ok got my tj done 130kms i the past few weeks had to top up oil
last week i topped up did a 400km highway run an had used a litre of oil

today as i was stuck in trafic, i noticed smoke coming out the exhaust by the time i got home the smoke had stopped
i pulled a spark plug out has oil on it
tube seals have been done so not from this
how do i work out what it is do i need to take rocker off ?
im thinking valve seals?
rings?

If its chugging blue smoke then its most likely the two things you mentioned. Valve stem seals was a common failure point in the old 12v 6g72, but i believe the design in the 74 was better and the stem seals unlikely to harden over time. If its piston rings then expect $$$.

Actuallt what oil weight are you using?

TJs should not have valve stem issues.

The bluish smoke only come when you let the engine sit idle. leave the car switched on for a minute or two and you will see it return.

If you have been hard on the car with bad engine oil and/or without warming to operating temp, fear the piston rings as the problem.

i use magnatec 10w 40
same as my other car it is the first of the tjs aug 2000
when i got this car a year ago it had been sitting in a garage for about 2 years car was all good for the last year only in the last 2 months started using oil i also change every 5000kms well i dont need to at the mo as it is using it

ok left it running for 2 min this is what is happening

http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/1336/dscf3439q.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/696/dscf3439q.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/5955/dscf3437i.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/198/dscf3437i.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)
http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/8576/dscf3438e.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/802/dscf3438e.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

Was the exhaust fume smelling bad?

By looking at the photos, it is actually hard to tell wheather it smoke from burning oil or water vapour from a cold engine.

I dont know about Castrol magnatec but i hear some bad reviews about them. Anyhoo, have you any teenagers thrashing this car?

its smoke not water been raining on the ground not smelling bad no im the only one that uses this car
just trying to get a answer what it might be weighing up selling repairing or relpacing motor
this car ive been setting up for towing the caravan has not done one trip yet
have spent a bit on seals,belts,380 brakes, new shocks etc

when i got this car a year ago it had been sitting in a garage for about 2 years.

There's your answer. Valve stem seals are known for drying out and hardening when a car sits around for a long time. It could have been avoided if the previous non-driving owner had started the car on a weekly basis. Too late now, once hardened they wear out quick. Needs fixing. Check for threads where people have had the same problem.

My TJ is at 115,000 km and sat around for 9 months a year ago. I expect the same problem to crop up eventually. Heads off, valves out, check everything, reassemble. Time consuming job, but do-able by a novice back yarder such as myself. Cost is at minimum a new top end gasket set, but costs increase if machine shop work is required to resurface the heads, recut valve seats, etc and labour costs if other people's hands do the work.

If its blue smoke in the pics from a warm engine, it's definitely oil but it's still ok to drive the car. (Stuffed rings will show up with a hot engine under load - blip the throttle hard a few times with the engine hot and showing a smokey idle - if the smoke gets worse it's rings, if it goes away its valve stem seals.)
I've seen plenty of second genners trailing the same wherever they go. lol Keep an eye on the oil level though.

Second hand engine - if you buy one, don't get one from a wreck that has been sitting around for a long time - you will just get the same problem.

It is stem seals, Max, on a second gen yes they are known to do this but this is a third gen.....

I have seen a few high mileage third gens to this but have also seen some lower mileage ones using Magnatec oil do this, one in particular with only 140k on it was doing the same thing, we gave it a good engine flush and then used Penrite, 95% of this smoke stopped as did most of the oil consumption

The tube seals will not cause excessive oil useage unles they are so bad they are leaking out of the plug tubes over the top of the motor. The leaking tube seals also will not cause smoke.

I would get some of the Wynns Oil System cleaner, the good workshop grade stuff, and then put it in, idle the engine at least 30 mins (DONT DRIVE IT) and then give it a good hot drain, put some HPR10 in and see how that pans out

thanks for that ill give it a go and see what happens i still got that engine flush mitsi stuff you sent would that be good or still for for the wynns stuff if i can get it

It is stem seals, Max, on a second gen yes they are known to do this but this is a third gen.....

I have seen a few high mileage third gens to this but have also seen some lower mileage ones using Magnatec oil do this, one in particular with only 140k on it was doing the same thing, we gave it a good engine flush and then used Penrite, 95% of this smoke stopped as did most of the oil consumption

The tube seals will not cause excessive oil useage unles they are so bad they are leaking out of the plug tubes over the top of the motor. The leaking tube seals also will not cause smoke.

I would get some of the Wynns Oil System cleaner, the good workshop grade stuff, and then put it in, idle the engine at least 30 mins (DONT DRIVE IT) and then give it a good hot drain, put some HPR10 in and see how that pans out

I must admit a third gen smoker I haven't seen, but I will be keeping an eye out. lol
Good advice there. Flush it and try a better oil. Magnatec seems to be . . . . not too good.

It is a crud oil. Penrite FTW

well got the oil will flush out tonight and put in penrite HPR10
so tommorrow arvo ill keep my fingers crossed

as i siad once you are driving is good no smoke,when stationary for 2 min take off get smoke for a little while
if it doesnt work not really wanting to spend money on car, as this is my second car and at the end of the day i really need a rear wheel or 4x4 to tow caravan.
would be a shame as this car has complete log books to 110kms i got this car at 115km and now done 130kms

Would it be worth trying one of the stop-leak products that you add to the oil? It might rejuvenate the seals and make them swell a bit.

If anyone remembers my 2nd gen at tailem bend at MMX, that had magnatec in it at the time. Also after a few thousand kms the startup smoke seemed to suddenly get really bad and the oil used up faster, like the oil suddenly thinned out.

If anyone remembers my 2nd gen at tailem bend at MMX, that had magnatec in it at the time. Also after a few thousand kms the startup smoke seemed to suddenly get really bad and the oil used up faster, like the oil suddenly thinned out.

I never tried Magnatec - from that post, I think I never will. lol There was a mobil Super oil (20W-50) years ago that was supposed to be good for 20,000 km, trouble was it went real thick after a while and fuel consumption suffered. Additive package to the base oil was poor, sounds like Magnatec has a similar problem. (I could be wrong though)

Some oils in high end euros have known to go 30,000-40,000kms without change, and after being sampled they have almost the same viscosity and chemical make up as when it was fresh

Respectfully, I disagree with some of the discussion on here.

I used GTX3 and then Magnatec (changed every 5000k) in my Toyota Camry SV21 from 120,000k when I bought it - until I got rid of it with 300,000k on it. It did not smoke or use oil - and that engine was notorious for valve stem seals causing smoking. I don't believe all the bad things people on this forum say about Castrol. My Mitsubishi dealer uses it. Why would they warrant an engine and drivetrain to 10 years, and then use a s*** oil in their service department? I'd much rather regularly replace Castol Magnatec every 5000k in my third gen and my 380, then change a semi-syn every 10,000k or a fully syn every 15,000k.

It absolutely sounds like stem seals to me, because you said it gets worse if the car sits and idles for a while. But the very high consumption doesn't make sense - stem seals don't generally cause large oil consumption like the 1L/400km you describe. So it may in fact be both - rings and stem seals.

I absolutely guarantee changing oil will not fix your problems. It might reduce it slightly in the short term, but the problem will remain and will eventually return.

The cause - definitely the car sitting for 2 years is probably the main culprit. The service history before then also is important - was it serviced regularly by the original owner?

As for storing the engine for 2 years - I guarantee you have some rust damage. And you just can't get someone to start the car once a week/fortnight/month and let it idle for a while. You really need the car started and DRIVEN. Driving it actually works the engine and most importantly will actually allow the engine/exhaust to get warm enough to evaporate moisture and prevent rust. There are a lot of online articles about engine storage for aviation piston engines (as they are much more likely to sit unused for long periods of time). The principles are the same - you need to start them, and when you do you have to run them hard, and you have to change the oil regularly.

Good points. Unfortunately the average car owner who stops using the car for 2 years doesn't have the understanding or motivation to warm up the car regularly with a 10 to 20 km drive and change the oil on a time basis. It probably sat there with dirty oil in it while it dawned on the owner that he had no further use for the car and decided to sell it. Hardened valve stem seals, and rusted bores leading to shattered compression/oil rings and scored bores can be the result. If the oil burning gets worse the engine might need to be opened up to see what is going on. Here's hoping an oil change improves the problem.

ha i was going to say before i red further down the posts, that "theres your problem" with you using magatec

Valve stem seals seem to be common to go on third gens around the 300,000 mark. My old 3lt and a couple of mates cars all went around this time.

I have an old 4wd that tends to burn a bit of oil. I used to run it on Penrite 20w-50 and it went through a lot of oil, say 1L per 1000km. Then I changed to GTX (same grade) which improved the situation a bit. Just recently I put Magnatec 10w-40 in there and it is hardly using any oil now even though it is thinner. Now I don't have to top it up every 2 weeks. Fuel consumption appears to be down as well.

I had Penrite HPR10 in my Magna. Over 12,500km it consumed nearly 1L of oil, this is the first time it had ever used any oil. I changed it out for Magnatec and all seems well. Fuel consumption also went down after changing.

well i changed the oil and yes most of the smoke has gone will know in a couple of days if this has worked to see if it is drinking the oil

My TJ Magna seems to have this problem now. Only done 170K, but the exhaust is smokey if revved after it sits and idles for a little while. How did it go, Robceline ???

This is a 4 year old thread so these members may no longer be here.
There are quite a few threads on valve stem seals if you want to search and have a read through them.

My car also burned oil at a rate of 500ml per 1,000km.
If idled for long and stabbed on the throttle it would smoke.
At 194,000km I changed the valve stem seals DIY and so far at 210,000km it hasn't used a drop of oil.
The seals themselves were $50. But it took me many many hours to do

@Spetz,

I can't remember seeing it finished (I can only remember discussing it), so if you have time
can you please post an update as to how you did this and what tools you used etc.....
in the appropriate thread of course.

Thanks.

This is a 4 year old thread so these members may no longer be here.
There are quite a few threads on valve stem seals if you want to search and have a read through them.

My car also burned oil at a rate of 500ml per 1,000km.
If idled for long and stabbed on the throttle it would smoke.
At 194,000km I changed the valve stem seals DIY and so far at 210,000km it hasn't used a drop of oil.
The seals themselves were $50. But it took me many many hours to do

refreshing news as I suspect i have the same issue, would also like to know how you went about it. I've read of compressed air, rope in the pot and also seen a youtube on a tool that is magnetised. basically a short swift hit compresses the spring the magnet grabs the collets, flip the tool around and the other end is used for inserting them back. maybe that and pressurising the cylinder with air would work.

http://cdn2.bigcommerce.com/server4900/f4083/products/9906/images/59858/LIS-36200__79713.1372348144.1280.1280.jpg?c=2

I trust the old way of head removal, just don't trust myself keeping the heads on, I can just see me losing a valve inside.

I used the rope in the cylinder method and it worked really well for me. Just feed it at BDC and then spin the motor a bit by hand until it compresses the rope.

That magnetic tool is ok for removing them but it does not work for reinstalling them.
I compressed the springs in a G clamp and used some very thin metal zip ties to keep the spring compressed. Once fitted back with the collets and retainer in place, I used a screwdriver to spin and hence rip the metal zip tie off. It was an arduous process but it worked.

I used glad wrap everywhere except the valve I was working on each time to minimize risk of losing anything and/or contaminates. Obviously do an oil change soon after too.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring1_zpsaexlv2dn.jpg


http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring2_zpsawxcscnx.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring3_zps2rrhlela.jpg


http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring4_zps5foqa2yo.jpg

I used the rope in the cylinder method and it worked really well for me. Just feed it at BDC and then spin the motor a bit by hand until it compresses the rope.

That magnetic tool is ok for removing them but it does not work for reinstalling them.
I compressed the springs in a G clamp and used some very thin metal zip ties to keep the spring compressed. Once fitted back with the collets and retainer in place, I used a screwdriver to spin and hence rip the metal zip tie off. It was an arduous process but it worked.

I used glad wrap everywhere except the valve I was working on each time to minimize risk of losing anything and/or contaminates. Obviously do an oil change soon after too.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring1_zpsaexlv2dn.jpg


http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring2_zpsawxcscnx.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring3_zps2rrhlela.jpg


http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/spetz83/Valve%20spring4_zps5foqa2yo.jpg

so how did you compress the springs at the start though to get the collets out?

I used that magnetic tool that you had pictured in the post above.
If you want/need it make me an offer for it as I no longer have a use for it