Hi all,

OK - we have spent a few $$$ getting the TJ Wagon up to spec and passed the Roadworthy now - yay! :happy:

Now it's time for the Timing belt and etc. But I'm not brave enough to tackle this myself so will have to get some quotes for the work. My questions are:


What else should be replaced when the belt is done (this is the 100K change)?
I have established that I have a rocker cover leak, looks like both covers, is it best to do this at the same time?
Anything else in that region to do now as a preventative (obviously plugs)?


Steve

Flush the auto fluid and replace with genuine fluid. Magna gearboxes are a weak point so you should do all you can to extend their lifespan.

Timing Belt.
Gaskets.
Platinum Plugs.
Leads.
Dissy Cap.
Rotor.
Filters(oil/auto).
Cooling system flush and fresh Coolant.
Radiator hoses.
O2 sensor?

Make sure you get the whole timing belt kit done now. If you want preventative maintenance then you can do the kit with the water pump in it too. At least that gives you a small safeguard for an extra $60 in parts and $30 in labour.

Replace coolant, top and bottom radiator hoses and thermostat if you want to do a whole cooling system overhaul.

Flush transmission fluid with genuine fluid. Make sure you ask the mech if any chunks came out. You often see small shards of bearing casing coming out. Wave spring at worst, and to all the wave spring haters, yes it can and does happen.

Overhaul the ignition system. As prowler said, replace the distributor cap, rotor, spark plugs and leads. Get some cool looking NGK blue leads. They work better cos they're all blue n shit. (no they don't but they brighten the place up a bit)

Rocker cover gaskets would be getting a bit hard by now. You might like to replace them. Oil and oil filter are always on the list. When you get the oil changed, bring your mech a 380 sump plug. They are only $7 from Repco and are much easier to take off than that cumbersome 24mm magna one. (Yes, they fit fine.)

Have you got service records for the car to see what and when things have been done?

Personally I would not recommend any aftermarket leads at all for a Magna, most of them these days are silicone based leads and plugs and you will find that they have a horrible habbit to pop out of the tubes and also break down. For a similar price you can get genuine leads but then again I would not be changing leads at 100k unless your rocker cover gaskets have been leaking badly and damaged (swollen) the rubber boots

Again water pump at 100k is not essential, I generally dont recommend a water pump at this mileage and leave them to the 200k service, this changes of course if when the belt is off there are signs of leakage or bearing noise / movement which happens in say 1 in 30 that we do here.

Plugs if not already done, if you are comfortable with taking the upper manifold off do them yourself and use the std NGK carbon plugs. They tend to spark better and do get a good 30 - 40k our of a set.

Definitely a trans flush if not done already and definitely use genuine fluid

Cap and button, unless there are signs of wear which again at 100k would be doubtful all you are doing is spending un needed $$ for something that usually at this mileage does not need to be done

If taking the upper manifold off I would definitely do the rear rocker cover gasket even if not leaking as it wont be long until it does, saves a lot of time to do both in 1 hit (plugs and gasket)

Mate you might want to check the conditions of tube seals if you take out your plugs, as again itd easier to change the rear ones once the manifold is not

Otherwise usually timing belt kit,spark plugs and fuel filter if not already done

Magna gearboxes are a weak point so you should do all you can to extend their lifespan.

Yeah - I'm getting that impression Red. That will be my next focus after the timing belt.

Steve

Timing Belt.
Gaskets.
Platinum Plugs.
Leads.
Dissy Cap.
Rotor.
Filters(oil/auto).
Cooling system flush and fresh Coolant.
Radiator hoses.
O2 sensor?

Yikes - there goes; $x00! :woot:

Make sure you get the whole timing belt kit done now. If you want preventative maintenance then you can do the kit with the water pump in it too. At least that gives you a small safeguard for an extra $60 in parts and $30 in labour.


What's the kit worth for a TJ 3.5? Maybe Mal?

Steve

I'd just do the belt, plus checking the water pump and belt idlers for roughness, ancillary belts and their idlers.
If you get the kit with belt, cam seals and crank seal, as well as new idlers do those as well.
You can leave the spark plugs if it is running smoothly until the tube seals or rocker covers start to leak, then do plugs, tube seals, rocker cover gaskets in one go. But seeing they are leaking already . . .

Parts prices vary a lot, shop/ask around for the best deal on rocker cover gaskets + tube seals, spark plugs, belt kit.

Do gearbox as well, if the fluid isn't nice and clear.

Flush the auto fluid and replace with genuine fluid. Magna gearboxes are a weak point so you should do all you can to extend their lifespan.

I guess there's good ones and bad ones, my KH has done 245k and the auto is still fine

Yikes - there goes; $x00! :woot:

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,carcode,1387885

I just got my girl back this arvo, had the timing belt, tentioner, idler pully, crank & cam seals, water pump, platinum plugs, aux belts, and new gearbox oil. Grand total $1035.35

The timing belt kit, $274.30 according to the invoice. All dealer parts, from duttons mitsi in mount barker.

Should be good for another 100k now I hope!

Have you got service records for the car to see what and when things have been done?

No - pretty well nothing to go on that's recent. I'm basically taking charge myself to get the car to a point where as much preventative work as possible is done. We bought this (wagon) as a workhorse - with the intention of hanging on to it as long as possible. Got about 7 years outta the TP before she was retired. :D

Steve

Plugs if not already done, if you are comfortable with taking the upper manifold off do them yourself and use the std NGK carbon plugs. They tend to spark better and do get a good 30 - 40k our of a set.

Definitely a trans flush if not done already and definitely use genuine fluid

Mal - I respect your advice because of what you do. Question though: I had heard that platinum plugs can be used on rear cylinder bank to get 80-90000 km. And your advice on Trans fluid - since these vehicles don't seem to get a good rep on slush boxes, wouldn't synthetic oil maximise a blokes chances of a longer, trouble free life?

Steve

I just got my girl back this arvo, had the timing belt, tentioner, idler pully, crank & cam seals, water pump, platinum plugs, aux belts, and new gearbox oil. Grand total $1035.35

The timing belt kit, $274.30 according to the invoice. All dealer parts, from duttons mitsi in mount barker.

Should be good for another 100k now I hope!

Big $$$ - but then you've had a lot of work done too! Nice to hear from a fellow South Aussie. Used to live at Paradise, before a move to Murray Bridge for work - then a transfer to Victoria (also work).

Cheers

Steve

Mal - I respect your advice because of what you do. Question though: I had heard that platinum plugs can be used on rear cylinder bank to get 80-90000 km. And your advice on Trans fluid - since these vehicles don't seem to get a good rep on slush boxes, wouldn't synthetic oil maximise a blokes chances of a longer, trouble free life?

Steve

The general idea is to use platinum or iridium plugs on the rear bank, since, changing them is much more hassly. Though in reality if you know what you are doing it can be done in maybe 30 minutes.

Factory spec I *believe* is platinum rear, and standard front, changing the fronts more often. Most people doing it themselves tend to standardize on 1 set all round, whether to then go all irridium or all standard is the question and largely down to preference
.
Generally as Mal said there is some consensus that the standard ones spark better, though, I'm not sure how big a deal that is in an NA engine. That kind of thing tends to come up a lot more with turbo motors being pushed to their limit (or high horsepower applications in general) where the spark strength matters a lot more.

The general idea is to use platinum or iridium plugs on the rear bank, since, changing them is much more hassly. Though in reality if you know what you are doing it can be done in maybe 30 minutes.

Factory spec I *believe* is platinum rear, and standard front, changing the fronts more often. Most people doing it themselves tend to standardize on 1 set all round, whether to then go all irridium or all standard is the question and largely down to preference
.
Generally as Mal said there is some consensus that the standard ones spark better, though, I'm not sure how big a deal that is in an NA engine. That kind of thing tends to come up a lot more with turbo motors being pushed to their limit (or high horsepower applications in general) where the spark strength matters a lot more.

Thanks lathiat.

Steve

If you are going for preventative maintenance then you should use a platinum or iradium plugs. The standard ones spark better but for a workhorse that doesnt really matter.

standard factory plugs:
Front: NGK BKR5E11 Copper Change at 45,000 km
Rear: NGK BKR5EGP Platinum tip on centre electrode. Change at 100,000 km.

Can also use:
NGK PFR5G-11 2X platinum tip on centre electrode and small platinum insert on earth electrode. Change at 100,000 km.

All these are pregapped at 1.1 mm. Don't adjust any of them.

Personal note: I use the BKR5EGP all round, by the time they need doing the rocker cover gaskets and tube seals will be suspect anyway, good time to do them as well. lol

No Max, the std rear bank plugs are the PFR5J-11, not the BKR5EGP. In the J series the factory actually for some unknown reason used Champion but hey, all companies have a dark moment


If you are going for preventative maintenance then you should use a platinum or iradium plugs. The standard ones spark better but for a workhorse that doesnt really matter.

Totally incorrect as well. The std plugs are better than the platinum in so far as spark goes but do not last as long thus you have to change them more often. In ALL my cars I run the standard copper plugs but change them every 30 or so k, as i am doing it myself it works out per 100k about the same cost or cheaper. A lot of the APRA guys as well as Jason'sVRX who used to work for mits all use the standard copper plugs. Jason's car was putting our something like 230kw atw NA with all standard induction as well.

I am speaking from a "set and forget" perspective. The op can change the plugs now and worry about it in 80, 000km or so. Its a personal preference though. I too use standard plugs and change them more often. Its easy enough to do.

No Max, the std rear bank plugs are the PFR5J-11, not the BKR5EGP. In the J series the factory actually for some unknown reason used Champion but hey, all companies have a dark moment


Really? Just looked at the plugs that came out of my TL at 136,100 km, and they are PFR5G-11. Probably not original then.
Both have the same description on the NGK website, double platinums, and they are bloody expensive compared to the BKR5EGPs!

Nice to know Mitsu put the more expensive double platinums in the cars in the factory though.

In ALL my cars I run the standard copper plugs but change them every 30 or so k, as i am doing it myself it works out per 100k about the same cost or cheaper. A lot of the APRA guys as well as Jason'sVRX who used to work for mits all use the standard copper plugs. Jason's car was putting our something like 230kw atw NA with all standard induction as well.

I've always done all my plugs in all my cars in the past - but that bloomin' intake manifold on the TJ V6 looks intimidating; guess I'll just have to learn to do it and overcome my manifold phobia! :eek2: At least that way I'll be able to go with the plugs that work best - and I have always liked NGK copper plugs!

Steve

I've had a local guy quote us for a Timing kit (with tensioner etc.) $355 and $270 for labour; now I know that Mal is much cheaper for the kit - what's the thinking on this guy's labour charge?

Steve

Steve I think it's not great to barter on the forum.

If your happy with a price and it's local to you then go for it.

I am thinking of doing a DIY guide on this. Stay tuned if you wish.

Deleted post

Steve I think it's not great to barter on the forum.

OK - perhaps in being a relative newb I've transgressed a law that I was unaware of?? BUT - just so we're clear here; I was not bartering - actually just trying to draw down on the combined wisdom available here. I actually consider that this was a pretty valid question? :kb:

I mean I am still shopping around (by phone) and have had prices like: $625, $765 & $1100+ (from Mitsubishi dealer). These are all the complete timing kits (belt, tensioner & idlers) - fitted. This is our first ever experience with fitting a belt and I wanted to bounce off you guys to see what was deemed to be a sensible price?

If someone can explain what is wrong with what I'm trying to achieve - I'm happy to listen?

Steve

Personally I think prowler misunderstood is all.

A sensible price would be around $5-600 I think. The kit is about $250 and $350 in labour is plenty at $80 per hour.

If you wanted to save a bit of dosh, you could buy the kit from RockAuto or the similar and get a local mechanic to do it. Might work out cheaper, although dealerships do come with certain guarantees.

The kit is about $250 and $350 in labour is plenty at $80 per hour.

Hey - I believe in supporting local and Mits-Fix has always assisted with queries etc on here in the past. I was talking the full kit though - is that what you are mentioning?

One of the local guys that's quoting said that they don't usually do the tensioner and idlers on the 100,000 Km, just the belt - is that just being slack?? :confused:

Steve