I'm thinking of getting Bendix Advanced for my DBA slotted rotors? Has anyone used this pad?

Cheers,
Kim

Check my MOGWA post

I have them currently. Braking is much softer with those pads and takes helluva hammering to bring them to ABS stage. As in - way much better than STD pads. They dust a bit tho, but....
I have used Bendix pads for the last 15-20 yrs.


I'm thinking of getting Bendix Advanced for my DBA slotted rotors? Has anyone used this pad?

Cheers,
Kim

i've got DBA slotted with Bendix advanced pads, my style of braking needs performax, my dba slotted is warped slightly. Otherwise, if you're not pushing your car very much, it's a good combo for average to hard driving. It is VERY DUSTY!

BTW discs only do 2 things - wear, rust, and crack; they don't warp. Brake shudder is caused by excessive lateral runout which is the uneven deposit of brakepad/disc interface layer. Simple way to avoid it is to cool down the brakes by coasting instead of sitting still with the brakes in the same position whether they are applied or not. Also avoid light braking whenever possible, medium-firm pedal pressure is best.

if they have metal i nthem i wont use them i rather use an organic pad

if they have metal i nthem i wont use them i rather use an organic pad

The problem with organic pads is that their heat handling is extremely poor... Hi-po street pads are often kevlar based, with track use pads being ceramic based. Organic pads would give you nice flames out of the wheel arches when driven hard. The only thing going for them is that they are relatively quiet, cost small change, and last forever in everyday driving.

Are the Advanced better than the ultimate? How much for the advanced?

Look at http://www.bendix.com.au for heat ratings on all of their pads. Ultimate is the highest performance pad but not available for all models, think you can get for the Gen3 but not Gen2... From memory from coldest to hottest: Standard, Premium, Metal King, 4WD, Advance, Performax, Ultimate.

On the Bendix website they promote the Advanced Pad as being "low dust"... but by the sounds of it they are actually very dusty?

Has anyone used Premium (not sure if this is out for 2nd gen models?) or 4WD bendix? DBA said customers that had used 4WD bendix pads were impressed.

Killer: when you say it takes a hammering to bring them to ABS stage, do you mean it doesnt stop as quick? (so no chance of skidding)? Is this a good thing?

Cheers,
Kim

BTW discs only do 2 things - wear, rust, and crack; they don't warp.

Accually Discs can warp. My mate fitted DBA slotted rottors to his VN, and we put the old discs on those machines used when machining the disc surface, and you could visually see the disc wobling/vibrating lol .

But yes in most cases brake shudder isn't caused by accul warping of the disc, this is only in extreem cases.

I've used the 4WD and they were good for everyday driving but I smoked them every weekend, so went to Performax which can handle another 40-50degC from memory. I have smoked the Performax only once and that was stuck behind a slowpoke in the mountains. When I go to the track I'll probably fit a pair of EBC Greenstuff.

Hay, im using them at the moment, i like them because there quiet

It's a very good thing. The std or any other cheap metal pads tend to be more like on/off in their braking performance. Hence, there is not much adjusting one can do, they very easily reach the lock-up stage and then the ABS starts to kick in.
Bendix's (generally) are softer and require more effort to reach the lock-up stage, so there is more friction to play with. This doesn't mean that one has to stand on the brake pedal, tho. :D
This is quite difficult to explain briefly, but it's all based on "rolling vs sliding friction"
Perhaps somebody with better technical english skills than me could bring out the scientific meaning behind this...
Very similar matter to comparing std vs large brake rotors. Takes more effort to lock, them, but de-acceleration is better. Of course, locking brakes/wheels is always undesireable!


Killer: when you say it takes a hammering to bring them to ABS stage, do you mean it doesnt stop as quick? (so no chance of skidding)? Is this a good thing?
Cheers,
Kim

Very similar matter to comparing std vs large brake rotors. Takes more effort to lock, them, but de-acceleration is better. Of course, locking brakes/wheels is always undesireable!

Basically, if you go bigger pads, you MUST have more piston calipers else you lose pressure in the lines and hence less friction on the pads, BUT, the pistons on these calipers must be small else you will have to change the booster as well.

Locking wheels involve the type of tyre you have as well, so it's not as simple as just the brake package.

Have changed my pads from standards to Bendix ultimates. Best thing since sliced bread. They are quiet, feel great, bite a lot better there for not having to push the brake pedal as much. Have hammered the brakes a few times from high speeds and there is no fading at all. I warped the discs a few times with standard pads from high speed braking i guess because of the heat. Machined the discs, put the ultimates on and have hammered them heaps and no more warping.
They give off a little dust. After a week or so of normal driving your rims start to go black. Small price to pay for great breaks.

Ultimates arnt even that expensive. Paid about $110 for the fronts and $90 for the rears.

Being able to lock the brakes up, or activate the ABS (if so equipped) is a sign of good brakes, not the other way around. And the way to modulate brake pressure is by varying the pressure on the pedal!! Brake pads don't roll, they slide. Only wheels and bearings roll.

Generally when moving to bigger calipers you should upgrade the master cylinder however it is not always necessary unless you are changing to one with more pistons. Also, simply putting in a bigger pad into standard calipers is unlikely to improve braking as there is still the same amount of pressure exerted by the pistons. The biggest advantage though is increased heat dissipation as you now have a greater surface area upon which the force is distributed upon.

Hmmm... might give the Advanced a go I guess... will see how they hold up. I presume I'm running standard at the moment, so as long as its better than that.

i used to run bendix ultimates in my ts, they were an awsome pad, hardly any dust, last for ages compared to standard repco cheapies (i get only 2-3 months out of cheapies) :D

True. But in this case the only variable was the pads, hence it's acceptable comparison.
Obviously the better the tyres the larger the de-acceleration g-forces are before locking the wheels. Even if one has ABS.
BTW - did you guys know that when F1 car lifts off the gas pedal, the engine braking g-force is ~ 2 g's. Pretty sick stuff considering, that when we do full-on-hit-the-anchors-panic-braking, we reach roughly one g of de-acceleration.


Locking wheels involve the type of tyre you have as well, so it's not as simple as just the brake package.

BTW discs only do 2 things - wear, rust, and crack; they don't warp. Brake shudder is caused by excessive lateral runout which is the uneven deposit of brakepad/disc interface layer. Simple way to avoid it is to cool down the brakes by coasting instead of sitting still with the brakes in the same position whether they are applied or not. Also avoid light braking whenever possible, medium-firm pedal pressure is best.

thats fine to prevent shudder setting in after the hard drive and cooling down, but wont prevent it in hard charging from apex to apex or pulling up in a hurry from high speed especially downhill, the only answer then is better brakes.

when i first got my car the cheapo stock pads soon glazed up even with heaps of pad left, because i live at the top of a big steep hill and every time going down u must use the brakes and theres no opportunity for coasting to cool down, u have to stop hard at an intersection at the bottom. I threw out the stock pads, got bendix performance pads and after a year they are fine. they are definitely an improvement, but still dont compensate for the puny little discs on the 3rd gens enough to say they are now good brakes.

Hmmmm - consider two metal surfaces rubbing against each other. They slide happily until they are subjected to very large force, pressing them against each other in increasing amount. Eventually they reach stopping stage and stop sliding, but very suddenly.
Now, replace the other metal part with something, which has different frictional properties, like something "softer". The sliding movement will decrease progressively, not suddenly and will eventually stop as in the previous example.
This is what happens with brake pads and disks. Let’s ignore ABS for now.
Hard pads have less control between 0 and full lock, due to their frictional properties.
Where as the soft pads provide much more gradual de-acceleration, before they lock, if sufficient force is applied to the brake pedal.
So, in real life the braking process is somewhat different when using pads with very different features. Cheap, hard “metal” pads don’t de-accelerate well, they go from minor action to full lock very easily. And how was the difference between rolling and sliding friction again? Correct, locked (sliding) wheels provide less friction than rolling (unlocked) wheels. Hence the stopping takes longer when wheels are locked – and that’s what happens more so with cheap pads, they lock easily. Locking the brakes/wheels is not good. That’s why humans invented ABS.
Soft pads can be managed easier and they don’t tend to lock that easily, but of course will lock the wheels eventually. And because their friction factor is higher than “metal” pads, they actually de-accelerate more through the whole braking process. When wheels are locked it doesn’t matter what pads one have, they are locked and that’s it.

True what you say that braking force is applied with pressing the pedal – you are stating something so obvious that I took it as a sarcastic joke. I like them my self….
And brake pads don’t actually slide, they are solidly fixed to the calliper and the disk rotates in between….
What comes to ball bearings not sliding but rolling is new to me, never heard that before! :confused:

I haven’t bothered to conduct very scientific tests with pedal pressing force vs de-acceleration my self. I only speak of experience of driving and wheeling for 26 yrs and having some basic knowledge of how grass grows.

Geesh, all this where we could have just said to the dude: “Good, buy them, they’re the best!”

I’m going out for lunch now, byeee. :cool:




Being able to lock the brakes up, or activate the ABS (if so equipped) is a sign of good brakes, not the other way around. And the way to modulate brake pressure is by varying the pressure on the pedal!! Brake pads don't roll, they slide. Only wheels and bearings roll.

agree with tek, locking up earlier means brakes are better/stronger, they have more bite. its up to you or the abs to modulate the pressure.

if metal pads can lock the wheels sooner as you say, then they are ultimately better. apart from kevlar pads which i havent used, metals can handle a lot more heat. They dont work well and are scratchy sounding before they are heated up, but will pull up sooner and more times without shudder, soft pads on the other hand work better when relatively cool like in normal traffic but will fry and give up a lot sooner when the heat is on.
problem with metals is they need hard pressure and sound scratchy when normal driving, also chew up the discs quickly.

Turn left a bit - you guys are stuck in a roundabout now. :shock:

If you prefer hard brake pads to soft ones, you obviously then keep using them. Just makes me wonder why were those soft pads ever designed if they are so bad that they don't lock the wheels, as some ppl seem to prefer pads to do. :confused:
In the meanwhile, I and many other ppl keep using Bendix Advance or similar soft pads for many good reasons. :rant:
I think it's Beer O'clock now?

I think it's Beer O'clock now?

Tell my boss that? lol

Tell my boss that? lol

Hahah my boss went home, I'm already having a beer at work :thumbsup: