I'm still getting used to the AWD, so this may seem like a bit of a noob question. I'm asking to be on the safe side.

Low to moderate speed tight corners in my AWD seems to provoke tyre noise. Two corners come to mind where this happens consistently; one is a 90 degree turn and the other is essentially a 180 degree turn. Neither of them high speed, usually 1st and 2nd gear, but at mild to wild throttle opening the noise produced hints at the limits of lateral grip being reached.

Car still holds direction and there is no abnormal feedback through the steering wheel. It "feels" okay and holds its line.

Wheel alignment done last week has quietened it but not a lot. The tyres are new 235/45 17" Khumo's. Good shocks & springs and everything under the car looks in good condition.

As I've said the car feels okay,holds direction and doesnt hint at losing traction. Just this noise.

Am I being a being a paranoid android here, or it this either an AWD thing or time for a different compound of tyre?

the tyre screeching doesnt always mean its at the end of its grip, if it only happens around a few certain corners the road surface may have something to do with it and may make the noise seem worse, id say the only way to get away from it is to use a grippier tyre.

the tyre screeching doesnt always mean its at the end of its grip, if it only happens around a few certain corners the road surface may have something to do with it and may make the noise seem worse, id say the only way to get away from it is to use a grippier tyre.

Nice to know I guess. The surface of these corners seems quite good actually.

What breed/model tyres are you using? Is there a poll or thread for recommended tyres here?

What Kumhos are you running?

Checked your tyre pressures lately? What are you running them at, and what sort of corners are we talking about in a great sense than their degree of turn. Off camber turns will provoke screeching a lot sooner than those on camber or flat.

The noise is the road begging for mercy under your four traction wheels

Honest simple solution, spend more on your tires. :-)

Tyre noise on corners is a good indicator you are heading towards the limit of your grip, however, different tyres (and road surfaces/conditions) can lead to this being either progressive, but sometimes a snap loss of traction which is obviously bad. So be careful :-)

I haven't noticed any additional noise when cornering compared to the FWD, although the slight understeer is noticeable. One thing that I noticed early in the AWD experience is that it promotes over confidence, especially in the wet, which may be a bit of a trap for us in some situations.

While we're on this topic, what do the members here recommend for tyre pressures?

I haven't noticed any additional noise when cornering compared to the FWD, although the slight understeer is noticeable. One thing that I noticed early in the AWD experience is that it promotes over confidence, especially in the wet, which may be a bit of a trap for us in some situations.

While we're on this topic, what do the members here recommend for tyre pressures?

16s and under
36 front 34 rear
17s+
38-40 front
36-38 rear

i get noise but only when im going very hard.

The noise is the road begging for mercy under your four traction wheels

^This. This x 100.

The AWD tends to lean heavier onto the outside front tyre, so thats where this sound is probably starting. Some - camber helps this & a heavier rear sway bar etc.

I haven't noticed any additional noise when cornering compared to the FWD, although the slight understeer is noticeable. One thing that I noticed early in the AWD experience is that it promotes over confidence, especially in the wet, which may be a bit of a trap for us in some situations.

While we're on this topic, what do the members here recommend for tyre pressures?

I run 38 all round. I have the factory 16 by 7 inch (VR-X) wheels with 215 60 16 tyres. I dare say the ideal pressure will vary depending on tyre and wheel size. But I find 38 to be the optimum between comfort (got the tin lids in the back) and "performance". We do a 50 50 mix overall of country and city driving in total kms per year.

When it comes to tyre noise I only get that on the rare hair pin corner, and it is usually due to the incline. I let the diffs work it out :-)

I find it quite possible to produce front wheel noise when cornering briskly and adding throttle, so I assume it's normal too.
One thing to remember is that the AWD and FWD have the same amount of lateral grip - actually, AWD should have less because it weighs a little more. The difference only comes when you add power. The FWD will slip a front wheel and either spin 1 up or understeer - back in 2001 I had a Magna Hire car and it would corner wonderfully and fast, while spinning and smoking up one tyre.
The AWD will detect the slippage on 1 front wheel and then send more power to the rear. This can cause the front to be pushed into understeer or in low grip situations (ie: wet road) the full power going to the rear can make the rear end break traction and step out. Then life becomes interesting. :)

I run 40psi at all 4 tyres on 245/40/18. I found 36 to be the absolute minimum for the factory 16s - look at the tyre label it recommends 44psi for factory tyres running a heavy load and over 140kph (35 + 9).
This tells me that it is safer to run higher pressure than lower pressure and only use low pressure for comfort.
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b129/Ogier/Magna/IMG_0205-TyrePlacard.jpg

Tyres squeal is when the amount of available grip on part or all of the contact surface is reaching its limits and is binding on the road surface. All stock magnas (both fwd and awd) exhibit a degree of understeer, especially on average tyres. It is quite easy to reach limits of grip and you start to get tyre squeal. Thats not to say thay grip has completely gone, its just an audible reminder that the limit is approaching. Thicker rear sway bars go someway to reducing understeer in all magnas. With the AWD i noticed that stomping on the accelerator while turning allowed the rear diff to come into play some more and swinging the rear around. Fun, but less understeer to begin with would be good :)

I have found that understeer can be fixed by the throttle, upto a point.

I have found that to reduce the amount of understeer in both my old KS and current AWD is to manually change down a gear or two and use engine control. Car handles a lot better though corners this way. And yes better tyres make a huge difference.
KS went from stock 205/65R15 bridgestone something to 225/50R16 Goodyear F1 and had noticably better grip.
The AWD went from stock 215/60R16 Bridgestone ER300 to 225/50R17 Maxxis z4s to 225/45R18 Roadstone n7000 and now 235/45R18 Hankook evo v12. Again improvements each time (except going to Roadstone).

What Kumhos are you running?

Kumho's are Ecsta ASX... KU21's

Checked your tyre pressures lately? What are you running them at, and what sort of corners are we talking about in a great sense than their degree of turn. Off camber turns will provoke screeching a lot sooner than those on camber or flat.

I've tried a couple of different tyre pressures. In my FWD I usually run a couple of psi less in the front. With the AWD I'm running the same psi all round because I'm not sure how alternate pressures front to rear affect the center differential.

Currently I'm working my way back from 40psi. I'm at 37psi and there's no change apart from a whole lot of placebo effect. It could be unchanged, it could be worse? I'm not see a reduction in tyre noise and I'm not seeing a reduction in the cars handling capabilities.

The noise is the road begging for mercy under your four traction wheels

LOL. Thanks.

Honest simple solution, spend more on your tires. :-)

Tyre noise on corners is a good indicator you are heading towards the limit of your grip, however, different tyres (and road surfaces/conditions) can lead to this being either progressive, but sometimes a snap loss of traction which is obviously bad. So be careful :-)

It's that "snap loss" that I'm worried about. Especially in the wet.

I'm not sure what I'm supposed to pay for good tyres, but fresh Kumhos cost me a bit.... I'll try find the receipt.

I haven't noticed any additional noise when cornering compared to the FWD, although the slight understeer is noticeable. One thing that I noticed early in the AWD experience is that it promotes over confidence, especially in the wet, which may be a bit of a trap for us in some situations.

While we're on this topic, what do the members here recommend for tyre pressures?

Bump - for tyre pressure recommendations!

16s and under
36 front 34 rear
17s+
38-40 front
36-38 rear

More pressure in the front? Would t that promote understeer?

i get noise but only when im going very hard.

I think maybe that's what I'm doing? Maybe I'm just getting on the gas too early.

Tyres in the 235/45R17 range should be dirt cheap unless it is the XL ones.

I run mine at 40 allround with 235/45R18.

P.S. You can do multiple quotes instead of a new post per quote. ;)

The AWD tends to lean heavier onto the outside front tyre, so thats where this sound is probably starting. Some - camber helps this & a heavier rear sway bar etc.

I'm running a 22mm rear bar from Signature Sway Bars. It's made a huge difference but now I'm wondering if I need to start working on weight distribution as all of this noise I'm hearing sounds like the front is too heavy.

I run 38 all round. I have the factory 16 by 7 inch (VR-X) wheels with 215 60 16 tyres. I dare say the ideal pressure will vary depending on tyre and wheel size. But I find 38 to be the optimum between comfort (got the tin lids in the back) and "performance". We do a 50 50 mix overall of country and city driving in total kms per year.

When it comes to tyre noise I only get that on the rare hair pin corner, and it is usually due to the incline. I let the diffs work it out :-)

I'm happy to let the diff's do their job.... I'd just like to be more confident in the tools they have to work with.

A set of 380 callipers up front would reduce the weight a little bit as they are cast alloy rather than cast iron (from memory, so correct me if I am wrong).

I find it quite possible to produce front wheel noise when cornering briskly and adding throttle, so I assume it's normal too.
One thing to remember is that the AWD and FWD have the same amount of lateral grip - actually, AWD should have less because it weighs a little more. The difference only comes when you add power. The FWD will slip a front wheel and either spin 1 up or understeer - back in 2001 I had a Magna Hire car and it would corner wonderfully and fast, while spinning and smoking up one tyre.
The AWD will detect the slippage on 1 front wheel and then send more power to the rear. This can cause the front to be pushed into understeer or in low grip situations (ie: wet road) the full power going to the rear can make the rear end break traction and step out. Then life becomes interesting. :)

I run 40psi at all 4 tyres on 245/40/18. I found 36 to be the absolute minimum for the factory 16s - look at the tyre label it recommends 44psi for factory tyres running a heavy load and over 140kph (35 + 9).
This tells me that it is safer to run higher pressure than lower pressure and only use low pressure for comfort.


I think maybe I should look at a better set of tyres. And maybe shedding or relocating some weight in the car.

I think maybe I should look at a better set of tyres. And maybe shedding or relocating some weight in the car.
As I mentioned, 380 callipers and the only other thing is to relocate the battery to the boot and also sit the furtherest back as possible and include moving the front passenger seat as far back as possible.

Tyres squeal is when the amount of available grip on part or all of the contact surface is reaching its limits and is binding on the road surface. All stock magnas (both fwd and awd) exhibit a degree of understeer, especially on average tyres. It is quite easy to reach limits of grip and you start to get tyre squeal. Thats not to say thay grip has completely gone, its just an audible reminder that the limit is approaching. Thicker rear sway bars go someway to reducing understeer in all magnas. With the AWD i noticed that stomping on the accelerator while turning allowed the rear diff to come into play some more and swinging the rear around. Fun, but less understeer to begin with would be good :)

I'm not experiencing any understeer while this is happening. Car is still going in the direction I point it... just with a audible howl or the odd chirp depending on the corner, throttle position and steering angle.

I'm not a racecar driver, my concern is having the dry weather howl turn into a wet weather crunch.

Tyres in the 235/45R17 range should be dirt cheap unless it is the XL ones.

I run mine at 40 allround with 235/45R18.

P.S. You can do multiple quotes instead of a new post per quote. ;)

I'll look into the tyre situation.

Multiple quotes - yeah :P I'm at work.... er, "working"... my iPhone isn't in the mood to let me do multiple quotes.

A set of 380 callipers up front would reduce the weight a little bit as they are cast alloy rather than cast iron (from memory, so correct me if I am wrong).

Just checked my calipers - AWD front calipers = alloy.

More pressure in the front? Would t that promote understeer?

you put the higher pressures where the weight hits the hardest
its hard to stop understeer when your talking about a 1650kg car that is also awd so you cant use throttle to advantage as much as in fwd or rwd cars.

As I mentioned, 380 callipers and the only other thing is to relocate the battery to the boot and also sit the furtherest back as possible and include moving the front passenger seat as far back as possible.

I'm keen to relocate the battery to the boot, forward of the front axle. Research time I think...

As for unsprung weight, I'll start with lighter rims.

Weight is an issue I always fuss over, unless its my weight. With the car it's ways clean and free of unnecessary items. I've dropped a few kg by running HM headers and a smaller cat'. The AWD is a TJ II AWD Sports... and I believe they were the lightest AWD with the 159kw motor. It's why I wanted this model.

I've been nibbling away at weight were possible, both physically in the car and by modeling some parts on the computer and altering their material to gauge a dollar-per-kilo potential of having parts made from alloy or titanium. Watch this space as if I do find a cost effective change the results in significant weight advantages I'll broadcast it.

I'm running 42f - 40r. Maybe your fronts are "rolling" on the rim a little with those pressures. Battery in the boot would'nt hurt & is easy to do.

http://i428.photobucket.com/albums/qq8/lewiston142/AWD/DSC_0084.jpg

I'm running 42f - 40r. Maybe your fronts are "rolling" on the rim a little with those pressures. Battery in the boot would'nt hurt & is easy to do.

http://i428.photobucket.com/albums/qq8/lewiston142/AWD/DSC_0084.jpg


I want this! How did you do this? Parts required, costs, professional thing or can it be DIY?

Hey zero, is it expensive to move the battery to the boot?

Skapper, as you already have the extractors, there is not much else you can do. Perhaps replace the front seats with those in the TL/W which are slightly lighter due to having the back caved in to provide more rear leg room. Interesting thing with the AWD callipers. The 380 ones look totally different on the surface to the AWD ones as well as the colour. The 380 are lighter grey where as the AWD are a darker shade of grey,almost charcoal in colour.

I want this! How did you do this? Parts required, costs, professional thing or can it be DIY?

Easy DIY....i copied member greenmatt's mounting measurments....there's a thread by him somewhere. Got other info from autospeed.com.
Used Mitsu L300 battery tray....ran wire (sleeved with clear tubing) through the cab. Earthed at the rear & at original spot.
I made up the isolation switch on the box, but i've noticed you can get them already set-up like that now.
*edit use proper tensile mounting bolts!

Haha, yeah i've gone light weight wheels & nuts.

Hey zero, is it expensive to move the battery to the boot?

Skapper, as you already have the extractors, there is not much else you can do. Perhaps replace the front seats with those in the TL/W which are slightly lighter due to having the back caved in to provide more rear leg room. Interesting thing with the AWD callipers. The 380 ones look totally different on the surface to the AWD ones as well as the colour. The 380 are lighter grey where as the AWD are a darker shade of grey,almost charcoal in colour.

The internet is telling me a battery relocation kit is a great idea and wont cost me too much. And the internet never lies.

I'm sure there can be more done to shake KG's out of these things, the limit is the budget. Light wheels represents a good practical first option - my GTVi wheels are 22.5kg each. HM's and the right exhaust components has been proven to shed 14kg. Not carrying a spare wheel and jack etc saves another thirty. From there its removing anything not needed that wont affect the cars safety and practicality.

Pretty sure weight savings have bee done to death here on the forums. I'd just like to see the ideas listed with an actual figure attached to them. Example; using brand X parts saved me X amount of kg's in overall weight.

Once the weight has been shed to the limit of the budget the next step is to shuffle it around... like relocating the drivers seat the boot or something.

we're digressing...

Next week I'll take the car back to my suspension people and see what they think I can do to improve grip.

My 18 x 8's weigh 18 lb each & the nuts are featherweight. Cant remember all the weights but weighed plenty of wheels & various brakes etc., just out of curiosity.

My 18 x 8's weigh 18 lb each & the nuts are featherweight. Cant remember all the weights but weighed plenty of wheels & various brakes etc., just out of curiosity.

Which wheels are these?

A set of 380 callipers up front would reduce the weight a little bit as they are cast alloy rather than cast iron (from memory, so correct me if I am wrong).

From memory changing to 380 brakes up front, from my FWD brakes, added 5kg total.
The AWD fronts would need to be pretty heavy then to make much difference over 380's.

I mentioned camber earlier but forgot castor....increasing this also helps keep neg camber when cornering.
You could add adjustable camber tops to sort both of these ,plus save a couple more lb's & improve stiffness over the stock set-up.
i'm happy with them!

http://i428.photobucket.com/albums/qq8/lewiston142/DSC_3390.jpg

Wheels are Enkei RPF1.

http://i428.photobucket.com/albums/qq8/lewiston142/DSC_1042-Copy.jpg

Which wheels are these?

Enkei RPF1 last I saw??

Around this weight (8kg, per wheel only) is pretty darn good and starts to get expensive when you want to go lower than that.

pretty much the evo X MR ones by the looks. cool

i have bretts old 17s and they are about 8kg each, they are about the lightest i could find and you can feel a difference.

i have bretts old 17s and they are about 8kg each, they are about the lightest i could find and you can feel a difference.

I gotta get me some 8kg wheels!

pretty much the evo X MR ones by the looks. cool

Think the X's only run BBS in forged & cast.

Best value budget wheel i reckon are 2nd hand Evo 9 17"x8 Enkei's. I have them for track days.
A good set cost around $600 if youre patient.

Can weigh one if i have too. lol Have semi's on them though.

Best value budget wheel i reckon are 2nd hand Evo 9 17"x8 Enkei's. I have them for track days.
A good set cost around $600 if youre patient.

Can weigh one if i have too. lol Have semi's on them though.

Yes please! Weigh them WEIGH THEM! The forum commands you. Please.

Yes please! Weigh them WEIGH THEM! The forum commands you. Please.

20kg (bathroom scales) with half worn RE55 semi.
Thats about a 10kg saving of unsprung weight over your current ones.

20kg (bathroom scales) with half worn RE55 semi.
Thats about a 10kg saving of unsprung weight over your current ones.

Hmmm. That's not that much lighter than my GTVi wheels with full tread.

I guess this is where you decide if its worth it to you, spending a lot more, for only tiny gains.

I guess this is where you decide if its worth it to you, spending a lot more, for only tiny gains.

True :/ Cost per kg weight reduction = $140 roughly, including some new grippy tyres. I got a quote from a tyre shop for 4 x new RPF1's with new rubber = $3000!!! But, assuming there's a 10kg weight reduction per wheel - $40kg total - Cost per kg = $75.

I have a spreadsheet I downloaded that has rim weights for popular models... I'll dig it up and drop a link here.

Its unsprung weight so its supposed to be more beneficial I've heard?

The bonus is your suspension will work better....down side is you may feel the bumps a little more, as the heavier wheels absorb some of that.

Link to the website where I found that wheel weight spreadsheet. You need to sort the data in Excel to make it clearer.

LINK HERE (http://www.wheelweights.net/)

Also, information here;

LINKY LINKY (http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1890)

Bump - for tyre pressure recommendations!
I'm currently running 225/50R17 Maxxis z4s (XL - 98 load rated) at 38psi front / 35psi rear, while usually having nothing in the boot. I've found tyre wear problematic at the front with less than 38psi, even with 215/60/R16s. If I load up for a trip, I run 40psi both front and rear, but around town I prefer the comfort of the lower pressures. I can also occasionally provoke a bit of squeal in roundabouts, usually when I've pushed a bit hard... but I know I don't really have enough tyre at the moment for the car.

I also suspect that I have a steering geometry issue, which I don't know the correct terminology to describe. I frequently park in a parking lot which accumulates a light layer of fine gravel. When maneuvering slowly (at idle basically) in a tight turn one of the front tyres occasionally feels like it slips sideways on the gravel. I suspect that the ackerman compensation is out of whack, and one of the wheels is turning at a slightly different radius than it should be. This has been most obvious since I had the steering rack replaced, although I suspect that I also have some lower control arm bushes past their prime too which may be exacerbating the issue :( I'm just trying to get some clear space to get the car to a suspension specialist to have the situation properly examined. Whatever the issues are, so far they don't appear to be causing excessive tyre wear that can't also be explained by taking roundabouts enthusiastically...

I'm currently running 225/50R17 Maxxis z4s (XL - 98 load rated) at 38psi front / 35psi rear, while usually having nothing in the boot. I've found tyre wear problematic at the front with less than 38psi, even with 215/60/R16s. If I load up for a trip, I run 40psi both front and rear, but around town I prefer the comfort of the lower pressures. I can also occasionally provoke a bit of squeal in roundabouts, usually when I've pushed a bit hard... but I know I don't really have enough tyre at the moment for the car.

I also suspect that I have a steering geometry issue, which I don't know the correct terminology to describe. I frequently park in a parking lot which accumulates a light layer of fine gravel. When maneuvering slowly (at idle basically) in a tight turn one of the front tyres occasionally feels like it slips sideways on the gravel. I suspect that the ackerman compensation is out of whack, and one of the wheels is turning at a slightly different radius than it should be. This has been most obvious since I had the steering rack replaced, although I suspect that I also have some lower control arm bushes past their prime too which may be exacerbating the issue :( I'm just trying to get some clear space to get the car to a suspension specialist to have the situation properly examined. Whatever the issues are, so far they don't appear to be causing excessive tyre wear that can't also be explained by taking roundabouts enthusiastically...

Thanks for this chief.

So far it seems higher pressure up front seems to help?

As for control arm bushes and the like, I've been all over the underside of the car looking at my suspension and suspension bushes. Everything looks "good"... but I guess looks can be deceiving. The suspension place I frequent have always been hinest and up front if I've had any issues they're concerned with. They gave the car a clean bill of health.

My guess is, if I want to quieten this howl I need to chase different compound tyres or juggle my tyre pressures differently to see if there's any improvement.

Less enthusiasm exiting corners could help to I guess?

I got a quote from a tyre shop for 4 x new RPF1's with new rubber = $3000!!!
Buy a set from the US for approx $1500 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ENKEI-RPF1-RIMS-SILVER-18x8-5-5x114-3-30-SET-OF-4-WHEELS-/270859884462?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f1081d7ae&vxp=mtr) shipped. Then add your choice of tyres.

$1500 isn't a bad price for a set of 18s. If you go to a chain store you're likely be looking at a minimum of $900 for a set of 18" wheels without tyres.

I believe KU21s are on the low end of the performance scale. This could be why they are protesting a bit.

Weight saving - do looks count? Remove engine cover, battery box (if it's in the front) intake snorkel, only half fill the windscreen washer bottle, cut / grind away the ribs on the top half of the air inlet box, remove heatshields (if you put them back on your HM headers).

Buy a set from the US for approx $1500 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ENKEI-RPF1-RIMS-SILVER-18x8-5-5x114-3-30-SET-OF-4-WHEELS-/270859884462?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f1081d7ae&vxp=mtr) shipped. Then add your choice of tyres.

$1500 isn't a bad price for a set of 18s. If you go to a chain store you're likely be looking at a minimum of $900 for a set of 18" wheels without tyres.

So many toys, so few kidneys to fund the purchases.....

I believe KU21s are on the low end of the performance scale. This could be why they are protesting a bit.

Weight saving - do looks count? Remove engine cover, battery box (if it's in the front) intake snorkel, only half fill the windscreen washer bottle, cut / grind away the ribs on the top half of the air inlet box, remove heatshields (if you put them back on your HM headers).

I might put the angle grinder down and look at my tyre options. :P

As for weight savings, arms account for 6% of your body weight... if I sell my other arm and a leg (because I have two of those) I would not only shed kg's but I could afford new toys.

Remember the rules of unsprung weight, removing 1kg from the wheels is equivalent to removing 5kg (i think) in the car. So if you save 40kg with lighter wheels, thats the equivalent of removing 200kg in the car. Massively worth it.

Also, those tyres arent performance tyres scapper, get something decent and it will transform the handling.

Remember the rules of unsprung weight, removing 1kg from the wheels is equivalent to removing 5kg (i think) in the car. So if you save 40kg with lighter wheels, thats the equivalent of removing 200kg in the car. Massively worth it.

Also, those tyres arent performance tyres scapper, get something decent and it will transform the handling.

Alrighty. New tyres it is. What does everybody recommend? Is there a poll here?

I'm off to try use the search feature here.

I'm off to try use the search feature here.
The vBulletin search sucks. Go to Google, type in site:www.aussiemagna.com/forums and then your search - eg the search box would read:

site:www.aussiemagna.com/forums tyre

There's been a few tyre mega-threads so you should get some good info.

What's your budget and what size rims will you be putting the tyres onto?

The vBulletin search sucks. Go to Google, type in site:www.aussiemagna.com/forums and then your search - eg the search box would read:
site:www.aussiemagna.com/forums tyre

There's been a few tyre mega-threads so you should get some good info.

What's your budget and what size rims will you be putting the tyres onto?

Thanks for the search tip!

Budget? At this stage they need to be free. Rego + insurance this month. But, I'd have no issue spending up $250 per tyre for the right tyre. The Kuhmos I have now were a "needed them NOW" thing and where I live they were a bit light on for 17's. I still can't remember how much they cost me.... maybe $135 each?

Tyre size would be to suit the GTVi rims, which I'm told accept 235/50 x 17. Even if I went to a different rim set I'd be looking at 17's again.

if you want performance done get 235s on that rim as i presume it is 7 inches wide? the tyre flex will make you loose the feeling like you are one with the road. however sadly if you want performance out of your car a 215 or 225 might not cut it, i would save up until you can get some wider rims 8+ inches wide and then buy good tyres to suit.

if you want performance done get 235s on that rim as i presume it is 7 inches wide? the tyre flex will make you loose the feeling like you are one with the road. however sadly if you want performance out of your car a 215 or 225 might not cut it, i would save up until you can get some wider rims 8+ inches wide and then buy good tyres to suit.

I think you're right. Budgeting for both lighter runs and better tyres as a package would be a smarter choice. That, and I'll keep the GTVi wheels/tyres as spares.

But thus raises another question; rim width (time to utilize that search tip) as there is sweet FA clearance between the inside tyre wall and the suspension at the rear. And on the outer tyre wall (rear) there's not much clearance to the gaurd.

The rumour I hear is 245 is the max width regardless of offset we can run on the rear?

You wouldnt want more then 245 anyway, personally i find on my FWD magna something like 17x8.5 front with a 235 tyre and 17x9 rear with a 235 or 245 tyre is best for performance but also looks quite good, You can also get 17x8 all around and run 235, will perform just as well but won't 'stand out in a crowd' if you understand me,
I run 9.5 width front and rear even and that is fine but it's not conventional.
I'd imagine AWD wheel and tyre setups would be pretty similar as it is the same chassis, traction isn't going to be an issue anyway which is the only reason youd really ever want to run more then 245 unless it was a track car.

Tyre size would be to suit the GTVi rims, which I'm told accept 235/50 x 17. Even if I went to a different rim set I'd be looking at 17's again.
235/45 is the size you are probably referring to, but as Hayden said, you will have a lot of tyre flex because the tyre is too wide for the rim - they're only 7" wide.

I would be putting 235/45/17 tyres on a 17x8" rim.

The stock size is 225/50/17. You can get Michelin Pilot Sport 3s in this size. I would guesstimate they'd be around $250-300/corner. I have them on my car and they're brilliant. Grip like the proverbial but they ride well and are reasonably quiet. They also won a recent tyre test in either Wheels or Motor magazine. I would also look at the Goodyear Eagle F1s, which may or may not come in this size.


But thus raises another question; rim width (time to utilize that search tip) as there is sweet FA clearance between the inside tyre wall and the suspension at the rear. And on the outer tyre wall (rear) there's not much clearance to the gaur
You can roll your rear guards. I had to do this to get my 235/40/18s to clear on my TJ.

Guys guys guys, Skapper has an AWD so tyres in 225/50R17 with XL will be expensive and undersized (656.8mm) whereas 215/60R16 is 664.4mm is OD. While still legal will look small. This is the reason I went to 18x8 with 235/45R18 tyres. Perfect fit and size in every aspect and is only 5mm bigger in OD. Incidentally, 225/45R18 is 5mm smaller in OD compared with OEM. Hayden, Scapper has and AWD so the rear upper control arm is thicker and is a lot closer to the wheel. My wheels are 18x8 with 35+ offset and there is only 5mm clearance at the back and the front protrudes a little so I got Murph to die grind the front to give a little -ve camber. Skapper, best to save up and get a light 18x8 wheel in +35 to +38 offset with a decent set of performance tyres in 235/45R18 size. Don't go below +35 as you will need more -ve camber at the front and don't go above +38 as you run the risk of hitting the upper control arm.

Thanks for the search tip!

Budget? At this stage they need to be free. Rego + insurance this month. But, I'd have no issue spending up $250 per tyre for the right tyre. The Kuhmos I have now were a "needed them NOW" thing and where I live they were a bit light on for 17's. I still can't remember how much they cost me.... maybe $135 each?

Tyre size would be to suit the GTVi rims, which I'm told accept 235/50 x 17. Even if I went to a different rim set I'd be looking at 17's again.

Skapper, 235/50R17 is ok on a 17x7 as it has extra sidewall height which enables better fit on a narrower tyre compared with 235/45R17 tyres. It is also only 4mm bigger in OD compared with OEM. But as I mentioned in my above post, save up and up change as 235/50R17 will flex more giving less confidence.

Guys guys guys, Skapper has an AWD so tyres in 225/50R17 with XL will be expensive and undersized (656.8mm) whereas 215/60R16 is 664.4mm is OD. While still legal will look small.
225/50/17 is the stock tyre size for the rims he's running, so it while it'll look smaller, it won't be stupidly smaller.

I would definitely go for 225/50/17s over 235/45/17 or even 235/50/17 on a 17x7" rim on a Magna for reasons of sidewall flex. It's just too narrow a rim. If it was a 7.5" wide rim you could probably grin and bear it. But not on a 7" rim.

225/50/17 is the stock tyre size for the rims he's running, so it while it'll look smaller, it won't be stupidly smaller.

I would definitely go for 225/50/17s over 235/45/17 or even 235/50/17 on a 17x7" rim on a Magna for reasons of sidewall flex. It's just too narrow a rim. If it was a 7.5" wide rim you could probably grin and bear it. But not on a 7" rim.

Okay. Thanks for the input guys. Appreciate it.

I'll tough it out on the current arrangement and sort the funds for an upgrade in the future.

Looking to get a set of these RPF1's in the right size/offset. Then sort the rubber to suit. Get the weight reduction and proper grip all in the one go.

AWD Sr and I seem to have tyres that no one else uses.. Both the AWD's have 215/60R16 Michelin Energy XM2 tyres. (Has anyone else heard of them??)
They seem to have pretty good grip. They certainly performed very well on the twisty roads to Murwillumbah last year.

Looking to get a set of these RPF1's in the right size/offset. Then sort the rubber to suit. Get the weight reduction and proper grip all in the one go.
Some of the earlier Evos used 17x8" wheels standard. Might be worth looking into.


AWD Sr and I seem to have tyres that no one else uses.. Both the AWD's have 215/60R16 Michelin Energy XM2 tyres. (Has anyone else heard of them??)
They seem to have pretty good grip. They certainly performed very well on the twisty roads to Murwillumbah last year.
The Energy XM2s are referred to my Michelin as a 'touring' tyre. So they're reasonably grippy - probably in a similar category to what Skapper has at the moment. But they're not high performance.

Don't forget I was on your tail the entire Murwillumbah cruise in a stock 380 with the aforementioned Michelin Pilot Sport 3s :)

the tyre screeching doesnt always mean its at the end of its grip, if it only happens around a few certain corners the road surface may have something to do with it and may make the noise seem worse, id say the only way to get away from it is to use a grippier tyre.
This comment made me laugh. When a tyre is screeching it's because it's starting to slide on the road surface. This is because it is running out of grip, herefore, tyre screech always means it's out of grip (AKA, you've reached peak traction and are on your way back downhill). You talk about it like its a predefined figure, which could only be the case if conditions, circumstances and driver control never varied.

Explain why my high performance tyres screech even at low speeds in undercover carparks.

Explain why my high performance tyres screech even at low speeds in undercover carparks.

Positive camber caused by tighter turns on concrete, the sound amplified by confined spaces?

The hypothesis is neither for against the tyre howl vs lateral grip limits being maxed out.

Just me pissing into the wind to see what it feels like.

In the meantime I'm going to fit trainer wheels to my car. Sure, I'll suffer a weight disadvantage, but by jingo I'll corner like I'm on rails.

This comment made me laugh. When a tyre is screeching it's because it's starting to slide on the road surface. This is because it is running out of grip, herefore, tyre screech always means it's out of grip (AKA, you've reached peak traction and are on your way back downhill). You talk about it like its a predefined figure, which could only be the case if conditions, circumstances and driver control never varied.

Oh sorry, the tyres i have experience with still have given me a fair bit of grip if i push a little harder then when it starts to screech, i could be confusing 'lack of grip' with 'lack of control' though as sometimes you can slide a little without what i call a lack in control, i hope that explains a bit closer to what i meant.

Explain why my high performance tyres screech even at low speeds in undercover carparks.

Thats the specific surface found in car parks, nothing to do with bitumen or concrete surfaces

Thats the specific surface found in car parks, nothing to do with bitumen or concrete surfaces

Yes stuff is applied to make oil/grease/grim easier to wash away. Its a kinf of silicon sealant, and is why the floors always look shiney.

Just updating this - problem sorted. I can go around corners without the noise.

The problem (apparently) was dead front sway bar bushes. That's been the only change I've made; new superoo D-bushes and corners happen quietly.

FYI - changing front sway bar bushes one handed is a C@#T! of a job. Holding the retaining plate up and trying to get the bolts started drove me freakin' bonkers.

Thats the specific surface found in car parks, nothing to do with bitumen or concrete surfaces


Yes stuff is applied to make oil/grease/grim easier to wash away. Its a kinf of silicon sealant, and is why the floors always look shiney.

Adelaide airport multi story car park is fairly new and brilliant at low speed tyre screeching to frighten the tourists! lol