that they developed higher lift cams but the marketing people whinged about it not being as smooth as a normal Magna at idle so they toned it back. So, I think they could be 'Stage 0.5' when compared to Stage 1 RPW ones :nuts:

does anyone actually have stage 1 RPW cams in their cars? All this praising, but the only person ive seen use RPW cams has been Nick... And his experiences were less than desirable.

does anyone actually have stage 1 RPW cams in their cars? All this praising, but the only person ive seen use RPW cams has been Nick... And his experiences were less than desirable.
I know. Did he go for 1's or 2's? Actually, Velocity has 1's I think. He's impressed with them. Thing was that he got stage 1 heads too so I think Dave fitted everything and they just swapped the heads.

I know. Did he go for 1's or 2's? Actually, Velocity has 1's I think. He's impressed with them. Thing was that he got stage 1 heads too so I think Dave fitted everything and they just swapped the heads.


Nick got stage 1's at first.. then he decided he would go with Stage 2's after talking with Mitsiman about it.. He got the lot, cams, springs etc...

Had them professionally fitted.. twice..

Id have to get confirmation from the horses mouth about the cams.. Namely the people who have them as to how good they are and the gains from them. Theres alot of RPW fans and a lot of unhappy RPW customers..

At least with the Ralliart version you will beable to get a warranty with them that doesnt require you to send them back to WA if something is wrong with them. You can just go into a Mitsubishi dealer and have them look at any problems.

For what it's worth - Dave is running Stage 2 (turbo) cams in his car...

Id have to get confirmation from the horses mouth about the cams.. Namely the people who have them as to how good they are and the gains from them. Theres alot of RPW fans and a lot of unhappy RPW customers..

At least with the Ralliart version you will beable to get a warranty with them that doesnt require you to send them back to WA if something is wrong with them. You can just go into a Mitsubishi dealer and have them look at any problems.
Yeah, I'm aware of his dramas. Here's Velocity's post.

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6758

Risky-Rog here in WA had a set of ralliart cams fitted and he is really happy with the result. He had them fitted to a TJ Sports Triptronic and is amazed with the improvement in the 3-6 RPM band.

I can't really comment as i've never had any of this work done to any of my cars but with cams you have to ask yourself, what are you going to be using the car for, will it be smooth or a pig to drive, whats your fuel consumption going to be like.

But Ralliart do offer a good warranty with their cams and you can pretty much be assured a good fit. RPW's product, while expensive are still very good quality, I think nick was just unlucky :doubt:

Best of luck mate!

For what it's worth - Dave is running Stage 2 (turbo) cams in his car...

You cant compare Daves car to anyone elses..

Hes spent over 20grand on the engine alone.. Hardly what you would call a run of the mill daily driver like the other 98% of the user base here.

with the ralliart cams do you need to buy anything else, springs, lfters etc? or just the cams?

also where can i get them

i went to agostino at elizabeth and they are 245 each so thats is 490 the pair :D

i went to agostino at elizabeth and they are 245 each so thats is 490 the pair :D


For real? damn....

I think nick was just unlucky :doubt:
I think that was the case. From what I understand the design is good but a dodgy set managed to sneak through. I wonder if the Ralliart ones could be fitted to the 3.0?

I just rang Mitsu and that is definitly the price!

So how would these go with our stock ECU though???

Wonder how long it would take to fit them

im also interested if they fit a 3.0l or not

hhhmm

Trav

But you would probably want a chip tuned to take full advantage.

Yes i WANT a haltek.. $$$ is the only thing stopping me.. So the question really isnt whats best but what will technically work, you know what i mean?

I can't really comment as i've never had any of this work done to any of my cars but with cams you have to ask yourself, what are you going to be using the car for, will it be smooth or a pig to drive, whats your fuel consumption going to be like.

But Ralliart do offer a good warranty with their cams and you can pretty much be assured a good fit. RPW's product, while expensive are still very good quality, I think nick was just unlucky :doubt:

Best of luck mate!

Thanks for all the input guys,

I was thinking about the RPW stage one cams but i think they might be a bit big for what i want, this will still be my daily driver and want to keep fuel enonmy a good as possible, plus the bigger the cam the more you need an ECU upgrage to take agvantage of it.

Price & warranty is a big factor too :D

I can not believe the rallairt cams are that cheap :shock: im interested...
something to keep in mind is that they specifically tuned the engine not to be high revving to develop the extra power, many aftermarket cams shift the power curve up and its pointless when its rev-limited, also lose bottom end. if anyone here knows what the redline for the ralliart is and if power drops away before that point it would be helpful in deciding if they best for cars with stock revlimit at 6000rpm.

I have contacts with the ralliart cams, this month im organising the group buy of king springs, who would be interesting in ralliart cams next month? They are bloody good value for money!

Risky-Rog had his fitted with a stock sports ECU no problem at all, just need to have to dyno tuned but more power could be extracted with a greddy e-manage.

Im definatly going to get a pair in the next 2 months

A group buy....I wasn't planning cams....but maybe lol

Q1. Assuming I get a greddy as well, what effects is this going to have on fuel usage?
Q2. How much is installation expected to be? How many hours work?

so, will if fit a 3.0l

if so, these will be fitted to my car within the next month or two. and dynoed before and after. cant wait! doesnt everyone love cheap mods? lol

Trav

EOI cams! blake count me in for a set.
Can you ask risky-rog to come on and give us a run down on his experience? (if hes still about)
driver I don't know for sure but about a days work installing by a competent mechanic...... $400 - $600??? ( or else the haynes manual gives a good description on how to do it - up for the challenge? lol :cool: )

This sounds to good to be ture..........im going to get some in the next few weeks, would springs be changed as well? its just sounds too easy to get 180kw

can mitsubishi dealers do much tuneing with our stock ecu's?

if anyone here knows what the redline for the ralliart is and if power drops away before that point it would be helpful in deciding if they best for cars with stock revlimit at 6000rpm.

Power drops off after 6000rpm in the Ralliarts although they will rev higher. There's just not much to be gained by reving past 6000rpm though.


.

I know for a fact that these cams are designed to work with your factory ecu but your factory ecu needs to be retuned for them to work at their best. From what im told its a simple matter of having a dyno tune ($80-$120) and bingo bango your good to go.

They aren't designed for max power and won't deliver as much power as RPW's cams however from what I have seen in rogers (Risky-Rog's) there is zero loss to driveability and its just as silky smooth as it allways was :D But with the addition of some serious power in the 3-6K rev range, when you drive it you can really feel the things kick in! Rogers was auto so for those with manuals even better :thumbsup:

Although I wouldn't rush into cams if you haven't done the breathing mods first like airfilters, extractors, exhuast etc. I will probobly be getting a greddy e-manage and having it all tuned to work together nicely but this isn't required.

Hi guys.
Some 3.0 ppl were asking if the Ralliart Magna cams would fit in the 6G72.
This quote from Mitsiman should help...

"The cylidner heads between the 3.0 and 3.5 are exactly the same cylidner had.

The only difference is that the 3.0 camshafts run the same specs as teh 3.5 but here is the key thing

one of the camshafts has a different dowel pin and machined fitting on the back fo the camsahft for the distibutor compared to the 3.5 camshafts.

this is due to the height difference in teh engine block so if you do use 3.0 heads on teh 3.5 engine you need to use the 3.5 cams or alternativly if you use the 3.5 engin eblock and bolt on the 3.0 heads, you stil lneed to change the camshafts.

Also the intake manifold is different due to the large V pattern.

We found this out when we first started sending camshafts to the 3.0 boys in the galant / eclipse in the USA and had to return all of the camsahfts and make new specific 3.0 cams on one side with the fittings in a different position - literally 45 degrees difference only on the dowel pin and the distributor machined fitting angle on teh back of the camshaft."

http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3683&highlight=camshafts
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Does anyone know if it would be possible to modify the camshafts to fit the 3.0????

dyno and tuning of the stock ecu????????????????????????????????/

i thought that was impossible, if it can why on F#%K would u buy a aftermarket ECU, or the piggy back ECU

before ppl go off there heads i no athe advantages of a aftermarket ecu

also would like to no about the 3.0L cams

thanks

dyno and tuning of the stock ecu????????????????????????????????/
i thought that was impossible......

I very much belived the same thing. I thought the ecu was "un-tuneable" as it teaches itself when things change (like breathing etc.)

-Dan

The ECU is reprogrammable in a sence that the firmware/software can be upgraded.

I'd guess it's not tunable like a unichip/greddy, unless your mitsui engineering themselfs.

what software upgrades are there??????

where can the software be updated??

if software can be updated whats stopping us from changing the defualt vaules for fuel, air etc..

Sorry guys I phoned my source and your correct, whoever told me the magna ecu could be dynotuned was wrong. You can have your ECU remapped with new software and im still looking into who and where is the best place to do it. I know dealers just send them away to have it done but to who???

Anyone know this.

From what i've been told with these ralliart cams and the same ralliart software you pretty much earn ralliart status with the 180kw. Don't quote me on this as i really don't belive it myself just yet until i see it.

Remember the Ralliart has "ralliart" extractors in that 180kW figure too.

Yes true

And higher compression plus other internal upgrades.

but still the ralli cams should release a nice amount of poniees as they say

Hrm i might look into these as my next mod - especially since they sound like quite a reasonable price !
woo cant wait 4 group buy!

soooo? what needs to be done for these cams to be fitted to the 3L? parts, etc? extra costs?

Read the article entitled "interesting Magna article " in the General section. Apparently with the cams and extractors on a sports 3.5, you'd only be pushing 170kw.

170kw is a big gain for a 147kw TH though..........

Not to mention this is without any other major mods or computer modifications.. from 147 - 170 is quite impressive for a relatively small amount of money, and certainly a good base for improvement if you want to get an aftermarket ECU :)

mmmmmm :bowrofl:

Yeah but the Ralliart has higher compression too? How does that affect things????

yeah, that and the revised ECU probably make it up to the 180kw i guess

Well, the 180 came from exhaust, headers, ecu, cams and higher compression.

Also guys, if you are getting the Ralliart cams, make sure you get upgraded valve springs too. I read that MMAL shiped a few sets of cams to MMC in Japan for durability testing, and it was decided the stock valve springs wern't upto the job in the long run. :)

ok people,

I know we all want them, and they would provide a considerable amout of performance gain.

But my original problem stands, Are the Heads the on the TH/TJ 3.5L same as the Ralliart 3.5L heads so that the cams will slot right in?

No use us all dreaming about it if it can't be done. :nuts:

Im 99% sure the heads on the TH - TJ 3.5 Magna's are the same so installing them isn't a problem. Roger installed his into his TJ 3.5 Sports Triptronic without any problems at all.

As for valve springs, Im not sure if its neccessary but if you had the money id be tempted to do it.

They were the same heads but they've been ported or at least had some work done to them. Either way, they're not identical anymore. But as Blake said, they would fit.

if there r goging to be problems with vavle springs they should be done at the smae time

i got a quick quote for fitment of around $1000.00+

just for seals and oild etc.. about $400.00 and the rest in labour

They were the same heads but they've been ported or at least had some work done to them. Either way, they're not identical anymore. But as Blake said, they would fit.

all they did was like a grind of the area around the valves to increase gas velocity at low cam lift, the heads already flow well so dont need porting to increase gas volumes. (i read about it in Motor)

Yeah, that's what it was. That article on autospeed also outlines something like this.