Hi all, I was wanting to replace the front lower control arm bushes in my KH Verada, anyone have any ideas on the best ones to get to improve handling? cheers

if there shagged the rubber one will improve the handling that you have now or you could go the nolathane route they are a little harsher on the ride but at the same time improve the spirited driving lol.

if there shagged the rubber one will improve the handling that you have now or you could go the nolathane route they are a little harsher on the ride but at the same time improve the spirited driving lol.

Ok cool, thanks for your reply, the cars done 227,000 k's so i guess they would be passed their used by date, but I haven't removed them yet so I'm not sure how bad they are but the car pulls to the left and has uneven wear on the left tyre on the outer edge and I had a wheel alignment done 6 mnths ago when I had new tyres fitted, the car feels a little all over the place on the road. cheers

There is a good reason that car makers as well as most of the competition cars use rubber, because it works like it is designed to

Rubber is more expensive to make but especially for the lower control arm bushes they need to be pinned correctly which neither poly or nolothane bushes allow

How hard is it to replace these bushes? Mine were torn when the driveshafts were removed. I needed to use a balljoint seperator to get the lower control arms dislodged. I've used a bit of rubber cement and it sealed up the tears well but I suspect its only going to last for so long.

There is a good reason that car makers as well as most of the competition cars use rubber, because it works like it is designed to

While that is true, that doesn't always mean rubber is going to handle better.

Rubber is designed to soften the impact on other suspension components, reduce noise, and maintain ride quality (This is how this car is designed - a comfortable cruiser).

Polyurathane ignore ride quality, noise, and does not soften impact as much, this results in better handling but at a price.

To the OP - The choice is yours, what do you want out of your car? Do you want a rough, loud, tight car? Or do you want to maintain a comfortable stock feeling?

Same goes for Poly engine mounts, anybody with them fitted will tell you how harsh they are in comparison to stock (forces normally absorbed by the mount are instead transferred do the rails), however it does give a more planted feel whilst adjusting throttle, shifting, and transbraking as the engine roll is reduced.

Now some warnings... If you do lower bushes, you're going to have to do upper bushes or you'll obliterate them as forces will be transferred to the next weakest component.

Check nolethane's website for what is available for the Magna.

A reasonable assumption there. It is not going to last long. Plus these things were absolutely shocking to pull off. Personal experience anyway

Ok cool, thanks for your reply, the cars done 227,000 k's so i guess they would be passed their used by date, but I haven't removed them yet so I'm not sure how bad they are but the car pulls to the left and has uneven wear on the left tyre on the outer edge and I had a wheel alignment done 6 mnths ago when I had new tyres fitted, the car feels a little all over the place on the road. cheers

They may be gone but I'd be checking your wheel alignment first.

6 months can be a long time between alignments, depending on how many kms you've driven & the road surfaces that you travel. The original alignment may not have been very good either, in fact it sounds like it wasn't.

There's a fair few magna's that pull to the left, which is why Nolothane & Superpro make poly kits for the lower control arm: usually offset passenger & standard driver. I have the Superpro kit in my wagon & I don't find it too harsh or noisy. You can also just get standard poly bushes with no caster added if you find that your alignment is out, rather than worn bushes being the cause.

Using poly bushes alone to improve handling isn't worthwhile IMHO, good suspension components & regular wheel alignments are more important. What do you mean exactly - "to improve handling"? What part of your ride is needing improvement?

I have had several personal experiences with poly bushes and they don't improve handling. It is a myth

One car not a magna gained almost a second on a track going back to rubber bushes. My own verada I put these in because I was too cheap to get rubber and it handled like a pig until I forked out for all new rubber bushes and never looked back lol

The Nolothane makers will tell you otherwise but in many personal experiences for both mitsu and Mazda has shown me otherwise. They are also noisy after a while especially on lower arms as rubber are bonded to the crush pins where poly pivot and wear on the pins

Poly bushes alone won't improve handling, that's true. Adding caster to the front will improve steering however & that would be the only reason that I could see for replacing these particular bushes in question with poly.

To replace the standard rubber with standard poly would be just taking the bad, (noise, harshness, etc) with no positive gain.

They may be gone but I'd be checking your wheel alignment first.

6 months can be a long time between alignments, depending on how many kms you've driven & the road surfaces that you travel. The original alignment may not have been very good either, in fact it sounds like it wasn't.

There's a fair few magna's that pull to the left, which is why Nolothane & Superpro make poly kits for the lower control arm: usually offset passenger & standard driver. I have the Superpro kit in my wagon & I don't find it too harsh or noisy. You can also just get standard poly bushes with no caster added if you find that your alignment is out, rather than worn bushes being the cause.

Using poly bushes alone to improve handling isn't worthwhile IMHO, good suspension components & regular wheel alignments are more important. What do you mean exactly - "to improve handling"? What part of your ride is needing improvement?

I seen those offset bushes for the passenger side, so adding caster to just the left side what does that do? make the car drive more straight with more feel in the steering? as thats what I meant by improving the handling, so sorry I guess I used the wrong words, I want my car to have a better feel on centre as it feels like your always correcting it and it feels a little wondery, and feels as though you don't have total control over it, I have read the TL/TW steering rack helps this so i was thinking of that option too. Just wondering can you buy exchange lower control arms with new bushes and a new balljoint?

If you've got the $$, get the upgraded rack & a good alignment first. If the car is still pulling to the left, (or right), then look at your other options. The later model rack won't stop the car 'wandering', that's either caused by worn components or a bad alignment - or both.

I have read this thread to date with some interest, especially comments regarding rubber vs polyurethane bushes.

Now mycomments are :-
1) light / oversensitive steering in the straight ahead position.
2 reasons. First rack assistance. A late model rack should fix this
Second is suspension geometry. This is where aftermarket bushes that increase caster will help. Been there, done that on my car, and yesthey do work. Offest bushes need to besecured, this is what loctite is for!

2) Pull to the left. Roads have camber to the left, car naturally wants to go "down the hill" so willpull to the left. Problem is well known in the suspension business, that is why replacement kits are offered that have increased camber for the nearside andno change for the offside.
On my AWD i opted for increased caster on both sides to generally improve the steering performance, I had some other tricks done to increase the nearside caster. Result is a car that generally tracks straight, and no longer scrubs the LHF tyre outer shoulder at a crazy rate. With other suspension mods i have nearly doubled my tyre life and have much better handling.

Gerry

I have read this thread to date with some interest, especially comments regarding rubber vs polyurethane bushes.

Now mycomments are :-
1) light / oversensitive steering in the straight ahead position.
2 reasons. First rack assistance. A late model rack should fix this
Second is suspension geometry. This is where aftermarket bushes that increase caster will help. Been there, done that on my car, and yesthey do work. Offest bushes need to besecured, this is what loctite is for!

2) Pull to the left. Roads have camber to the left, car naturally wants to go "down the hill" so willpull to the left. Problem is well known in the suspension business, that is why replacement kits are offered that have increased camber for the nearside andno change for the offside.
On my AWD i opted for increased caster on both sides to generally improve the steering performance, I had some other tricks done to increase the nearside caster. Result is a car that generally tracks straight, and no longer scrubs the LHF tyre outer shoulder at a crazy rate. With other suspension mods i have nearly doubled my tyre life and have much better handling.

Gerry

PolyN bushes do work for their own purpose. They are designed for those who want to extract more out of their handling. It is a small increase yes, however teamed up with the correct suspension tune, their effect is increased even more. Im only talking 10-15% increase. But for those who have the natural gift of telling incremental differences bewteen bushes, so they understand the compromises and benefits with both types, they are the ones who will benefit the most.

In most instances, use rubber. Its comfort biased and isnt as harsh as the PolyN in normal driving circumstances. If you have either stock or non-adjustable aftermarket-shock/springs where you are not enthusiastically engaing in spirited driving or, have no interest in small increases of handling benefits, keep the bushes rubber.

If you are like myself, who enjoys to drive hard of a nice piece of sweeping blacktop regulary, and appreiciates every bit of increased steering feel and reaction, well get some PolyN's. They are for those who understand the rather incrental benefits of harder bushes, and can live with some of the small compromises that they have in normal day-to-day driving (or a shit piece of road).

disagree with rubber for lowered vehicles, in my diamante, the rear upper outer control arm bush died, and i replaced it with the stock replacement. again it died. used nolathane for the next change and it has been perfect, no more toe in causing it to jump around in the rear. no more uneven tyre wear. on a stock car rubber is great, under stress, not so. found the same on my Isuzu trooper with the rear leaf spring bushes, rubber ones died QUICKLY, nolathane held to the abuse.

It is possible that your bushes in your Diamante deteriorate quicker due to a decrease in suspension travel after fitting lowered springs, as well as a lack of absorbancy due to the fitment of larger wheels and thinner profile tyres, in conjunction with driving on roads that are rubbish. Again, its about having the correct combination to get the best out of either bush.

Rubber shackle bushes in commercial vehicles with solid rear axle and leaf springs will take a beating as the springs are harder. They are designed to take weight, hence the stiffer springs, but when the axle is unloaded, the bump and rebound characteristics of both the shocks and springs are shot to hell, and all of the absorbancy is sent through the tyres and the bushes. Busted shackle bushes are a fact of life; but also rubber ones are a matter of a few bucks, compared to 30-40 for Nolathane. And its only a 10 minute job each side. Some people dont want to spend that money. You do, and did, and you are benefiting from the increased life of the bushes!!

But also, remember i said "use rubber if you dont engage in entusiastic driving or are not interested in incremental handling benefits". Again, you obviously do, and did, so you installed Nolathane, and you have benefited from it! Some people have small/no interest in extra handling benefits of lowered suspension, and have installed them purely for look. Rubber bushes are cheaper as well, and as above, some people dont want to spend the extra dosh for benefits that they will not notice, or do not want to live with the probable increase of road noise and initial harshness in the cars ride. So you didnt disagree, you just never read what I said properly.....

Being passionatley in agreeance or disagreeance with the benefits and compromises of either bush does not help answer or assist the member who asked the original question. We all need to realise that we all have different demands and budgets for our indvidual vehicles, and we only need to mention our experiences with either type of bush. Using BOLD LETTERS or assuming that your experiences are indefinately correct and other experiences are wrong just starts unwanted shitfights within the forum.

To add: rubber compounds on bushes differ from manufactuer to manufacturer, car to car, model to model. Sport(ier) cars that are based on basic model/platforms (Eg: HSV/Commodores) still use rubber bushes, but HSV use a harder compound of rubber than the lesser-models on which it is based on as the type of vehicles they specialize in is performance-based. So experiences may differ from vehicle to vehicle as their purpose on which they are made for may be completely different. Shackle bushes are typically softer than those used on a passenger-oriented car to maximise ride and handling benefits of a vehicle fitted with stiff leaf springs is unladen.

Hi everyone, I just want to say thanks to everyone for replying to this thread, I'm not too sure what I will do yet as I'm a little confused, but i think I will stick with rubber ones, is it best just to order these from the mits dealer or ebay? cheers

Hi everyone, I just want to say thanks to everyone for replying to this thread, I'm not too sure what I will do yet as I'm a little confused, but i think I will stick with rubber ones, is it best just to order these from the mits dealer or ebay? cheers

If you're going to stick with rubber, use genuine ones. I doubt you'll be able to buy anything else anyway.

Have you checked the bush to see if there's a bolt at the back or if it's a slide on pin? Being a verada, it's probably a bolt but it helps to know when you're ordering.

You can get them off the shelf at Repco

If you're going to stick with rubber, use genuine ones. I doubt you'll be able to buy anything else anyway.

Have you checked the bush to see if there's a bolt at the back or if it's a slide on pin? Being a verada, it's probably a bolt but it helps to know when you're ordering.

Hi, thanks for your reply, yes its a bolt.

You can get them off the shelf at Repco

Ok cool, thanks for letting me know, do you know what they charge for the set?

I couldnt tell you off the top of my head sorry.