Raptor Superchargers have just finished a survey on the magna and have come up with a possible kit using there own supercharger. They have not yet installed a s/c to a Magna. Ive been in contact with the owner and this is what they offer.

centrifugal type s/c.
$5000-5500 installed +chip
They pass the car to a Haltec dealer to get tuned. I believe the guys that they get to do it charge about $1200 including the chip, installation, tune/dyno.
12 months warranty on the s/c and workmanship.
they estimate a 70%+ flywheel power increase
description
an alloy tube goes across front of engine, it is mounted along front of front cyl head and on pax side end. Drive pulley protrudes into original belt line and with longer belt is all done. Supercharger is hung directly on other end of drive tube over the transmission of car, SC discharge blows into short pipe then direct into throttle body.

This is a pic of the same setup on a Galant
http://www.ref.com.tw/english/product/images/p1_2/galant2.jpg

Only problem is they are in North Qld and I dont think they have other branches. Local for me but not for most of you. Give them a call if interested and see what they recommend for transport.

"Raptor SC says:
Well, we can CREATE the kit, we have surveyed the situation on what has to be done, but it has not actually been done as yet. So if someone is dead serious then we will talk with them and put our design into the metal for them"

Raptor Superchargers
0409 897 081
raptorsc@westnet.com.au


Alpine Developments make a Kia 2.7L v6 model and have been told by a s/c installer that this particular kit will be a bolt up fit to the 3.5L. I have also emailed them direct and they also believe it will be a bolt on fit. This is a perfect do-it-yourself kit for the mechanical minded. Check it out only $3500.

http://www.alpine-developments.us/id15.html

I believe RPW also make a blower. I would recomend sourcing and contact the closest s/c specialist in your area first.

I think i would have been interested in letting them install the kit on my car but its a bit to far for me to travel to get it done

Raptor s/c sounds rather nice..About the price youd expect to.

At least they would send it off to a tuner to get the maximum out of it.. The sprintex people dont want their stuff tinkered with, makes it sound like they have glass superchargers..


Alpine developments S/C sounds weak.. 38hp atw for $3500.. lol

I reckon that Raptor one would be the best of them, especially with the use of a Haltech ecu.

The raptor is similar to http://www.rippmods.com/products/products_list.asp?menuid=3&vehcId=15 in design. I would love to see this come to fruition. The only attractive thing about the alpine one in higher specs: http://www.alpine-developments.us/scstage2upg.html is the integrated water-air laminova intercooler. I have also been in talks with a local arm of squires turbo systems http://www.ststurbo.com/ about a kit but alas the funds are not there for the next few months.

So what is that picture of? Looks distinctively similar to a 3rd gen engine bay.

FTO??

galant, it says above the pic.

That's the best news I've heard so far about northern queensland and performance parts... Epic win.

North Queensland, As in Townsville ?..... Any further would be a little stretchy lol

for a $5500 kit, they could have at least used a mandrel bend where it goes in the TB. that cut-off 90degree bend is rank as.

for a $5500 kit, they could have at least used a mandrel bend where it goes in the TB. that cut-off 90degree bend is rank as.
I think its more an example of the type of setup. I do agree with you on that nasty bend though.

North Queensland, As in Townsville ?..... Any further would be a little stretchy lol

I've got a feeling they are based in Mackay.

The alpine setup is very similar(almost the same) to the new blower by sprintex on the TMR 380

I've got a feeling they are based in Mackay.
yep thats right... know the bloke who owns it quite well.

i actually emailed ripp last nite about their 6g72 s/c kit. he didn't want to put anything in writing about the fitment to a 6g74, but since they are an almost identical block (deck height is the only diff isn't it) i can't see y not

ive always wanted one of these cept the postage from ripp over here to aus was wayyy to $$$ to justify it.
email sent oh yeh :D

Alpine developments S/C sounds weak.. 38hp atw for $3500.. lol

Thats at 4 pound boost, without intercooling and no chip, put a 1 bar pulley with some new injectors, larger fuel pump, haltech tuned and you will be looking at more power then the raptor.

and to add to my OP that 70% power increase estimate is without intercooling on 8psi.


North Queensland, As in Townsville ?..... Any further would be a little stretchy lol
Mackey based. About 1000km north of Brisbane. 400km South of Townsville.

Thats at 4 pound boost, without intercooling and no chip, put a 1 bar pulley with some new injectors, larger fuel pump, haltech tuned and you will be looking at more power then the raptor.

and to add to my OP that 70% power increase estimate is without intercooling on 8psi.


Mackey based. About 1000km north of Brisbane. 400km South of Townsville.

Mackay Based..... oh thats even better for me, Im up there every second week... If ya could PM me some details with address etc etc Ill be real interested

I've got a feeling they are based in Mackay.

yer mate they are..i know him. he's doing a commo atm. he has just sold his lancer.think it was running high 12 sec 1/4 mile.he's a good bloke and knows what he's doing.

Mackay Based..... oh thats even better for me, Im up there every second week... If ya could PM me some details with address etc etc Ill be real interested

Google (http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q=raptor+superchargers&btnG=Google+Search&meta=) is your friend mate.

Google (http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q=raptor+superchargers&btnG=Google+Search&meta=) is your friend mate.

hey my 2nd cuz made that website for him..:bowrofl: :bowrofl:

would our AFM be a real hassle when super charging?

this thread has really got my interest, as im in the prosess of selling the project car and just spend it on magna sick of having 2 cars in garage.

im also in process of getting headwork done ... so im wondering if there is a difference between NA ported/polished head and the ideal heads set up for s/c ? from what i understand there is no issue yeah? just dont wanna limit myself

once i have s12 issues sorted i am thinknig of looking at a few workshops around adelaide and see what they can do for me at the right price.

this thread is quite interesting

also, if s/c set ups that go on the 2.7 tiburon bolt onto a 3.5L magna then capa also is an alternative as they have a 2.7 set up however im sure its not that easy

I think its more an example of the type of setup. I do agree with you on that nasty bend though.

lol we had that EXACT same bend on our supercharged VN.

The tiburon supercharger unfortunatly is not exactly a bolt on - RPW were looking at these a while ago, I almost bought the (one) kit, but it was going to be a major pain to fit it.

Cheers
Heath Young

The tiburon supercharger unfortunatly is not exactly a bolt on - RPW were looking at these a while ago, I almost bought the (one) kit, but it was going to be a major pain to fit it.

Cheers
Heath Young

Would it just be a matter of a custom lower intake manifold or is it just all wrong.

The runners look too short, and I think the lower manifold would have to offset (supercharger snout is probably too long)

Pic is attached.

Cheers
Heath Young

capa said they could prolly do a kit for me for 7k$... custom and intercooled...

Capa prices = poo

I was bored so i sent an email to raptor superchargers asking how much a kit would cost for a 1st gen.

What sort of kW increase would a stock-standard 3rd Gen TH be looking at?

Thanks. :)

how long is a piece of string

I got an email back from Raptor :)


Hello Nick

We would need your car at our place since it would be a one off kit, an
estimate of pricing would be about $5500 fitted and tuned


Let us know if interested!

Kind regards

Tim Staier

Raptor Superchargers

I think thats pretty damn awesome imo :)

What sort of kW increase would a stock-standard 3rd Gen TH be looking at?

Thanks. :)

I have exact same vehicle, I sent an email to raptor on Monday (I Must say they are brilliant for reply's)... Depending on a certain vehicles release, Im very serious in getting this unit. For the cost of bout 51/2 g's is bloody great price if you ask me.... Power related figure can be anywhere from 60-70% gain at the fly... So a decent power gain imo

they need a test vehicle to size one all up.
it will take approx 4 weeks for them to do it.

so some one up closer should try n be the one to leave the car. its kinda hard for me being down at gold coast. so damo hurry up n drop yur car off to them haha

they need a test vehicle to size one all up.
it will take approx 4 weeks for them to do it.

so some one up closer should try n be the one to leave the car. its kinda hard for me being down at gold coast. so damo hurry up n drop yur car off to them haha


hahaah im in the process of trying to work out dates :D.... Also getting someone to follow me up cos I'll be stuffed if Im staying in Mackay for 4 weeks lol

hahaah im in the process of trying to work out dates :D.... Also getting someone to follow me up cos I'll be stuffed if Im staying in Mackay for 4 weeks lol

sweet. works out better for me if some one else can spare their car for 4 weeks caz i have to drive 50km to work every day

sweet. works out better for me if some one else can spare their car for 4 weeks caz i have to drive 50km to work every day

Didn't you buy yourself another car to run around in?

Didn't you buy yourself another car to run around in?
yep sold that made money off it payed for my crash

Im glad people are going through with it as Raptor pepared the kit for me and another guy in Mackay and we both backed out. Tim is very often online and answering emails, he is also a bit of a forum slu_t and is on msn all the time. PM me if you want his msn addy.

I will have a raptor setup by the end of the year. I want to do a few mods to maxamise the s/c perfermance and recomend anyone else to do the same if they have the spare cash. Some of my premods will be a completely revamped fuel system, new lines, larger injectors and pump and maybe surge tanks. Lower compression cams, higher flow exuast. My aim is 300kw at the fly at 1 bar boost. I will keep you posted about my premods/DIY as I do them.

The runners look too short, and I think the lower manifold would have to offset (supercharger snout is probably too long)

Pic is attached.

Cheers
Heath Young

That will be the only problem I see, this can be overcome by a custom laser cut adaptor plate.

Well I think if someone actually produces a reasonable supercharger kit without large restrictions on what can be done with it at a good price then they will have a fair few sales. For this kind of group also if it can be integrated with existing mods then it will be better received.

In approx 3 weeks, car will be off to Mackay :D.... Talkin with the guys as we speak :D...

I'll take some before (as if you guys dont know what under the bonnet {standard} looks like anyways) Pics n afters.... Hopefully I'll run a b4 n after dyno run aswell ... Ill be in touch

In approx 3 weeks, car will be off to Mackay :D.... Talkin with the guys as we speak :D...

I'll take some before (as if you guys dont know what under the bonnet {standard} looks like anyways) Pics n afters.... Hopefully I'll run a b4 n after dyno run aswell ... Ill be in touch

Great work, Cant wait to see the results.

excellent.

In approx 3 weeks, car will be off to Mackay :D.... Talkin with the guys as we speak :D...

I'll take some before (as if you guys dont know what under the bonnet {standard} looks like anyways) Pics n afters.... Hopefully I'll run a b4 n after dyno run aswell ... Ill be in touch

Can you tell us what spec they are looking at putting into the kit?

How much boost? what sort of intercooling? what sort of engine management system?

Have you / they given consideration to upgrading the fuel system?? I would seriously advise upgrading the fuel pump, pressure regulator and injectors at a minimim. Twin feeds into the fuel rails is worth considering too.

what Tim said to me is no intercooler at 8psi, haltech chip and tuned. Fuel upgrade is not included but I would also recommend that. Intercooling is an option too, not really needed for supercharging.

The initial format is, upgraded injectors, a MAP sensed control (piggyback ECU) of fuel and ignition, 7-8psi boost pressure. Intercooling can come next and will provide gains in hot weather. Fuel system will be checked for pressure consistancy during tuning.

This will be the very first level of kit for the MAGNA V6 3.5, will build on this kit for those who want more.

The initial format is, upgraded injectors, a MAP sensed control (piggyback ECU) of fuel and ignition, 7-8psi boost pressure. Intercooling can come next and will provide gains in hot weather. Fuel system will be checked for pressure consistancy during tuning.

This will be the very first level of kit for the MAGNA V6 3.5, will build on this kit for those who want more.

will u de-build the kit aswell ? like just sell the supercharger, brackets and belt ??

like sprintex would ONLY sell everything in the kit even if you didnt need all of it

The initial format is, upgraded injectors, a MAP sensed control (piggyback ECU) of fuel and ignition, 7-8psi boost pressure. Intercooling can come next and will provide gains in hot weather. Fuel system will be checked for pressure consistancy during tuning.

This will be the very first level of kit for the MAGNA V6 3.5, will build on this kit for those who want more.

Can I suggest an upgraded fuel pump be included?? It's probably more necessary than upgraded injectors.

Or are you going to leave that up to the individual to arrange their own fuel pump?

Meh

That can be done definitely, of course it does not carry guarantee of performance then, if you get a lesser result or some other weird stuff. Let me know what you want ....

It is likely a second party will handle the Magna SC systems in the future, there will only be a limited time that I will retail to customers myself, the second party will use the Raptor system but complete it with their own piggyback, pipework etc.


Blackbeard

I am hearing you, explain the extreme need for pump replacement, cite experiences of your own and what you found ....... we can discuss that

We will monitor pressure at tuning, if pump is deemed insufficient then it would be replaced.

Blackbeard

I am hearing you, explain the extreme need for pump replacement, cite experiences of your own and what you found ....... we can discuss that

We will monitor pressure at tuning, if pump is deemed insufficient then it would be replaced.
I can share my experiences with you

I installed the sprintex blower on my Ralliart and it is supposed to have a bigger pump than a VRX or lesser magna. I maxxed my pump out causing the car to get very lean high in the rev range. The stock pump was fine on the initial test drive by the installers but about a week later when i ran it on a dyno the pump was not coping at all. A brand new Walbro 500HP pump was installed and not a problem since. RRP for one of these unit is around the $200 mark.
If $$$ are avaliable, up the injectors during the install. will save uninstalling the blower just to put new injectors in, and dont forget to do the plugs as well lol

Blackbeard

I am hearing you, explain the extreme need for pump replacement, cite experiences of your own and what you found ....... we can discuss that

We will monitor pressure at tuning, if pump is deemed insufficient then it would be replaced.

My experience is that I'm running a fairly conservative twin turbo setup, and for the cost a larger, aftermarket intank pump - figured it wasn't worth ****ing around and replaced it while the rest of the install was being completed.

I'm now planning on going to a surge tank / external fuel pump setup, but thats not because of fuel pump capacity as much as it is to do with the fuel tank design.

I gotta say the is a pretty useful forum, good answers and people who seem to be interested in taking the development of their favourite brand forward.

TZABOY and Black beard, thanks for input. Understand where people are coming from now in relation to their experience.

The Walbro 255l/ph will heal the problem as suggested.

hey is that you Tim??? if so....about time you signed up!!:D
cheers Brendon

I tell you what, being able to buy only the parts that you would need or want is awsome!
I think you will have another person interested...! and that would be me!

Stacky

You still trolling the forums looking for fast solutions hey :) ....... well you're on the right thread bud.:D

Stacky

You still trolling the forums looking for fast solutions hey :) ....... well you're on the right thread bud.:D
yep sure are:D still havent decided to go N/A or boost yet.....this thread is swaying me tho:P

stacky

As you know about the supercharged Lancer we had ......what do you think we can do with a Magna V6 hey??

A machine like yours would be instant 13 sec zone with just a small dose of boost :badgrin: .

do you guys make custom manifolds for boosted applications?

also are most of your supercharger kits $550 fitted? and also is it possible to run an e-manage wiht your combo and if so what would be the cost with the e-manage suplied by me


thanks

do you guys make custom manifolds for boosted applications?

also are most of your supercharger kits $550 fitted? and also is it possible to run an e-manage wiht your combo and if so what would be the cost with the e-manage suplied by me


thanks

i would also be very interested in this sort of arrangement (most likely different eco though)

do you guys make custom manifolds for boosted applications?

Engines already have manifolds so we don't modify or make new ones, I wonder tho if your thinking of EATON and SPRINTEX type chargers where the manifold has to be modded?


also are most of your supercharger kits $550 fitted?

Were you meaning $5500? And no that is not fitted, most of what we sell is DIY, very easy to install.


and also is it possible to run an e-manage wiht your combo and if so what would be the cost with the e-manage suplied by me

Emanage is not an option in this instance, a Haltech E6X or similar piggybacked is an option, we are using something different again tho .......

The cost, well lets get this first unit out hey and then we will decide what has to be what ............

So a haltech interceptor wouldn't be sufficient? Are you intending to get rid of the stock airflow sensor and just running MAP?

well i just got a charger and thought you guys might have the facilities to customise a manifold, by the way i wasn't talking V6 either,

also curious as to why you don't think e-manage isn't a good option?

If all goes to plan we will be managing most of the RPM band with MAP and the lower end with MAF, airflow meter will be staying.

The piggyback we are intending to use has internal injector drivers which will drive low or high impendance injectors, this gives us the choice of any injector so long as it will fit in.

Whatever piggyback you choose it should have internal injector drivers so it can take TOTAL control of the fuel delivery. Almost no piggybacks have internal injector drivers, that is why HALTECH is often used, however we are using another option.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

well i just got a charger and thought you guys might have the facilities to customise a manifold, by the way i wasn't talking V6 either,

also curious as to why you don't think e-manage isn't a good option?


Ford fella, we are in the dark on what you have purchased and what you want to fit it to, need more details if you want some advice

Emanage .......... its just a signal bender (we have successfully used emange in the past and would use it again but not in every application), SOME factory ECUs learn their way around these and with devastating results, not taking any chances, going full control over the injectors no matter what the factory ECU says :)

pm sent

hey quick question... is this kit going to be fittable to 3 litres or is it another sprintex-esque one that only suits 3.5s..... cos us 3.0s are getting left out....:cry: hahaha
Cheers,
Trav...

Trav

Don't despair, the 3.0s are in, if you got funds it can be yours! :badgrin:

The fitting system will adapt between the 2 engines, only peeps that miss out are the 4 banga drivers

Meh

That can be done definitely, of course it does not carry guarantee of performance then, if you get a lesser result or some other weird stuff. Let me know what you want ....

It is likely a second party will handle the Magna SC systems in the future, there will only be a limited time that I will retail to customers myself, the second party will use the Raptor system but complete it with their own piggyback, pipework etc.


you were speakin with me i believe over email. im all the way down at gold coast.. i already have the fuel upgraded and the ecu and would like to go straight for an intercooler so id just get all the piping made up at once so yeh im just looking for the charger brackets n belts :D

you were speakin with me i believe over email. im all the way down at gold coast.. i already have the fuel upgraded and the ecu and would like to go straight for an intercooler so id just get all the piping made up at once so yeh im just looking for the charger brackets n belts :D
i am too interested i those 3! Charger, brackets and belts!

MEH

Ok, get back to me on email some more and we can figure stuff out more precisely if you are almost ready to give the SC route a go.

Belts, brackets and blower, its easy enough to do, I will provide a list of things/parts which you absolutely will need as well.

Just b4 I ask the question, Ill give you a run down of my situation.... Im in Emerald 400k's from the nearest anything... Would you guys suggest doin a 1/4 mile run b4 n after the fitment of the S/C??...Im goin to get dyno read outs (b4 n after), but not havin a facility near by for the 1/4, I personally couldnt be bothered..... Tim has told me they have em in Mackay on Friday nights, but theres just one drama Im never there on Friday's... Comments?

As for the installation of an intercooler, I havent gone as far as that, Im looking at changing the front bar at the same time as gettin the SC fitted (the guys r in mackay aswell)... If I can get my hands on the bar, well the intercooler might just have to be fitted :D... Tim you might know more in regards to the heat factor, were pretty bloody hot out here, being in Mackay you guys arent much different, do ya think I/Cooler would help ??

We are going for a 400 - 450cc injector in this application, more than large enough for 6-7psi.

Damn this thread is packed with info now, good to see you on the forum now Tim.

We are going for a 400 - 450cc injector in this application, more than large enough for 6-7psi.

Thats the capacity injectors I'm running - and according to my tuner, there's more than enough fuel for what I intend to do with the car in the near future.

Thanks bigs

We will see what can be done for the Magna community, we will do the right pricing and if there is interest and sales we will stay around

Pretty certain the cars will go hard, I mean they are quicker than Fords and Holdens in the same class ........... as no doubt you already know ....... with some nice boost more ........... :badgrin: :badgrin: will happen

There is no doubt about the interest in forced induction magnas.

I for one would love to fit a s/c under the bonnet, but like everybody else, do not have the money atm. Now this thread isnt very old, only this year, How long do you think this offer will stand?

As soon as i get the necessary moolah for this, i will sign up straight away. Im sure im not the only one in this situation, just need time to save.

sorry i cant remember but i have read this whole thread...

Have we been told what type of s/c will be used and how is it supposed to be mounted.

I'd say 80% of people would prefer an intercooled set up purely for assurance.

Personally im running off a MAP sensor and want to go forced ind. i'm looking at getting some TT manifolds and turbos then i'll see what's more cost effective between that and one of these one off kits....

sorry i cant remember but i have read this whole thread...

Have we been told what type of s/c will be used and how is it supposed to be mounted.

I'd say 80% of people would prefer an intercooled set up purely for assurance.

Personally im running off a MAP sensor and want to go forced ind. i'm looking at getting some TT manifolds and turbos then i'll see what's more cost effective between that and one of these one off kits....

Raptor deal in centrofugal type superchargers (the ones that look like a turbo compressor housing run off a belt). I'm guessing it will be mounted at the pulley end of the engine and piping will plumb the air along the front side of the engine, and do two 90 deg bends before entering the throttle body. If thats the way it's going - it wouldn't be hard to modify the pipe work to run it thru an intercooler.

Either way - the battery will probably need to be relocated, and something will probably need to be done with the factory windscreen washer bottle, damn thing takes up so much valuable space.

Raptor deal in centrofugal type superchargers (the ones that look like a turbo compressor housing run off a belt). I'm guessing it will be mounted at the pulley end of the engine and piping will plumb the air along the front side of the engine, and do two 90 deg bends before entering the throttle body. If thats the way it's going - it wouldn't be hard to modify the pipe work to run it thru an intercooler.

Either way - the battery will probably need to be relocated, and something will probably need to be done with the factory windscreen washer bottle, damn thing takes up so much valuable space.

Ey beard man, you seem to be knowledgeable on these type of things.... When ya talking intercooler, are they are specific designs to go for??... Size etc etc ??.. Id like to do the intercooling option but like i said b4 its gunna depend on if I can get a hold of the new front bar

Ey beard man, you seem to be knowledgeable on these type of things.... When ya talking intercooler, are they are specific designs to go for??... Size etc etc ??.. Id like to do the intercooling option but like i said b4 its gunna depend on if I can get a hold of the new front bar

I got a 450x300x76mm "hybrid" (aka generic brand) intercooler squeezed under my factory front bar with little more than having to "shave" about 15mm out of the reo, and a few bits of the front bar skin (down the bottom mostly). Mine has 3" inlets and outlets, and they are inline with each other (as opposed to offset - 1 at the bottom, 1 at the top), and the cooler is mounted "upside down" so the inlet and outlet are both at the top. Managed to get the silicone bends thru a gap in the end of the chasis rails, just under each headlight - so no holes were needed to be cut, and I didn't have to run pipes under the radiator support cross member (which would have been dicey considering how low my car is).

There's a 7 million page thread somewhere on here about the progress of building my car - pretty sure it has pics of the intercooler hooked up with the front bar off to give you an idea of whats possible.

*edit: pics here (http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showpost.php?p=554453&postcount=75)*

We are going for a 400 - 450cc injector in this application, more than large enough for 6-7psi.

hi.

tim is it?

will you be responsible in introducing s/c for magnas?

i always thought the ~$7000 for the sprintex was a bit dear.

i will be intrested in how this goes and having one installed.

There's a 7 million page thread somewhere on here about the progress of building my car - pretty sure it has pics of the intercooler hooked up with the front bar off to give you an idea of whats possible.

*edit: pics here (http://www.aussiemagna.com/forums/showpost.php?p=554453&postcount=75)*
got a pic with the front bar on? hows the airflow like?

got a pic with the front bar on? hows the airflow like?

Airflow?? what airflow? (what intercooler for that matter lol )

http://img74.imageshack.us/img74/8470/frontonsq5.th.jpg (http://img74.imageshack.us/my.php?image=frontonsq5.jpg)

hi.

tim is it?

will you be responsible in introducing s/c for magnas?

This is Tim :)

Any one wanting a rough idea of how the system will be mounted should view the first page of this thread. It will have some resemblence to that.

just in respect to the sprintex blower and the cost of the sprintex kit


the blower is a sweedish made positive displacment blower of very high quality (opcon autorotor) and not some 2cent eaton or roots style knock off, so i think if sprintex used a povo blower like the yella terra one there would be some $$$ to be saved there...

just in respect to the sprintex blower and the cost of the sprintex kit


the blower is a sweedish made positive displacment blower of very high quality (opcon autorotor) and not some 2cent eaton or roots style knock off, so i think if sprintex used a povo blower like the yella terra one there would be some $$$ to be saved there...
awesome.... just awesome....

We haven't had the chance to work with an engine of 9.0:1 compression ratio in ages, so much scope for a ripper outcome. Oh what fun ....... lol

Most new engines are around 10:1 or more which make supercharging/turbocharging of the stock motor near impossible.

Well I have thought about the intercooling thing, thought stuff it, lets get it done while the blower is gettn fitted..... jst emailed the timster at raptor, bloody quick response aswell (As always).....


This is for Blackbeard : Mate how much did you have to cut to fit ya I/Cooler, Im wanting to get as much information as possible to I can pass it onto Tim.

Saawweeeettt Thks

OK getting into this now :cool:

Added a section to the website http://www.raptorsc.com.au/kits.php?id=35

Also attaching a file with pressure and intercooler options (theoretical/software generated)

From our experience the numbers are likely to be ahieved without too much hassle.

What is shown is Kw at the motor, which will translate into HP at the wheels, ie 250Kw on the motor is approx 250Hp on wheels roughly

This whole topic looks awsome guys well done for trying something new!
I am moving upto Port Douglas to work for a year so by the end or mid way through i wouldnt mind strapping on one of these babies!
props for the information Tradewind.

keep it up guys
jimmy

futher mucker.... 250kw over 400 pound torque... Sht a brick, anyone now of good suspension joints so I can keep the front wheels on the ground lol.. Ill be happy with the 6psi n intercooler :D

This is for Blackbeard : Mate how much did you have to cut to fit ya I/Cooler, Im wanting to get as much information as possible to I can pass it onto Tim.



Damo,

I replied to your PM, but for the benefit of anyone else who is interested in going down this path - here's some info on how my I/C is rigged up:


If you've seen the pics of my car with the intercooler fitter, and the front bar removed - that should give you a pretty good idea of how we mounted and plumbed the cooler itself. The cooler used in my application is a 450x300x76mm core (a pretty standard size).

The following things had to be relocated / modified to fit the piping:
* washer bottle (replaced with a much smaller "universal washer bottle" sourced from supercheap auto for about $35)
* Battery (turned 90deg in it's original position to allow more room for the pipes)
* some aluminum cylinder to do with the airconditioner system...... it is located sort of under the factory air intake snorkel. (this had to be moved slightly because it was in the way of the pipe comming out of the intercooler on the T/B side of the engine bay - it was just a matter of carefully bending the metal pipes connected to it - and mounting it in a different position on the car body)
* front reo bar and skin. (the reo had to have about 15-20mm "shaved" out of it to fit around the top of the intercooler - this didn't cause any issues with the compliance inspection. Some parts of the front bumper had to be "shaved" as well but that didn't cause much of an issue.

Damo,

I replied to your PM, but for the benefit of anyone else who is interested in going down this path - here's some info on how my I/C is rigged up:

the alloy cylinder is called a receiver/dryer.

it is the only means of filtration and demoisturising the A/C charge in an A/C system.

the alloy cylinder is called a receiver/dryer.

it is the only means of filtration and demoisturising the A/C charge in an A/C system.

Thats the do-hickey :D

Sweeet man thks again for the reply, I have emailed the guys with the information... We will see what comes out of it.... Also just paid deposit for new front bar, in bout a months time the car will have a totally different look... Front bar, twin exhaust vrx rear bar, twin exhaust tips... oh n I almost forgot, some new breathing apparatis :D

Any movement on this?

There absolutely and certainly has been. The piggyback ECU has been developed and manufactured, this officially means the project is on its way. It should be waiting for us to pick up as we speak, expect the whole thing to take place over the next 8 weeks, might seem like a wait but I can assure you it will continue move forward

Dont mind waiting :D... Ive waited 5yrs to do it already hahah... so 2 mnths meh big deal :D... Ill have my new ute to play around with while car is gettn done

There absolutely and certainly has been. The piggyback ECU has been developed and manufactured, this officially means the project is on its way. It should be waiting for us to pick up as we speak, expect the whole thing to take place over the next 8 weeks, might seem like a wait but I can assure you it will continue move forward

This might be a stupid question, but why go to all the trouble and expense of "developing and manufacturing" a piggyback ECU for this application when there are at least 2 commonly available piggyback ECU's on the market which have been used and proven effective on 3rd gen magnas?

This might be a stupid question, but why go to all the trouble and expense of "developing and manufacturing" a piggyback ECU for this application when there are at least 2 commonly available piggyback ECU's on the market which have been used and proven effective on 3rd gen magnas?
:stoopid:

Hey guys just an update, recieved as of today, I have posted a pic of hardware n software

This ECU has an inbuild 24psi MAP sensor with injector drivers (can operate as a standalone when in boost) and full ignition control, it does have other built in functions that can be used to trigger water sprays, NOS and such like

Phase one completed.. :D

For other Magna owners with SCs already installed you should probably looking at this piggyback ECU if you are having tuning issues, this is very simple to install and use and you can have whatever size injectors you need, toss away the 7th injector or whatever and get this on.

You will be so happy that you will wonder how you did without it, I kid you not based on past experience with other makes.

toss away the 7th injector
Thank God someone who's finally on the right page!!

RIPP had lots of tuning hassles forcing air thru the maf, can you set it up to pull the air thru the maf before the SC? What about a reverse SC to take the air straight down to the front bar. A custom intercooler with a "C" path so the air can return to the OEM located TB on a stock plenum.

Any chance of posting a compressor map please.

Cost of supply for bracket, shaft, oil lines, belt and pulley(s) only??

Thanks for taking the time, and welcome to the fray. :cool:

Thank God someone who's finally on the right page!!

Cost of supply for bracket, shaft, oil lines, belt and pulley(s) only??



Hehehe seems you have a similar idea as me Ian.
I emailed them saturday with the same request/enquiry as i want to know a price. :)

I was thinking of doing a water to air intercooler setup if i went this style of supercharger.

Hehehe seems you have a similar idea as me Ian.
I emailed them saturday with the same request/enquiry as i want to know a price. :)

I was thinking of doing a water to air intercooler setup if i went this style of supercharger.

Why did you think I've been picking your brains for the last 2months :D

PWR water-air would be smicko but I'm nervous about the prospect of the barrel cracking or some drama that would a) dump water into my engine OR b) the water pump fail and a lean out at 12psi and 5000rpm. I only want to but one set of no-BS rods and pistons if I can help it.

Why did you think I've been picking your brains for the last 2months :D

PWR water-air would be smicko but I'm nervous about the prospect of the barrel cracking or some drama that would a) dump water into my engine OR b) the water pump fail and a lean out at 12psi and 5000rpm. I only want to but one set of no-BS rods and pistons if I can help it.

Water entering shouldnt happen if the actual heat exchanger is made correctly and as for the pump failing, well that would be no different to the guys that run water injection kits if theres fails.

CAPA uses the PWR style bullet water to air coolers on there intercooled S/C kits and on there some of there XR6Turbo kits, they seem to work very well and efficently and are more easily fitted when space is limited.

Why did you think I've been picking your brains for the last 2months :D

PWR water-air would be smicko but I'm nervous about the prospect of the barrel cracking or some drama that would a) dump water into my engine OR b) the water pump fail and a lean out at 12psi and 5000rpm. I only want to but one set of no-BS rods and pistons if I can help it.


im also waiting on this price of things hehe :cool: great minds think alike i beleive :D

Water entering shouldnt happen if the actual heat exchanger is made correctly and as for the pump failing, well that would be no different to the guys that run water injection kits if theres fails.

CAPA uses the PWR style bullet water to air coolers on there intercooled S/C kits and on there some of there XR6Turbo kits, they seem to work very well and efficently and are more easily fitted when space is limited.

The less moving parts the better imo. Water to air with a good sized reservour should be more consistent than air to air (at removing heat) from the material I've read and life experiences, but doesn't convince me to jump on board considering the detrimental downsides of component failure.

Although in favour of water to air is the large number of earthmoving and similar equipment now utilising it quite comfortably. :confused:


If an air to air breaks you just lose boost. If water to air breaks your engine gets to die too. :cry:

Injecting water, methanol, fuel etc into the air stream is just too patchwork for me. Gets the job done, but it doesn't give you much ceiling for boost increases.

Why has this thread suddenly gone dry??

hopefully because they are working hard on the set up rather then sitting on forums :D

for those who mentioned to toss the 7th injector :nuts:

on the twin screw blower its there for a reason, find out for youselfs, but it's necessary.

for those who mentioned to toss the 7th injector :nuts:

on the twin screw blower its there for a reason, find out for youselfs, but it's necessary.
I know, there are just more reliable, efficient and upgradable ways to achieve increased fuel and reduced inlet charge temperature hence the opportunity to run higher boosting. The problem is just with twin screws being largely unforgiving with placement.

Yea from what ive heard and read, the 7th injector is just a cheap shortcut, and have bad long term effects on an engine. Having injector controlled ecu with larger injectors if needed is the better way to go imo.

farout, i was just going through stuff etc on turboing cars, i'm starting to see the hassel of turbong a non turbo car, i mean, the kit itself isn't overly expensive, but the labour, then the engineering cert, then you need bigger brakes, a heavy duty clutch and good rubber to put it all down on the pavment, then you need labour for that as well, and then this is only half legal, then you have to get epa test, and if you find out that thats bung, then you need to fork out what ever needs to be done for that to get passed so you can drive around again, **** its so much hassle, you better off buying an alreay turbo'd car,
i believe supercharging is far easier to do,

i wanted to say that rahter then start a new thread,

labour, then the engineering cert, then you need bigger brakes, a heavy duty clutch and good rubber to put it all down on the pavment, then you need labour for that as well, and then this is only half legal, then you have to get epa test

I seem to be a real 'negative norbert' today...

...but dude, you'd have to do all these things to bolt on a supercharger to your car... the real difference is in power delivery. The Sprintex kit is cheaper (its still 8 grand though...) because it's a kit thats been put through 'mass' (I use the word loosely... but yaknowhatImean, haha) production.

Anyhow, I dont wanna ruin this thread. Sounds like a lot of good is coming from it! I'm excited to see the end result.

:D

The Sprintex kit is cheaper
Cheaper? Sprintex? :confused:

Cheaper? Sprintex? :confused:

:bowrofl:

Hahaha, you know what I mean. Say, compared to Black Beards install.

Yea from what ive heard and read, the 7th injector is just a cheap shortcut, and have bad long term effects on an engine. Having injector controlled ecu with larger injectors if needed is the better way to go imo.

At least with a V6 you only have to replace 6 holed pistons and 6 bent rods when the injector fails to open at full boost :doubt: Good opportunity to get those forged items.....

Just to keep you guys informed....

Raptor are currently seeking an old 6G74 motor (preferably stuffed)... This is so they can fit the charger onto that motor to get it all fitted correctly etc etc... Then bolt it straight onto mine. If anyone has any idea of a rooted 6G74 can they let me or Tradewind know about it.

Thats about it for now :D

Just to keep you guys informed....

Raptor are currently seeking an old 6G74 motor (preferably stuffed)... This is so they can fit the charger onto that motor to get it all fitted correctly etc etc... Then bolt it straight onto mine. If anyone has any idea of a rooted 6G74 can they let me or Tradewind know about it.

Thats about it for now :D

Or perhaps a running motor they can leave it on.....:D

i got a stuffed 6g72 sitting here

They don't have wreckers in Mackay?? how odd.

there is about 12 in the area. We even have a local 1300 wrecking hotline.

there is about 12 in the area. We even have a local 1300 wrecking hotline.

Which is why I'm having trouble understanding how this is holding up the progess of test fitting this kit.

Which is why I'm having trouble understanding how this is holding up the progess of test fitting this kit.

Process: Tim has one from Mackay, hes just waiting too see if its available

Or perhaps a running motor they can leave it on.....:D

This is what I thought they wanted too do .... but me being the dumb sht that Iam sent em an email asking why would they do this??... Then they explained what they were doin... Dead set I could of crawled thru a mouse hole

any updates? any progress?

any updates? any progress?
:stoopid:

No progress, we are still chasing a stuffed 6g74 motor... Looks as thou the one at Mackay has fallen thru...

If there is anyone out there that can get a hold of a stuffed motor please let us know...

I would love this to be going by the time I bugger off for me honeymoon... If not I might just kick it in the butt

are they sure they dont want a 6g72 ???????

are they sure they dont want a 6g72 ???????
The only difference I understand is the 6G74 block is 15mm taller. Same heads etc. We used 2x pieces of timber to get the height when I made the extractors for my AWD.

Additionally the 380 heads are Ralliart 6G74 heads complete with cams etc....

Still waiting to see a compressor map too please gents. :cool:

Time passes but just sorting out a few details with MEH on the engine. If all checks out ok we will try and pick it up ASAP.

Compressor map, we won't be releasing the compressor map/s to anyone, they are intellectual property and once certain people have them they can understand what can be done and then .............. yes, just look on ebay for what happens!!


The results of the sytem will speak for themselves, especially with intercooling, the Raptor V SC produces high power for boost results on almost anything it is fitted to. Just waiting on getting the engine and then the process will be full steam ahead.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

there is about 12 in the area. We even have a local 1300 wrecking hotline

Bigs let me know where a motor is and i will get it right away, the one I had lined up fell through.

Blackbeard

Yes we have them but they ain't exactly full of lateish model Magnas, or lateish model anything much!

Well I can answer that

If motor is rattly in the bottom end but has all accessories like PS, AC and so on then $850 is what the wreckers are asking :rant:

This one is ok for the job, still more $$$ than we need to spend

http://www.autotrader.com.au/iteminfo/adnumber_W789033381776_kw_Magna_loc_locRZSQregtAVS CdistRZSQAVSCstateRZSQ4AVSCregRZSQ_off_46_sect_Aut omotive_sort_otRZSQ0BJDZfdRZSQSellingPrice_sqt_0_s tpg_1_subs_Used+Cars_

Ok guys, unfortunalty the motor that 'Meh' had for us wont be sufficient for what Raptor would like to do.... Raptor currently have a few feelers out looking for another motor, if anyone out there has a screwed 72 or 74 motor and they can part with it, please let myself or 'Tradewind' know....

Im realllllyyyy keen to get this done, but looks as thou I wont be able to do anything till after I get back from the honeymoon (As I leave in 2 weeks)

Any help would be greatly appreciated :D

damn.

don’t they want a guineapig car to work onlol

You buying or looking for a simple give away?

Ive got a 6G72 in my TF that, although it still runs, its on it last legs. It aint dead yet but I tell ya if you took it for a good thrash... Oh yea she'd be stuffed.

Would you want a 3.0L motor from down here in Melbourne? At a price of course.

they need one with air con, powersteering and alternator on it. for the belt lengths.

so keep that in mind aswell ppls :)

http://www.pickles.com.au/auctiontt.html

try pickles i no it is in townsville or brisbane but i often see 3rd gen magnas go through it

a couple in Brisbane on sale tomorrow...

TH Exec with 6g74 (http://www.pickles.com.au/servlet/Auction/VehicleDetail?item_id=970001842)

TH Altera with questionable use (http://www.pickles.com.au/servlet/Auction/VehicleDetail?item_id=970001902)

cheers,
.wook

Tim i went back to get price etc on the 6g72 you asked about, they have two avail actuelly one from a 93 and one a 96 verada. I personally know the wrecker owners so they let me go in a look see and take some photos. I notice the 6g72 is a mirror image of the 6g74, the gearbox and acc belt is on the opossite sides to the gen3 6g74. I figured there is no point as the only reason you want this is for the belt and shaft assembly. If you still want it they have all pumps still and they dont know if its working so i could prolly get it for cheap. Ill post the phone pics i took

Tim i went back to get price etc on the 6g72 you asked about, they have two avail actuelly one from a 93 and one a 96 verada. I personally know the wrecker owners so they let me go in a look see and take some photos. I notice the 6g72 is a mirror image of the 6g74, the gearbox and acc belt is on the opossite sides to the gen3 6g74. I figured there is no point as the only reason you want this is for the belt and shaft assembly. If you still want it they have all pumps still and they dont know if its working so i could prolly get it for cheap. Ill post the phone pics i took

V6's in the 2nd gens was the oposite way around to the v6's in the 3rd gens. So if they are going to use a 6g72 for test fitment, it will need to come out of a 3rd gen.

im no genious when it comes to turbo/ sc this thread is really the most ive read up on them
but i was woundering which are the bettter option im leaning towards the SC because i gater it would take up less room then a turbo and also would the air from a SC be cooler then the air from a turbo due to the fact that a turbo has the heat from the zorst just curious

toocky

im no genious when it comes to turbo/ sc this thread is really the most ive read up on them
but i was woundering which are the bettter option im leaning towards the SC because i gater it would take up less room then a turbo and also would the air from a SC be cooler then the air from a turbo due to the fact that a turbo has the heat from the zorst just curious

toocky

I have been told the turbo's run too damn hot under the magna bonnet due too lack of air gettin into the bay n removing it... But in saying that there are a few magna's with the turbo's to which have had very little problems.. Im goin down the S/C path cos I already have my turbo ute. Turbo's generally have lag (have to get revs before turbo fires up), where the S/C is generally instant power... pls correct me anyone if I have it screwed up

I have been told the turbo's run too damn hot under the magna bonnet due too lack of air gettin into the bay n removing it... But in saying that there are a few magna's with the turbo's to which have had very little problems.. Im goin down the S/C path cos I already have my turbo ute. Turbo's generally have lag (have to get revs before turbo fires up), where the S/C is generally instant power... pls correct me anyone if I have it screwed up

From what I understand the Raptor Supercharger will behave in a similar manner to a turbocharger in the sense that boost is propertional to RPM. The difference being the Raptor is proportional to engine RPM. and continue to develop boost theoretically to redline. So the power buildup will not be smack in your face at low RPM's.

This is in contrast to the twin screw type - positive displacement (Ex-sprintex kit) which develops it's maximum boost earlier in the rev range and holds it till redline.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercharger

But I'm not expert on boost either.

Monster Inc is basically correct, the power builds as you gain rpm, this is extremely kind to the drivetrain as the torque comes in when RPM is up the scale somewhat. However if you have a manual car you

However, we applied Raptor V to a Lancer 1.8 2002 model and had no trouble flogging Gen 3 5.7 liter holdens all over the place (vids on youtube), so essentially this will do big things for a Magna, especially so in manual form :D

The SC is definitely a cool (tempwise) option, lower cost, and should be fast to fit (we will work on making it fast to fit), all in all what Holden owners have been experiencing with Raptor kits for a while now.

It will be a good thing and the power outputs will be impressive, they always are when using Raptor V! :D

More info :D

The car was stock (including tyres/rims) apart from exhaust, HD clutch and 10 psi kit on stock engine. Otherwise everything the same as day we bought it brand new!

13.9@101 and that was with wheel spin to 3rd ...... you can hear this in the vid. Car was exceptionally quick once wheelspin could be contained, on a staged start a much faster car could never run the Lancer down due it having got through some of the wheelspin stage. Remember racing a 12 sec WRX one night, he said I'll give you a 1 second start (thinking he could still arrive with time to spare) and there was no way in hell he could match us through the top end, in fact our rate of acceleration was identical above 140kmh ........... he was suprised :D

So what sort of power is this little lancer getting at the wheels...???

There is lots of quick lancers getting around now.. mate as one that is turbo charged and runnign 12s..:)

cmon hurry up n get this goin...... :cool: lol

im sure there's gotta be one stuffed anging floating round aus some where

So what sort of power is this little lancer getting at the wheels...???

There is lots of quick lancers getting around now.. mate as one that is turbo charged and runnign 12s..:)
cant remember what ur best time was tim?? low 14 i think?? jus a note tho, his times are on the mackay strip.. a very slow track for some reason!! i did a 15.2 there and 14.6 at willowbank with out changing a thing!!

Stacky

Can't you read mate :cool: , 13.9 was the time on Mackay, but as you say it would be much faster on southern strips. Time slip will be attached to this post, it will show 100 mph however on several occasions running 14.0xx times we ran 101mph.

For those not in the know Stacky was around when we had the Lancer happening and actually raced us a time or two, not that he had any chance of winning tho :D but a lot of people suddenly discovered how quick a manual Magna 3.5 could be.

I believe every Magna manual with extractors, good exhaust and supercharger system (not intercooled) could pull mid 13s if driver is on the job.


Just another note I thought of, there is a Mirage with Raptor Supercharger fitted and 2L engine (4G94) that runs 12 second quarters time after time

For those who are interested in the before n after stats....

Ran power run dyno today, grabbed 117k (atw)... holy crap I have never heard my car outside at 200k's....

Cost me $60.00.

Tim, If you happen to read this I'll email ya the slip when I get back to emerald (Havent got a scanner with me up here)

Damo

Thats no problem, would be what most people would expect from the 3.5 hey, put the chart up here will do, I can always get the chart from the shop should I need it before we get the SC on

:D

how come on your website raptorsc.com.au you have a link to magna 3.0 and 3.5 S/C and even include power outputs? has your S/C been fitted to a magna yet?? sorry if this has been discussed earlier, this thread is massive, i dont have the time to read the whole thing.. i am very keen for a s/c though..

Damo

Thats no problem, would be what most people would expect from the 3.5 hey, put the chart up here will do, I can always get the chart from the shop should I need it before we get the SC on

:D

Not a problem at all, to be honest I didnt know what too expect from her as I have never done a dyno run b4, he said thats not too bad out of a magna... Next time he wants too see 200 ..... :shock: lol

how come on your website raptorsc.com.au you have a link to magna 3.0 and 3.5 S/C and even include power outputs? has your S/C been fitted to a magna yet?? sorry if this has been discussed earlier, this thread is massive, i dont have the time to read the whole thing.. i am very keen for a s/c though..

previously in the thread tim posted up the print screen of a program that is suposed to calculate the expected results atm all results are theoretical

Yes the power charts/possible results shown earlier in this thread ARE theoretical, however the figures (for volumetric efficiency etc etc) are adjusted in line with past results. The program is often very close and sometimes is under as it has been with Holden V6 3.8 Ecotec. We have a reasonable database of engines and what they give with a Raptor attached to them, always good to reference against.

Talking with Magna Wreck at Currumbin on the Gold Coast, they do have what I need, just working on freight costs at present. Should know Thursday.

tim ive got a thought to out to you y dont you buy a 3rd gen as a test mule and then after the SC project is finished you can continue to make goodies for all us 3rd gen owners and yes we probably would love you:D :D

Toocky

I reckon your suggestion is a strong one, I would quite enjoy a Magna 3.5 manual, at the moment the only Mits I have is an early Pajero 2.6, the Lancer was swapped for a Commy.

If the market is strong it will happen, thats why I have a Commodore, that market is good and having our own development car clearly allows us to make more developments and prove the worth of them.

A machine like this would suffice

http://www.carsales.com.au/used-cars/private/MITSUBISHI/MAGNA/details.aspx?__Ns=pCar_PrivateSpecialFlag_Int32|1| |pCar_ImageCount_Int32|1||pCar_LastModifiedDate_Da teTime|1&Make=MITSUBISHI&__Nne=20&State=Queensland&R=1057287&state_id=79&__N=4294964597+79+4294964374+834+285+257&distance=25&__Dx=mode+matchany&trecs=8&Model=MAGNA&__sid=1121ACCAE8A8&__Ntk=CarAll&silo=1003&keywords=3.5%20Manual&Cr=3&__D=3.5%20Manual&seot=0&__Ntt=3.5%20Manual&__Ntx=mode+matchallpartial

Sorry if this has been answered, but will this kit include an intercooler? If not will it be possible to add one?

There will be 2 systems, there may be additional levels of power later on, however most people would of course like to be cooled but budget ultimately determines what a customer will buy.

1.The non intercooled system (ProStreet)

2. The intercooled system (ProStreet Intercooled)

Would you like to spitball a possible price at this stage for the intercooled package?

Not familiar enough with these cars yet to comment, sorry man. Will talk about it when I get my hands on one

Based on my experience, intercooler setup would cost roughly $1200 if stainless piping is used. It isn't really alot of money in the grand scheme of things.

I will be going down the path of intercooling, just had new bar fitted too accomodate it...

Tim, Mate just too let ya know, Im heading off on the 2nd May (wont have internet access) I get back on the 4th June... Hopefully I can access Emails when I arrive back in Australia, so if there is any problems or something ya wanna throw my way please email me and I'll hopefully answer you as soon as possible :D

A machine like this would suffice

http://www.carsales.com.au/used-cars/private/MITSUBISHI/MAGNA/details.aspx?__Ns=pCar_PrivateSpecialFlag_Int32|1| |pCar_ImageCount_Int32|1||pCar_LastModifiedDate_Da teTime|1&Make=MITSUBISHI&__Nne=20&State=Queensland&R=1057287&state_id=79&__N=4294964597+79+4294964374+834+285+257&distance=25&__Dx=mode+matchany&trecs=8&Model=MAGNA&__sid=1121ACCAE8A8&__Ntk=CarAll&silo=1003&keywords=3.5%20Manual&Cr=3&__D=3.5%20Manual&seot=0&__Ntt=3.5%20Manual&__Ntx=mode+matchallpartial
id say go for it as you can obviously see there is quit a bit of interest in your SC alone so if 1/4 of all the people that have expressed an interest get one that should cover you investment and then there is the thought of more mods

cheers toocky

If you want a whole car Tim ive got a mate here in airlie selling his 1997 3rd gen, just redone the rego, 4 brand new tires, goes fine. I think he said $4000. I can investigate if you wish. Better then buying a $10k one 1300km away. Good to play with and sell off when your done.

If you want a whole car Tim ive got a mate here in airlie selling his 1997 3rd gen, just redone the rego, 4 brand new tires, goes fine. I think he said $4000. I can investigate if you wish. Better then buying a $10k one 1300km away. Good to play with and sell off when your done.

is it 3.5 or 3L im guessing the latter but i wouldnt mind if it was

is it 3.5 or 3L im guessing the latter but i wouldnt mind if it was

97 3rd gen would be 3.0L... 3.5L didnt come out till 99... Dont quote me but im pretty sure that pretty close

How about on a 1st gen ?

97 3rd gen would be 3.0L... 3.5L didnt come out till 99... Dont quote me but im pretty sure that pretty close
try 98 in the TH

try 98 in the TH


Try 96 in the KE Verada....

I know they trialed the 3.5 in the Challenger in 97, but didnt know bout '96... wow ohh well there ya go, maybe it could be a 3.5L

I know they trialed the 3.5 in the Challenger in 97, but didnt know bout '96... wow ohh well there ya go, maybe it could be a 3.5L


only if it is a VERADA

its a 3.5

my bad its a 97' 3.0 ltr.

With your intercooled kit you guys would not have taken into account the TL and TW magnas having a different radiator support and other front end differences for piping would you?

OK, good news and bad news .......... maybe

Good news, we located an engine 7kms away

Bad news is its 3.0 litre but it does have all its belts on drivers side as it should. I am prepared to start with this

Can someone put up a couple of engine bay pics from the front drivers side area of engine bay please ............ I want to check for likenesses prior to purchasing this engine.

Waiting for your images

OK, good news and bad news .......... maybe

Good news, we located an engine 7kms away

Bad news is its 3.0 litre but it does have all its belts on drivers side as it should. I am prepared to start with this

Can someone put up a couple of engine bay pics from the front drivers side area of engine bay please ............ I want to check for likenesses prior to purchasing this engine.

Waiting for your images

i hope the kit your going to be developing will fit a 3.5litre with no dramas as this will be the majority of your sales..

OK, good news and bad news .......... maybe

Good news, we located an engine 7kms away

Bad news is its 3.0 litre but it does have all its belts on drivers side as it should. I am prepared to start with this

Can someone put up a couple of engine bay pics from the front drivers side area of engine bay please ............ I want to check for likenesses prior to purchasing this engine.

Waiting for your images

shall post some up tomorrow about 3ish if nobody else does. this is wonderful news for us.

Comn people :)

Waiting for your images

Thanks in advance

What *exactly* do you need to see? I am off for 2 days so I can get snappy for you. :cool:

What I "need" to see is a shot from a 3.0 and a 3.5 from direct overhead in the region of the alternator. Don't zoom in too close if the shot takes in half the engine bay on the drivers side that is perfect.

Looking forward to some shots :)

This is what I found on my hdd, Ill take more specific shots when i get the chance.

http://bigs.omfg.net.au/pics/19122006010.jpg

And that chance is now... clicky (http://bigs.omfg.net.au/pics/raptor/)

Bigs

Mate that is extremely awesome, the 10639 image is a ripper, SPOT ON, I will compare that to the 3.0 I am looking at and will get the show on the road.

Thanx again

This is what I found on my hdd, Ill take more specific shots when i get the chance.



whats with the match box on the engine??

planning an insurance job lol

whats with the match box on the engine??

planning an insurance job lol

size comparison? :bowrofl:

np Tim.


whats with the match box on the engine??

planning an insurance job lol

New mod ive been working on. It spaces the manifold with the bonnet protector getting better aerodynamics and adds 0.1 seconds on my 400m dash times, check it out. (http://piv.pivpiv.dk/)

Hi Tradewind, I have just emailed 6pics to you. Let me know if they're what you're after. :cool:

Well I have to say I've been watching this with great anticipation. Can't wait to see the results. Hopefully I won't have to re-morgage the house. :D

id like to get more of an understanding as to why an emanage wont work.. i have one already and dont really want to replace it for no reason... RPW are running their twin turbo 3.5 litre on an emanage and its putting out far more power than these S/C plan to do... so i dont see why an emanage is incapable of running with the raptor S/C....

You can run emanage, Raptor just cant give you warranty on the chip. As im aware they dont give full fuel control. I think the rpw magna has broken the 400kw mark so if they use it I dont see the prob.

The emanage was so succesful on the twin turbo magna that we blew two engines up with it before we realised what the problem was - it wsa the emanage.

Essentially without going into major detail any piggy back ECU which tunes on a magna is incompatible with a forced induction setup.

The reason being they firstly tune in a throttle position V RPM mode, or even on the emanage a MAP Sensor value V RPM mode.

The fundamental reason why the emanage, haltech interceptor and any othe rpiggy back won't work on any Mitsbishi Model vehicle running an airflow meter is very simple. You have two completely different and incompatible forms of tuning happening.

Factory ECU is tuning via air flow VOLUME via the air flow meter. Volume varies greatly depending upon load, throttle position, rpm etc. In other words it is not a constant.

Now when running a forced induction car, this works purely on vacuem or boost pressure which is a constant. The problem is this is a constant.

Now the problem is that when tuning with for examlpe an emanage, it uses the airflow meter as its baseline, and it modifies this signal. The problem is for example at 30% throttle you cam be under boost adding say 20% fuel, but at 32% throttle the airf low meter base value can vary greatly and the car can go from runing a nice 12.5 : 1 under boost all fo a sudden to a 10.0 : 1.

I found on my car with some data logging at a track, that the airfuel ratio wsa varying under boost at middle throttle positions anywhere from 10.0 - to 15.0 : 1 and detonating.

On the dyno you can't simulat this because the piggy back does not have enough adjustment to find all these minor points.

To clarify the emanage and equivelent units work perfect on 100% throttle never had a problem at the drags. BUt for any other type of racing, where you get varying throttle positions between boost and off boost, the air fuel ratio just goes widly from one end to the other.

This is why RPW will no longer tune any mitsbuishi with an airflow meter with a forced induction setup unless its with a full EMS system, even piggybacked to only control fuel/igntiion.

Our magna has for the last year and a half been running a Haltech E11 plug and play ecu package and i have picked up fuel econony, reliability and no more probles. You could not even tell its has an aftermarket ECU.

Hope this explains a few things.

wow... ok cheers mitsiman... its scary that you swore by the emanage and told us all how brilliant it is even for boosted applications.. (hence the reason i bought one).. turns out its not so good..

We all keep learning - none of my tuners (Before I started doing our own tuning) told me about it either. I had to learn the hard way and it wasn't till I started doing some in depth data logging as well as my own tuning that I really found the answers out.

The scary thing is that if you spoke with most tuners, they would not be aware of this incompatiblilty. It took quite a bit of research before i worked it all out myself.

We all keep learning - none of my tuners (Before I started doing our own tuning) told me about it either. I had to learn the hard way and it wasn't till I started doing some in depth data logging as well as my own tuning that I really found the answers out.

The scary thing is that if you spoke with most tuners, they would not be aware of this incompatiblilty. It took quite a bit of research before i worked it all out myself.

yeh fair call.. well glad its you find this out not us :D
appreciate the info dave, thanks

might have to trade the emanage in for something better if i do decide to run a s/c or whatever

Congtats mitsiman on your reasearch. Well spoken and thanks for sharing the info. It will save alot of heartache and dollars for many members here on the forum if they have already taken the Forced Induction or anticipating going this way.

Let make this info a sticky.....

Regards

Some good information there Mitsiman. Whats the rpw magna up to now?

The RPW Magna is being enjoyed again as a every day driving car. The new Quaife LSD is just so nice to drive with - its become a pure pleasure to drive the car around. Our magna has been taken as far as we ever plan to take it at this stage - light competition and normal daily driver.

Some good points on the Emanage, precisely why it is not being offered for the Raptor system, rather the Moristech which take total control of fuel and ignition with its own driver set for the injectors. All the rest are just signal benders which in turn become engine benders :)

OK here are some pics of the donor engine, we haven't purchased it yet, putting it up for comment if there is any.

A special thankyou to EZboy and Bigs for their image contributions.

Actually having read up on the Moristech ECU, its basically the same as part of an emanage.

The moristech is simply altering the output side of the factory ECU, on the injector and ignition pulse, the same system that the greddy emanage does on its additional injector and ignition outputs.

This has the exact same problem because you are adding/deducting fuel / ignition from the factory settings Ie the factory ecu decids to feed say 5ms of injector timing and you add another 2ms.

The problem with this is that you are still working on the factory ECU fuel curve decisions and altering them which are being based on an air flow meter principle.

The emanage has the same setup in its additional injection map.

Unforutnalty the only real way this is ever going to work, the cheapest way is to cut the injector and ignition wires, and have a full EMS system working as a partial piggy back and controlling fuel and ignition independatly of the factory ECU.

Any piggy back that works in conjunction whether its on the input or output side of the factory ecu, is still going to have the same issues.

Dave

Got a suggestion for you, ring the fellow at Moristech and cross question him, then report back to here. I can't remember his name right this moment, he is good to talk to and will make clear anything you need to know about Moristech and how it works.

We have used this ECU before and there is no resemblence it its mode of operation to the other systems. It has brought reliability into tuning for unusual ECU systems where nothing else will work because it takes total control of ig and fuel.

How does the haltech e6x rate up to a Moristech? Its not going into a magna

how much are you's paying for that engine ???

i seen a full working car today goin for $2800

I spoke with someone at Moristech and confirmed as I beleived. To qoute from there own website

"Moristech interceptors stand apart from most other piggy back computers because fuel mixture is modified by intercepting the actual fuel injector pulse signal, not by modifying Airflow meter or MAP sensor signals."

They are still intercepting the factory ECU injector pulses, the same as the additional injection maps as per the Greddy Emanage. It is a better setup for a forced induciton car because you can then use larger injectors, but same issues are involved with an air flow meter car.

This still adds a set injection time according to its own conditions, to the factory injection time. As a result, if the factory ecu varies its injection time under the same boost conditions which it will do according to throttle position values, then you have the same problem with varying air/fuel ratio's.

At this stage, unfortunatly, I still don't have an answer for anyone in this situation other than a full ems system, even if you just at piggy back it into the factory wiring harness and control fuel/ignition only and take over that function only.

I might sound like a total n00b here Dave, but would the problem be as bad with a supercharger? Because of the (relatively) stable boost applied and maintained, as compared to a turbo setup, where boost pressure is constantly changing?

i thought with the supercharger used in this application it is one that gains boost with rev's not just a constant one

A positive displacement supercharger maybe slightly better, but ultimatly no because you can still end up running say 5 psi boost at 2500 rpm for example, but this can be acheived at say 25, 50 or 100% throttle. The problem is that the air flow meter distinguishes different air flows and hence, different injector values at these positions, where tuning under a MAP / Boost mode does not distinguish these different relative air flow positions.

MAP sensor tuning is tuned purely under pressure/vacuem levels and compensates for it at rpm points which works very well.

But airflow meter is on airflow volume, not pressure, hence the complete mismatch of designs

So let me get this straight. David, you are saying that, based on your experience, anyone driving around in a forced induction magna, with a tune reliant on the factory MAF sensor (so anything other than a full replacement ECU with MAP sensor) is going to dramatically reduce the life of their engine (unless they drive around at full throttle all the time)?

Thats great news........ :doubt:

So let me get this straight. David, you are saying that, based on your experience, anyone driving around in a forced induction magna, with a tune reliant on the factory MAF sensor (so anything other than a full replacement ECU with MAP sensor) is going to dramatically reduce the life of their engine (unless they drive around at full throttle all the time)?

Thats great news........ :doubt:
Stop being emo and floor it mate! haahah.. Pedal to the Metal ftw~!

Stop being emo and floor it mate! haahah.. Pedal to the Metal ftw~!

Hmmmmmm break my engine or break my LSD (yes it still axle tramps if I floor it in 1st and 2nd). Decisions, decisions.....

I gather you spoke with Daniel?

OK, we have used MORISTECH on the 1UZ Toyota V8 in exactly the same manner as we plan to set it up on the Magna, and that is a MAF metered air system but with MORISTECH looking at pressure via a MAP sensor and controlling injectors etc from there. This does actually work and would be happy to demonstrate to anyone who cares to see it.

I do have experience with boosting Mitsubishi's using no MAP sensor at all, tuned only through the MAF, results were spectacular and reliable with excellent fuel economy. The secret there is that the (centrifugal) supercharger will only have a given pressure at a given speed (for which a given fuel value can be written), all throttle position can do is reduce pressure it if closed less, this is ultra easy to tune for ...... if you don't believe me then just stand by and watch us do it. Done it before will do it again.

Froggi and Meh you are understanding correctly

Turbocharging is a total different ball game (know about that too)................. very difficult to tune for by comparison if cost is taken into account.

Froggi and Meh you are understanding correctly



hehe im not interested in all the piggy back stuff... i already got my haltec installed with no MAF so i just need the S/C and brackets to bolt it up :D

I've been secretly interesting in a centrifugal application due to the stability of boost generation and hence more reliable tunability. Gears, belts, and compressor wheel tip speed are all fixed at the same rpm and the boost results can be readily, and consistently repeated for the purpose of tuning and then of course, while driving.

I look forward to an in-depth discussion on boosted tuning for the Magna - seems it's brewing :cool:

I'm not saying that your going to blow your car up with it - but if you took the car say to a track day round a race track, thats when you would definilty notice some problems with the tuning.

I can't comment specifically on a centrifigul supercharger setup myself, not having tuned one. But as a matter of general course, I would still not trust an emanage/moristech/haltech /exede etc piggy back system with any forced induction setup that intercepts on the inlet/outlet side of a factory ecu. But thats a commercial decision we made at RPW so that we don't become responsible for damaged engines after tuning them.

You can work around it to a degree, but ultimatly in my eye's its a gamble where for slightly more money you can install a Haltech E6X as a partial piggy back and have complete reliability.

Also remember that no piggy back has any compensation factors for air tempature, ignition maps for air tempature etc for a boosted car. These are all the little things that ensure reliability with any tuning especialy on a magna which reads air tempature at the MAF unit, not anywhere near the the throttle body after its been heated and cooled down if used with a intercooler

OK next step here

Dave, put up the options for the MAGNA's owners considering boosting and the cost of each RPW HALTECH option.

They can make their choices then based on cost, outcomes etc.

I will happily provide boosting hardware without a tuning solution, if I delete the Moristech out (for those wanting a HALTECH option from RPW) it will make approx $850 difference to kit price no matter what kit end price is.

All camps should be happy

OK next step here

Dave, put up the options for the MAGNA's owners considering boosting and the cost of each RPW HALTECH option.

They can make their choices then based on cost, outcomes etc.

I will happily provide boosting hardware without a tuning solution, if I delete the Moristech out (for those wanting a HALTECH option from RPW) it will make approx $850 difference to kit price no matter what kit end price is.

All camps should be happy

ECU issues aside, I think you are doing the right thing by giving your customers the ability to customise the kit to suit their needs / wants. It was this lack of flexibility which ultimately led me to steer clear of another manufacturers supercharger.

You can work around it to a degree, but ultimatly in my eye's its a gamble where for slightly more money you can install a Haltech E6X as a partial piggy back and have complete reliability.


Good to see a positive wrap on the e6x as I just bought one.

I can't give prices as they will just be deleted anyway but options here it goes

(A) Haltech E6X as a partial piggy back setup controlling fuel and injection only - really only option for automatic customers and can be done this way for manuel owners as well.
(B) Haltech E6X plug and play package developed by RPW for Manuel owners controls all factory options

The above will run the factory distributor / semi sequential injection for most people. Duel mapping is an option with launch control depending upon setup. Has an inbuilt 2.5 BAR map sensor on the unit.

The next step is the haltech E8 and E11 packages if you are going to go like my magna and move up to replace the distributor with a triple duel spark coil setup for stronger spark and better ignition timing control as with the distributor you can run into issues if you are retarding a lot of ignition timing with the location of a rotor button position relative to the ignition lead posts.

The E8 will allow semi sequential waste spark injectoin / ignition and has more advanced idle speed control, wide band O2 sensor input and fuel control, data logging, programmable rpm points etc. Much much more advanced and with the right tuner, will make more power and smoother torque curve due to having more mapping points.

The E11 as I run on my magna allows full sequential injection and possibility of sequential/waste spark ignition and everything else the E8 does but with a lot more inputs/outputs allowing multiple things like duel maping, launch control, aux rpm limiters etc to be all run without compromise.

Hmm oh yeh - both E8 and E11 also available as plug and play for manuels.

Thats about it from a techinical point, prices wise most are already listed on our website.

thanks mitsiman.. so if someone had an e6x short kit (ECU Programmable Computer, Programming Cable, Short Wire Harness OR Patch Loom) what else would be needed to use in a boosted application?

The only thing left would be purchasing a Haltech air tempature switch and you have got everything you need.

The only thing left would be purchasing a Haltech air tempature switch and you have got everything you need.

sweet as..

well i dunno why they wont let you put your prices up here, seems crazy as it means users have to go to your site (good for you) which in turn helps you promote more product.. but neway, ill check out your site now for your prices..once again thanks for your great info..

thanks mitsiman.. so if someone had an e6x short kit (ECU Programmable Computer, Programming Cable, Short Wire Harness OR Patch Loom) what else would be needed to use in a boosted application?

the e6x can run a MAP sensor too. Mine is. It'd free up alot of ponies in a boosted ap.

Also if RPW is too tight to be a site sponsor they shouldn't be able to advertise. I've seen the sponsor costs and they're not expensive.

the e6x can run a MAP sensor too. Mine is. It'd free up alot of ponies in a boosted ap.

Also if RPW is too tight to be a site sponsor they shouldn't be able to advertise. I've seen the sponsor costs and they're not expensive.
hahah.. isn't it like 30 bucks a year!?!

the e6x can run a MAP sensor too. Mine is. It'd free up alot of ponies in a boosted ap..

im confused.. i thought dave was saying its bad to attempt to tune a boosted magna with the MAF sensor still in place.. so i would have thought this would make the MAP sensor a must, not an option??

i get what your saying about RPW not being a sponsor. but surely dave's knowledge must be worth something to ppl... he doesnt have to sit here in his own time and explain all the above to us.. especially when alot of us dont plan to buy anything from him.. maybe me members should be donating for reasons like this (including me :redface: ) neway, enough of that..

Why doesnt he just become a sponsor? Surely the past can be buried, its not like nobody buys his product from here, I would expect a great deal of his customers are members here. But keep all the info coming from both of you.

im confused.. i thought dave was saying its bad to attempt to tune a boosted magna with the MAF sensor still in place.. so i would have thought this would make the MAP sensor a must, not an option??

oh yeah i get it, nah you could tune the MAF with an e6x but i don't see why you would when you could buy the MAP sensor for like 100$ extra.

Hey there Tim, Mate just went to email you but for some unkown reason my server is rejectin your address grrrr, might have something to do with the Marriott connection I dunno... Anyways I have just arrived back into Australia and wanted to know how the motor is coming along.... are we any closer ??...

Well it has to be said we are slower than the wet week we have just had.

Will get down to the wrecker ASAP and have engine delivered. From there I will get the dummy blower (used for set up) on there ASAP, I will put up some pictures but beyond that I may not until its a done setup.

Will see how it goes.

Damo, email working well my end .......

Just don't copy the RIPP kit's belt tensioner - it never tensioned. Lots of annoyed customers.

We will be clean sheeting this job, I can only ever remember looking at some 4G94 stuff there but never for the V6.

There shall be tension and if at all possible the basic parts of the system will be DIY friendly jut like our Holden kits.

Well it has to be said we are slower than the wet week we have just had.

Will get down to the wrecker ASAP and have engine delivered. From there I will get the dummy blower (used for set up) on there ASAP, I will put up some pictures but beyond that I may not until its a done setup.

Will see how it goes.

Damo, email working well my end .......

sweet as sounds like all moving forward...:D... Ill be back in town Friday 25th May....

yeah mate the email this end wont send, its got something to do with the Mariott's server...All good thou I'll just send emails when i get back home

We will be clean sheeting this job, I can only ever remember looking at some 4G94 stuff there but never for the V6.

There shall be tension and if at all possible the basic parts of the system will be DIY friendly jut like our Holden kits.

We'd luv to see some pics of the Holden or other kits posted here for our visual stimulation. :D

Here are some pics of the RIPP kit for the eclipse etc.

just a quick question.
will it fit with the battery inplace or is that goin to have to move ??

The Magna engine will arrive for beginning of development this coming Tuesday, stand by for details as work goes forward

awsome. what engine did you get? 3L or 3.5?

awsome. what engine did you get? 3L or 3.5?

i believe they got a 3L

We'd luv to see some pics of the Holden or other kits posted here for our visual stimulation. :D

Here are some pics of the RIPP kit for the eclipse etc.


That eclipse manifold is sexy as!!! i want one, or a mirror of the standard inlet on the 3rd gen.

OK there is a few for you all

Holden VS with Raptor V

BF Falcon with Raptor V

Should be Lancer with Raptor V

308 Ferrai with Raptor V

What sort of figures is the configuration making on each different engine?

Holden VS with Raptor V = 188 - 230 rwkw ( 3.8 litre)

BF Falcon with Raptor V = 200 rwkw (4.0 litre

Should be Lancer with Raptor V = 134 fwkw (1.8 litre) f=front :D

308 Ferrai with Raptor V = 215 rwkw (3 litre)

Holden VS with Raptor V = 188 - 230 rwkw ( 3.8 litre)

BF Falcon with Raptor V = 200 rwkw (4.0 litre

Should be Lancer with Raptor V = 134 fwkw (1.8 litre) f=front :D

308 Ferrai with Raptor V = 215 rwkw (3 litre)

Hard to imagine the doughy 2valve buick V6 making more than the 4valve ford 6. Intercooled maybe or more boost.

What boost are these figures made on? Autos or manuals.

Hard to imagine the doughy 2valve buick V6 making more than the 4valve ford 6. Intercooled maybe or more boost.

What boost are these figures made on? Autos or manuals.

VS was ecotec wasnt it? Wasnt the buick stopped in the VR?
Thats what i thought, i dunno, not much of a holden guy

']VS was ecotec wasnt it? Wasnt the buick stopped in the VR?
Thats what i thought, i dunno, not much of a holden guy

Same thing I thought? Just revised with each model?