Hi, My TE with the 2.4L engine won't start. It has plenty of compression, it has a strong spark and there is fuel in the rail. Recently I have changed the bottom end of the engine due to a broken rod. Now I have it all back together have checked all the wiring and hoses 3 times and still won't start.

Is there an inertia switch somewhere I could try reseting?

I also broke the sensor on the throttle body next to the TPS. I don't know what it is or does but i broke of the little plastic end on the inside while I was changing it over from a parts engine. But that can't be why it's no starting could it?

It just seems strange why it would have compression, spark and fuel (in the rail) and not start.

Could you post a pic of what you broke?

It's the IAC, (Idle air control). even with it pulled out completely it still won't start.

just spent 2 hours repairing the IAC with parts from the other engine I have. Still doesn't start.

May be it's the ignition timing, say the spark is coming in to late or early. But that can't be, because the dissy is on the end of the camshaft. I'm going to supercheap to see what diagnostic tools I can get.

Ignition timing is spot on and the spark is strong. The engine has good earth continuity. I can smell after I try to start it.

How do I know if the immobiliser is not letting it start?

If the immobiliser was doing the right thing before the engine blew it is unlikely to be stopping it now.

Everything plugged in?

Check your cam belt timing.

If it is the crank angle sensor or cam angle sensor it should give you an error code, even if it didn't start.

Every thing has been plugged in and checked several times. Cam timing is spot on at TDC. Can I use my OBDII scanner to scan for codes?

Is the Cam angle sensor located on the Dissy? Where abouts would the crank angle sensor be located? I have a spare for both of them I just need to know where they are.

Is the Cam angle sensor located on the Dissy? Where abouts would the crank angle sensor be located? I have a spare for both of them I just need to know where they are.

References (hope you downloaded that manual)
crank angle sensor: 11A-4-1, number 4.
cam angle sensor: 11A-3-2, number 9.

Check out http://www.evoscan.com/technical-vehicle-manuals/12-mitsubishi-diagnostics to find out how to read the codes. Your can should be OBDII compliant.

just changed the cam angle sensor, no change.

Do the OBDII scan, otherwise you are working in the dark. I found the "flashing engine light" method of reading the error codes a big help when I was troubleshooting not starting in a 1997 Lancer.

OK, my scanner couldn't read the codes so I crossed pins 1 and 4 with a paper clip and it gave me ~ 1 long 3 short 2 long 5 short. I read that as 13=Intake air temp sensor fault. and 25=Barometric (BARO) pressure sensor fault.

After plugging in the plastic box on the intake and resetting the codes, the diagnostic only blinks repeated short flashes. I assume this means no fault codes.

What do you mean plugging in the plastic box on the intake?

Did you forget to connect the air flow meter harness?

If so, is it starting now?

Yeah, I had the plastic intake off so I could change the cam angle sensor. It still doesn't start when I connected it back up.

When I turn the key it cranks makes spark and I can smell unburned fuel but it just won't fire. I can't believe it.

After you've tried cranking it again now, have you rechecked the codes?

I'll check them again now

Now it's giving me 41= injector fault. But I think that is because I was back probing them to get them to open manually to check their operation.

I'm gonna change over the fuel regulator now with the one on the other motor I have just for the hell of it.

Nope, still won't start.

When I pulled the fuel reg off I kind of expected fuel to spray out under pressure but it just sort of dribbled out. Does anyone think my fuel pump isn't suppling the pressure it should be? Normally with other cars when I open the fuel system with out first depressurising fuel sprays out, lots of it too.

I changed the fuel filter as the old one was plugged now I have plenty of fuel pressure at the fuel rail. I got maybe 2 kicks out of it with heaps of cranking. Now nothing again.

Doesn't the 4g64 have a dual relay for the fuel pump/pressure regulator which can cause problems (or am I thinking of another car?)

Have you actually pressure tested the rail? Might be the next step.

Will spraying some spray starter spray down the throttle body lead it to try and kick over?

I'd like to know where the fuel pump relay is. Unfortunately it isn't clearly labled anywhere. Another thing, the fuel pump doesn't prime either. It only runs when the engine is turning, like my Explorer.

When I changed the fuel filter the pressure inside the rail went from just dribbling out to almost exploding out.

I recently pulled the plugs, took the injector wires off and cranked the engine over to dry out the combustion chambers. When I put it back together, It really wanted to start. As I was turning the key and cranking it over it gave about 20 hickups in a row. I so thought it would start but after it stopped hickuping it went back to the same old cranking for ever.

I think I will test my injectors with a test lamp to make sure none of them are playing up.

Sounds like your spark timing is way off.

Injectors are working fine. Once I dry out the combustion chambers I can either spray some starting fluid in and leave the fuel injector wires unplugged to get the hiccups or I can plug the injector wires in without spraying starting fluid in to get the hiccups. If I do both I get nothing, Just cranking.

As far as the spark timing goes what part of the rotor arm contact has to hit the distributor cap button while the piston is a TDC? The lead part of the contact, the middle or the end?

Take a deep breath, walk away for a while. Then come back and check everything.

Fuel + compression + spark = engine runs, unless one of them is wrong.

As far as the spark timing goes what part of the rotor arm contact has to hit the distributor cap button while the piston is a TDC? The lead part of the contact, the middle or the end?

Check that the rotor arm is seated correctly.
Middle of the rotor arm should point at the carbon bit inside the cap. They don't touch though. Check that the carbon bit on the distributor cap actually leads to the number 1 spark plug.

I just tried every spark position possible, no change. So I set it back to middle. Now the spark occurs when the timing mark on the Cam shaft sprocket is lined up with the timing mark on the Valve cover.

Compression on all cylinders is between 130 & 150 psi.

When I pull the plugs and turn the motor over fuel spray comes out of the combustion chambers. My fuel gauge reads 1/4.

If you have compression, fuel and spark then the engine must turn over. The only thing that could prevent that is fuel contamination. Drain the tank, refill and try again.

Looks like I'm dropping the tank.

Oh ffs leave the tank alone

First thing is check for injector pulse. Is great it has spark and fuel in the rail but all is useless if the injectors are not opening and letting in fuel

If fuel is contaminated it would not have. Even running when the belt initially went

130 comp is also low not good but should be enough to run

I checked for injecter pulse using a test lamp, they are strong pulses and in time.

The fuel filter was plugged but I purged the fuel line of dirty fuel behind the filter by cranking the engine with the filter off.

130 is kind of low compared to say 165-170 but it should start easy enough.

I have read about this on other forums but no one has ever solved it and posted how they did it. Except for one guy with his dissy 180* out on an 88 Jeep.

Must be fuel. What else could there be?

I have been searching the net for hours and hours, no one has been able to figure this one out.

What's involved in switching to a v6? Engine + Loom + ECU = Running engine?

EDIT: I forgot to mention the power steering pressure hose.

If you can't get a simple 4 cyl running you certainly cant convert to v6

My money is on your making an error during engine assy with timing, remember if dizzy is out 180 then crank will still flash light on marks.

Have you done a fuel flow check at the return line

Dreggzy. .... In answer .. So many things

I agree with Mal.

Why would the fuel in the tank have suddenly gone bad?

It's definitely a timing issue IMHO because it kicks, but won't run.

Check the distributor AGAIN. Hell, before pulling out a fuel tank, I would even consider taking the valve cover off just to make sure the spark on #1 is happening with both exhaust/intake valves closed (ie not 180 degrees out).

What is the history of this engine you bought? When did it last run? Where did you buy it from? Was it from a wreckers, where parts may have been pulled off it and then replaced to sell it as a whole unit?

Are there any huge, unnoticed blockages in the intake/exhaust system? A COMPLETELY blocked intake/exhaust could cause this problem.

Have you accidentally got the injector wiring in the wrong order? Have you got plug leads in the wrong order?

Sounds like you need to pay a mechanic $100 to come and look at it for you.

i agree with madmagna on this, it sounds like your possible 180 out with the dizzy. those timing marks on the crank can line up with decompression AND compression stroke. you need to put the timing mark on the crank to TDC (top dead center) with number 1 cylinder fully to the top on compression stroke (in other words, till you can feel air push out of number 1 cylinder) then pull out the dizzy and turn it till the rotor button points to number 1 on the dizzy cap. then put the dizzy back in.

If you can't get a simple 4 cyl running you certainly cant convert to v6

My money is on your making an error during engine assy with timing, remember if dizzy is out 180 then crank will still flash light on marks.

Have you done a fuel flow check at the return line

Dreggzy. .... In answer .. So many things

The dissy isn't 180*out. The piston is at TDC with the cams set to close valves when the spark hits.

The Valve Timing is perfect, even the two balance shafts are perfectly timed, I made the timing correct the first time, checked it, checked it again, replaced the dissy with a known good one, tried ever posible ignition timing.

Every fuse is fine every relay check out.

Their is heaps of fuel pressure at the rail, The injector pulse is working fine. I can smell unburnt fuel coming out the exhaust after a long session of cranking. Start fluid won't even start it when cranking.

The fuel flows through the return line when cranking. I even changed the fuel regulator with a spare one I had.

Could it be possible that the head is dammaged in some way? I have a spare head but I'll have to replace the valves. Machanically and electrically this engine should run but it doesn't.

You are completely off track here

IF you have tried starting fluid and you can smell fuel at the exhaust something is not timed

So what if the valves are closed when number 1 is at TDC, they are always closed when a piston is up. I recon and I have seen this many times that you have the valves rocking when the plug is firing ie one valve has just closed and the other about to open. When the plug fires you need to make sure that the rockers are on the back of the cam and not on the lobes.

Simple rule, you have spark, you have fuel, you have compression, provided these are all happeneing at the right time you have a running engine. In this case one of these conditions is not happening at the right time thus the motor is not running.

I agree with Mal.

Why would the fuel in the tank have suddenly gone bad?

It's definitely a timing issue IMHO because it kicks, but won't run.

Check the distributor AGAIN. Hell, before pulling out a fuel tank, I would even consider taking the valve cover off just to make sure the spark on #1 is happening with both exhaust/intake valves closed (ie not 180 degrees out).

What is the history of this engine you bought? When did it last run? Where did you buy it from? Was it from a wreckers, where parts may have been pulled off it and then replaced to sell it as a whole unit?

Are there any huge, unnoticed blockages in the intake/exhaust system? A COMPLETELY blocked intake/exhaust could cause this problem.

Have you accidentally got the injector wiring in the wrong order? Have you got plug leads in the wrong order?

Sounds like you need to pay a mechanic $100 to come and look at it for you.

I don't think the fuel would be contaminated enough to not want to burn. It has 1/4 of a tank and It has been sitting for 3 to 4 weeks.

Checked timing, spot on. Valve timing, piston timing and spark timing are all in sync. I built the engine on a stand, timed it and fully dressed it before I put it in.

The engine was running and the car drove just before I pulled the engine out. I took everthing with it so I have 2 of everthing that I can swap around. It had a bad valve with no compression in no#3 cylinder, so I put my top end on it which had good valves. Now it has compression on every cylinder.

There are no blockages in the intake or exhaust.

Injector wiring is good, Ignition leads are in correct order.

I bet the mechanic won't be able to tell me any more then I all ready know and then would start randomly replacing parts till I went broke.

You are completely off track here

So what if the valves are closed when number 1 is at TDC, they are always closed when a piston is up. I recon and I have seen this many times that you have the valves rocking when the plug is firing ie one valve has just closed and the other about to open. When the plug fires you need to make sure that the rockers are on the back of the cam and not on the lobes.



Because of the timing mark on the Camshaft sprocket. But I'll remove the valve cover and visually check again.

Timing mark has sfa to do with anything, that will simply show when #1 and #4 are at TDC but remember that the pistons will be at TDC twice for each complete cam rotation

Ok I'm gonna check the timing again now, I'm pulling the valve cover off and the plugs out.

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o591/sedition1039/DSCF3449.jpg

Cam timing off by 3 teeth? How should it line up anyway? Hope you haven't bounced pistons into valves - but then again you said you had compression. Should be ok.

Is it running now?

Yep It's running good.

There was a "L" shaped piece of plastic in the timing case. Made it jump a few teeth.

I bet the mechanic won't be able to tell me any more then I all ready know and then would start randomly replacing parts till I went broke.

And you were going to remove the fuel tank??? :io:

Glad you got it sorted.

Took it to run a 300kilometre errand, it was very smooth.

As we always say. Timing is everything. Vee

Glad to hear it is up and running, hate to say told you so but as stated, if fuel, spark and comp is there and all happens at the correct time then will run

What was the bit of plastic down there, did you find where it came from and make sure no more will break off and cause more issues

I'd like to thank everyone for their assistance. My TE is now running smoothly and silently. The piece was the upper right corner peice of the lower timing case, it must have broken when I was putting the upper case on.

It's good to hear a "told you so" that means the senior members of this Forum know what they're talking about.